To think there are very few allies against Anti-Semitism?

[Longingdreamer]

This month, I have had experienced Anti-Semitism twice. Both times I was with my children.

Both times, my children were distressed, and no one around did anything to protect us or raise the alarm. When we asked for help, we were dismissed. We were in very busy public spaces both times: a tube platform, then a high street.

I reported the first episode to the police. I'm not even sure if it's worth reporting the second episode. Sadly it feels so mainstream, and the authorities are not supportive when I report it either.

@PenelopePennyDrop Most decent people are fed up of the genocide in Gaza, which is caused by Hamas, so nothing to do with the Jewish people.

There seem to be some crossed wires on this thread. The above post was the first to mention Gaza. Someone then posted, "I am outraged by the genocide in Gaza but not anti-Semitic in the slightest."

Cue all the posts asking why Gaza had been mentioned and that it was anti-Semitic to bring Gaza into this...

Anyway OP, I think it's appalling that the London Underground staff didn't do anything to help after death threats were made to you. I think they should have led you to a safe (or at least, safer) place to wait while they phoned the police. I would definitely complain.

This should apply to death threats made to anyone, for any reason. You don't just ask the victims to leave alongside the perpetrators!

Very little about what, the ongoing scapegoating of Jewish people over the last thousand odd years including repeated explanations from countries such as ours. The fact that a large proportion of modern conspiracy theories are just rebranded anti Semitic tropes. The total balls up by the British government when creating the Israeli state without considering the people there already as colonists never see native populations as human humans.
The fact that Israel was largely created as the Western allies didn't want Jewish refugees to settle and wanted to wash their hands off the problem and abandoning the he who moved there to be attacked by their new neighbours leading to constant tension in the area and an increasingly right wing government.
And that's just the beginning! Which bit am I ignorant of here?

We were in physical danger, which I had made clear, a large group was making threats to our life. I communicated this, and that they were in the vicinity. I was holding two children so couldn't physically call the police at that point. If I was taken into a safe space I could have put them down and done so. This is available in tube stations.

Do you really think that telling us to leave, and sending us into the path of the perpetrators was acceptable?

We were discussing the definition of Zionism. I am quite confused as to what you are now going on about

I’m very sorry you went through this. You cannot rely on anyone else to call the police. TfL staff won’t do anything (I’d argue they secretly side with the wankers). Call British Transport Police on 999. No ifs, no buts. You must do it yourself if you believe yourself, and your children to be in danger - and I’d argue with anti-semitism, you are as you don’t know how it’ll escalate.

Please also ensure you’re able to protect yourself, and your children should it escalate. Try not to goad them back, they will do it enough to get a reaction, and in turn goad themselves.

Self-defence is a much needed skill.

Which bit is incorrect, the modern Zionist movement claims that that their right to Israel is because they are the chosen people and that God promised them the land.

Fortunately I found a police officer outside. You are right, Tfl staff will not help.

I didn't want to hang around in public calling 999 either as I wasn't safe to do so. It wasn't safe to put my children down with the perpetrators in the vicinity.

My primary ask was to have somewhere safe to go. That was denied.

Jews have always existed there

It was a response to @Flushmush

Being the victim of racist threats is bad enough, but I'm genuinely shocked at the staff not helping you. I hope that the staff get disciplined.

You're wrong the vast majority of Jews ARE zionist. Which just means the state of Israel has a right to exist. ONE single Jewish state in the world. Compared to 57 Islamic states.

I have made a complaint, but so far Tfl is defending their actions. The rot has really spread to the top. Trust me, I will follow this up as far as I can.

As have many people and they used to coexist in harmony so I really don't see what point you are making

Any kind of racist abuse should not be acceptable imo. For your actual life to be threaten is indeed abhorrent.

I wonder if classifications needs to be made? Not that it would help with you reporting abuse or not but I learned on here that semites include Arabs but anti-semitism these days seem to only refer to Jewish hate?

Would TfL refuse to help if a woman was followed onto a night train by her stalker or an abusive ex?

What about a teenage boy who found himself in the same carriage as rival gang members, who threatened to kill him?

Is TfL arguing that they have no duty of care in such scenarios?

Good 👍. I really hope that you get a good outcome. The increase in antisemitism has shocked me, but also how far people will go to minimise it.

That’s awful. Especially when you had your children there. You must have felt really unsafe. I’m sorry.X

Sorry that happened to you and your kids. I am surprised tbh. I would maybe not be surprised at the lack of intervention if it was teenage boys saying stuff to other teenage boys or something. But it would be more extraordinary to witness a mother and children being abused.

I think many black people don’t bother reporting it. It’s seen as ‘normal’ and almost expected, which is horrifying. It’s all depressing. We should challenge antisemitism and all racism.

That’s quite different isn’t it though. In one case you’re saying you hate/disapprove of particular action, eg the Holocaust and Third Reich or the actions of Israel in Palestine. In the other you’re saying you randomly hate a group of people due to their race/religion.

So it’s fine to say I hate the actions of the Catholic Church in covering up child abuse. But not so much to say I hate all catholics.

And why is it a problem to condemn one country acting atrociously, eg Israel but not another, eg Russia?

I think anti-semitism lurks constantly and needs very little provocation to flare up. For example, when Corbyn was leader of Labour my Twitter feed filled with antisemitic content and the died down again - but I don’t believe it went away. Just today my family was talking about the atrocities in Gaza and my father commented that Netanyahu was ensuring that Jewish people worldwide would face horrific anti-semitism for years to come. A provocation to cause dormant existing hatred to flare up again. I’m sorry for your experience. It’s awful and unjust. The irony is that whenever I see it - as appalled as I am by what’s happening in Gaza - I feel I can understand why Jewish people feel they need a ‘safe place’.

I did stand up for you OP. When Corbyn allowed anti-Semitism to run unchecked through Labour I stopped voting for Labour until it was addressed. I was appalled at those who saw the anti-semitism and still voted Labour. Again, it made me think that hatred against Jewish people was tolerated or ignored.

I don't know. Maybe someone who has worked there can clarify? I naively thought they were obliged to help, but it seems not.

I think part of the problem is that acts of solidarity with Palestine, like wearing a keffiyeh or taking part in peaceful protest, are inaccurately labelled by some as being anti-Semitic, which creates more fear and division and dilutes the importance of genuine issues of racism.

I have worn a keffiyeh from time to time for over 50 years, but I didn't wear it at all last winter, for that very reason.

I got my first one when my BF passed his motorbike test and I started going on the back of his bike. They were popular with bikers, being soft, warm and washable, and it was probably decades before I realised they were Arab in origin.