To think there are very few allies against Anti-Semitism?

[Longingdreamer]

This month, I have had experienced Anti-Semitism twice. Both times I was with my children.

Both times, my children were distressed, and no one around did anything to protect us or raise the alarm. When we asked for help, we were dismissed. We were in very busy public spaces both times: a tube platform, then a high street.

I reported the first episode to the police. I'm not even sure if it's worth reporting the second episode. Sadly it feels so mainstream, and the authorities are not supportive when I report it either.

Yes, this is very true. The attitude was one of dismissal, rather than care. My children and I were visibly distressed, with the children crying. You would think that the normal reaction would be one of care and compassion, but sadly that is only available to certain people nowadays. Jews don't count.

Really- how dare you. I bet you wouldn’t say that to a black person saying they had experienced racism.

Reading David Baddiel's book "Jews Don't Count" was an eye opener for me, and sadly in the last couple of years I've seen too much evidence of it.

People do say it all the time to black people though - accusing them of “playing the race card”, all lives matter etc. don’t pretend that racism against black people is taken seriously.

Do people say that racism against black people is falsely reported? I have never heard anyone say that.

Yet, there has been at least one person who says they disbelieve the documented cases of Anti-Semitism in this country.

You are completely incorrect in your statement that the majority of Jews aren’t Zionist. Do you understand the meaning of Zionism?

Yes, but many of the same people who would object to allegations of "playing the race card" in most other contexts are those who perpetuate and dismiss anti-semitism.

I don't think your experience is unique to anti-Semitism.

People ignore all sorts of horrible things on the streets every day. Muggings, racism, kids getting verbally abused by their parents. People don't want to get involved. We've all heard horror stories of wannabee heroes who step in and then are met with horrific consequences.

It's easy to say that you'd step in if you saw XYZ when posting from the comfort of your own home. But out on the street when a thug is being abusive? Not so easy to do in reality.

Not sure why you're making this about anti-Semitism. It's a society in general thing.

It's about Anti-Semitism, because this is what I have experienced. Can you not have compassion?

Disturbingly, I have experienced this twice in a month. Do you not see the issue with this?

Racism against other minorities neither excuses nor justifies antisemitism. It’s all wrong.

The problem across society, though, is that antisemitism is felt as ‘not really racism’. The Palestinian flag wavers promote that obnoxious view. And there are a lot more bigoted flag wavers than outright skinhead racists, all of them too quick to deny their prejudices.

British Left wing people generally don't.

I do genuinely think it arose by accident rather than malice, but when British left wing people use the word "Zionist" they mean only a relatively small cohort of Zionists - those who support the expansion of Israel's borders. I don't think most of them realize that, when they (for example) that "Zionists are evil", they are attacking the majority of Jews and arguably are expressing support for ethnic cleansing.

I'm sorry this happened to you, it's disgusting. Unfortunately there are some very stupid and ignorant people around. As pp said, in a big city like London, people tend to look the other way. In a smaller town like I live in, I can't see it being ignored. I would certainly not stand by and say nothing.

It depends. There doesn’t seem to be an agreed upon definition for anti semitism but I am very sorry, criticism of Israel (without saying that all Jews are responsible for Israel or such nonsense) is very much not antisemitism. It’s no different criticising Israel to criticising Russia or China or Afghanistan. And there are some people who do view that as antisemitic.

In terms of general prejudice against Jews then yes that is racist and it is wrong. So are things like downplaying the Holocaust, holding all Jews responsible for Israel and conspiracy theories about Jews.

I would not agree that being Jewish is more dangerous than any other minority in this country. That is not borne out by crime statistics or general attitudes. There is more hatred towards other groups.

What happened to the OP on the tube was wrong and I hope she complains and reports to the police.

I agree, the danger is from the left at present, and no longer the right.

All racism is wrong and should be taken seriously. Sadly it is not, when Jews are the victims.

How did they know you were Jewish?

Because we look Jewish. I will not get into how we look Jewish, because that doesn't matter, and I fear could fuel further Anti-Semitism.

Would you say this to any other minority who experienced racism? I find this line of questioning very unpleasant.

I agree to an extent but I know Russians who felt targeted and prejudiced against when people were displaying Ukrainian flags and expressing support for Ukraine. There was a lot of prejudice against Russians at the time. I do think some use the Palestinian flag as an excuse to be antisemitic but Israel’s actions are terrible so of course people will show solidarity, just as they have done with other atrocities.

Without more details of the incident no-one can really say if YABU or not or if people should have intervened. I have seen homophobic abuse in public and no-one stepped forward to do/say anything. And I know that friends have experienced racist abuse and no-one intervened.
People
are in their own worlds a lot of the time, esp. in big cities or they don’t want to get involved for fear of their own safety. Just the way it is.

I agree that criticism of Israel does not equate to antisemitism.

People could (and should) validly criticise many an action over the Israeli government, particularly in the present moment.

But my experience is that many self-professed anti-racists do not restrict their criticism to the Israeli government but, instead, routinely slur Jews as a whole, call for Israel's destruction, and/or casually adopt the rhetoric of genocide and ethnic cleansing. Then they do the "you cant say nuffin anymore" bit, that they usually object to in other contexts.

Russia is not the sole homeland of an ethnic group. An ethnic group that had suffered the Holocaust, a real genocide.

Not even mildly comparable.

I agree with the posters saying ‘antisemitism’ is being overused at the moment - mainly by supporters of Israel’s genocide against the Palestinian people. Criticising the brutal actions of the Israel government is not anti semitic - just human.
all discrimination whether it’s racist or homophobic or actual antisemitism is obvs not okay, but I’m not sure most people would step in to help strangers unless it was a really serious situation whichever bigotry was on display.
just report and keep reporting. There not much else to be done after the fact unfortunately

I hate all racism. I'm just curious because I have never knowingly seen a Jewish person out and about so I'm just wondering what I'm not seeing

Yes I do agree with that actually. I fully agree that some people are using it as an excuse to display their antisemitism.

I grew up not really understanding the notion of antisemitism. To my knowledge I didn’t really know any Jews and I found it so strange the level of hatred Nazi Germany had expressed towards them. When I was at university I had a friend and I went on a night out with her and she suddenly started raging about how she despised a group of people on our course because they were Jews and thought they were better than everyone else. She claimed that during the first term they’d asked her her surname and looked at her in disgust when it wasn’t a Jewish one. Whereas to me I hadn’t even realised or thought about the fact that they were Jews (partly due to my ignorance of traditional Jewish names etc). I’d never had the impression that they thought they were better than anyone but I remember how vitriolic that girl was and it really scared me. We stopped being friends.

I also experienced someone saying they were on a train with some ultra Orthodox Jews in traditional dress and that it gave her the rage. Literally them existing gave her the rage because she said their clothes were stupid.

So i definitely believe it exists. But I also support people’s right to critique a corrupt government. Just as I’d never take offence at someone criticising the UK government and I don’t imagine most Americans get angry about Trump being criticised.

@TaupeLemur

These two things are both true:

(A) Israel can be quick to deflect legitimate criticism as antisemetic.

(B) antisemetic language and attitudes are rampant among the British left, and this is widely denied.

(B)'s prevelance makes it hard to tackle (A).

And @OP. Sorry this is becoming yet another Israel/Palestine thread but it feels unavoidable. For what it's worth: I have inadvertently participated in anti-semtism in the past, thinking I was participating in social justice. I was ignorant and I apologize. It wasn't until Corbyn that I started to realize the issue and, even then, its taken me many years to get to the point where I feel significantly knowledgeable and have mustered significant courage to challenge anti-semitism among my (otherwise) politically-like minded friends.

I hear your experience, I am trying to do the work, and I'm sorry that it took me so long.