This is why we should bring back the death penalty

[bluewanda]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14918815/drug-addicted-cross-dresser-abused-lover-murder-son-hospital-ward.html

(One example of many.)

We already pay people to kill people, they're called the Armed Forces.

You’ve still missed the point 🥴

I was answering this:

And not one person here has answered why the ones caught red handed can’t be executed, they keep coming back to “they could be innocent” 🤦🏻‍♀️ and “we live in a civilised country” yeah right cause we do. With its two tier system

To reiterate, those 'caught red handed' are not executed because of possible miscarriages of justice and because the death penalty is considered a form of torture.

Could you explain how I'm missing the point?

Well if you want a child murderer and rapist to live you must know why surely? Other than ‘I don’t have the stomach for it”.

@MiloMinderbinder925 Fred/Rose West, Priklopil there’s no possible miscarriage here is there?

@ilovesooty They were children- the one is now an adult. What value does he bring to anyone?

Red handed means they did it. Theres no miscarriage of justice. What are you not getting?

Why should the scumbag who murdered an innocent baby get to live when his victim didn’t?

I guess it depends what we call "living", @bluewanda

Ideally I'd like to see such offenders locked up for life with no possibility of parole ever, and preferably in the sort of facility which would minimise the amount we had to spend on their incarceration

I recognise, however, that the bleeding hearts have ensured this happens all too rarely, so we get calls for the death penalty instead - which is something I'll never agree with

I see. What you're suggesting is that the death penalty isn't applied in every grevious case but now and again, when we're 'sure'. Do you think that's feasible?

I do know why. And it’s nothing to do with having the stomach for it. It’s because a civilized society does not kill people. And anyone who wants to do the killing is by definition somebody who should not be allowed to do it.

Then what do they do? Apologies pressed too soon. Do you think locking them up in a cage forever is acceptable?
What do you do with the likes of venables? Who will keep reoffending.

We would need a budget available for a facility like that. And staff.

none of which the MOJ have. Waaaay down the list of our governments priorities

I'll explain a bit more. There have been several cases in the UK where corrupt police have faked statements and evidence. Those convictions may have resulted in the death penalty if we had it. Everyone believed they were 100% guilty. In fact, I think the judge in the Birmingham Six case, said he would have given the death penalty.

There's also the problem with people getting carried away during a particularly egregious case and of course, the fact that the death penalty is considered a form of torture.

I hope that clarifies things for you.

Here's an idea.

We reintroduce the death penalty.

In the event of a miscarriage of justice, the people responsible for that murder of an innocent person are put on trial. So, the lead investigation officer, the prosecution lawyer, the judge and the foreperson of the jury.

It's cut and dried that they are responsible. In fact, it's documented in court proceedings. No possibility of that being wrong. So they all hang.

I can't see how anyone could object to that, because we're suggesting that there will never be any miscarriages of justice. I'm sure all involved would be quite happy for my proposition to be adopted.

Where did I provide a sample size of 10?

Yes, we should look deeper into evidence, on that we agree. It’s just that, I have done that and you think that your opinion trumps it.

i don’t think you’ve asked me anything about Singapore before, but I’ll try to answer. It’s quite difficult to compare Eastern and Western nations because the cultural and economic differences are vast. Singapore is a wealthy nation and a tiny population. It has very strict legal and social rules about all kinds of misdemeanours and behaviours considered antisocial. Chewing gum is banned, failure to flush a public toilet carries a fine etc. We are a more lenient nation which brings more likelihood of rule breaking - and acceptance of it - but also a whole bunch of good stuff.

You lock them up forever.

I know, YouWillFindMeInTheGarden, but that doesn't change the fact that it could be made a priority if the will was there

Unfortunately, at least for now, it isn't and so we get these dreadful cases which rarely result in any really significant sentencing, and the calls for the return of capital punishment go hand in hand with that

Not really. Talking about Fred /rose west, Venables, Priklopil. Where do they fit in? They’re extraordinary cases that should be dealt with accordingly.

It clarifys nothing. I’ll say it again. Southport killer, Lee rigby, this case of the baby. Rose and Fred west. James bulgers killers etc etc, 10000% done it. No fake statements, no corrupt police, just plain evil killers. There’s no miscarriage of justice to be had because they were caught red handed. No “who done it”
those are the people that should be given the death penalty.

Can you give an example of this two tier system?

Why?
Define what that means, tv, daytrips, steak and holidays. Or bread and water?

If the government start wasting our money on satisfying a minority of people’s bloodlust rather than investing in education and social care, are you really saying you’d be happy with that?

You think social services could’ve helped Fred West?

That's not how the justice system works. If the death penalty is law, it doesn't just apply to 'extraordinary cases' and is hardly likely to remain that way if it was reintroduced. Secondly, the death penalty is considered torture and we aren't in favour of it in the UK.

You can't just cherry pick cases and apply the death penalty to them.

People in prison don’t get day trips, steak and holidays. Looked up forever means locked up forever. Which bit don’t you understand?

I've clarified why the death penalty isn't law. 1. Potential for miscarriage of justice. 2. It's considered torture.

You can't cherry pick cases and demand the death penalty. That's not how the justice system works. The law would apply to everyone.

They have friendships and relationships, they have hobbies/interests, they have support to apply for an appeal. They have a life.