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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Nurse said something strange about breastfed babies

308 replies

Chocolateegg123 · 23/07/2025 19:14

My 8 week old had her jabs today. The nurse at my GP surgery was taking an awfully long time getting down to business and kept faffing around such as explaining how to use a syringe for the calpol for about ten minutes. Then, she asked me if I was breastfeeding and when I answered yes, she asked how it was going.

I was honest and explained I’d found it hard and we had to combi feed etc but that my mental health had been really awful whilst breastfeeding and so I have considered moving over to formula.

She then completely matter of factly stated… “breastfed babies are more intelligent so if you can continue feeding her your milk you should.”

I was kind of taken a back as I didn’t think this was true but also is this kind of advice ok for a health professional to give? Whenever I have gone to a local breastfeeding clinic or spoken to a professional about my struggles they have never ever said anything like this?

I guess I want to know if I would be unreasonable to complain about this nurse? She has been unprofessional in the past when I went to have a vaccine during pregnancy and now this. However - is it true that breastfed babies are more intelligent? This has added to my guilt and anxiety over my breastfeeding journey now. Help!

OP posts:
Thread gallery
8
Didshejustsaythatoutloud · 24/07/2025 19:43

Dominoeffecter · 23/07/2025 19:15

That’s incredibly inappropriate of her and not even true, don’t listen to her, mine are totally thick and they were all breastfed 🤭

😂

Nomdejeur · 24/07/2025 19:47

Dominoeffecter · 23/07/2025 19:15

That’s incredibly inappropriate of her and not even true, don’t listen to her, mine are totally thick and they were all breastfed 🤭

Creased me 😂

TunnocksOrDeath · 24/07/2025 19:56

Early studies "showed" that breastfed babies were more intelligent later on, but they had not corrected for heritable and environmental factors which affect intelligence and also correlate to how likely it is for a mother to breastfeed their child. One you correct for those there is bugger-all difference in intelligence between breastfed and formula fed babies.
Your nurse needs to bring herself up to date with the research.

WhereIsMyJumper · 24/07/2025 20:01

I mean, she was clearly talking out of her arse and I think you know this already. But you’re going to need to develop a thicker skin OP. Just ignore and move on.

DinosandRegrets678 · 24/07/2025 20:15

ButteredRadish · 24/07/2025 18:29

Absolute nonsense! If anything, it’s worse to breastfeed as breastfed babies need Vitamin D supplements due to most mothers being Vitamin D deficient (as almost all adults in the UK are, so that’s not surprising). Breast milk can also be deficient in quite a bit, depending on what the mother is deficient in. However formula is nutritionally complete. This is one reason why formula fed babies often sleep better (not always the case, obviously).
Please, please put a complaint in. She’s spreading harmful misinformation and in doing so, is shaming mums who can’t breastfeed. She needs to be stopped.

This is complete nonsense. Firstly, the vitamin D supplements are needed because we are now advised to not expose babies to direct sunlight until 6 months. So if you don't expose them to the sun, there is no vitamin D. No one makes vitamin D, we all get it from the sun, diet or from supplements.

Breastmilk content does not depend on the mother's diet at all. IF mum is deficient in anything (like calcium), the small quantities that the baby needs are taken first anyway.

Formula babies sleep longer because formula is harder to digest and you can also force more formula into them (whereas with breastfeeding you can't overfeed, baby has to actively suck and takes only what it wants). It's also why they are at higher risk of SIDS because they go into a longer deeper sleep than breastfed babies which from an evolutionary standpoint is not actually great.

To say that formula is better for babies is marketing from the 1960s and has been debunked by modern studies over and over.

okydokethen · 24/07/2025 20:25

I’ve heard similar nonsense from heath visitors.

its annoying because the seed was sown and a bit of me thinks it’s true even though there’s no way you can tell at school (beyond classism) but I stopped BF DS far too early because I was overwhelmed and first born BF DD is particularly bright and academic.

Mercedes45 · 24/07/2025 20:36

Dominoeffecter · 23/07/2025 19:15

That’s incredibly inappropriate of her and not even true, don’t listen to her, mine are totally thick and they were all breastfed 🤭

There is no laughing emoji
I have one breastfed and one formula fed and the formula fed one is waaaayyyy more intelligent than the breastfed one
Also, the breastfed one is always sick and formula fed one is strong as an ox.
So there ya have it, primary research done!

IkaBaar · 24/07/2025 20:48

I’m reading Milli Hill’s Ultra Processed Women at the moment. I wonder if the slight increase in IQ could be the fatty acids from breastfeeding but also the fact breastfed babies are not getting entirely ultra processed food.

There is some evidence to support the nurses statement (as linked above), however is it the biggest benefit to breastfeeding, probably not! I think she could have said something more supportive.

Parker231 · 24/07/2025 21:11

IkaBaar · 24/07/2025 20:48

I’m reading Milli Hill’s Ultra Processed Women at the moment. I wonder if the slight increase in IQ could be the fatty acids from breastfeeding but also the fact breastfed babies are not getting entirely ultra processed food.

There is some evidence to support the nurses statement (as linked above), however is it the biggest benefit to breastfeeding, probably not! I think she could have said something more supportive.

As formula provides all the necessary nutrients for healthy growth and development of baby, does it really matter if it’s a upf. Their diet growing up is likely to contain must higher upf’s unless you can think of a way of stopping teenaged eating McD’s!

Chocolateegg123 · 24/07/2025 21:13

Thank you so much for all your responses, they have all been very insightful and helpful. And some very funny responses too!

I am a little nervous that the seed has been sown in my subconscious though and where I have struggled so much with my MH during this period, my ‘fragile state of mind’ was more susceptible to it. If that makes sense?

I just so desperately want to BF my baby and have her not miss out on anything. Additionally the feelings of failure have only been exacerbated if I do come to a stop. I really was looking for support when I opened up to a health professional and have been seeking this for 2 months plus from midwives, HV and this nurse, not to mention LCs and breast feeding peers. The amount of conflicting advice is an absolute minefield.

The surgery I attend send out a text after an appointment to share how the experience was so I will be honest in that feedback and hope someone senior will speak to her.

I think the term I’ve heard which is most accurate is that breast milk is nutritionally optimal and makes a lot of sense to me. I just wish my body and mind could do what I’d planned and I was able to EBF. Her words hit a nerve and you all have helped me to feel more confident however I continue to feed my baby. Thank you!

OP posts:
Parker231 · 24/07/2025 21:20

Chocolateegg123 · 24/07/2025 21:13

Thank you so much for all your responses, they have all been very insightful and helpful. And some very funny responses too!

I am a little nervous that the seed has been sown in my subconscious though and where I have struggled so much with my MH during this period, my ‘fragile state of mind’ was more susceptible to it. If that makes sense?

I just so desperately want to BF my baby and have her not miss out on anything. Additionally the feelings of failure have only been exacerbated if I do come to a stop. I really was looking for support when I opened up to a health professional and have been seeking this for 2 months plus from midwives, HV and this nurse, not to mention LCs and breast feeding peers. The amount of conflicting advice is an absolute minefield.

The surgery I attend send out a text after an appointment to share how the experience was so I will be honest in that feedback and hope someone senior will speak to her.

I think the term I’ve heard which is most accurate is that breast milk is nutritionally optimal and makes a lot of sense to me. I just wish my body and mind could do what I’d planned and I was able to EBF. Her words hit a nerve and you all have helped me to feel more confident however I continue to feed my baby. Thank you!

Your baby will thrive on breast milk or formula - you won’t be able to tell the difference between her friends as to how they were fed.
The main thing is to enjoy your baby and don’t feel guilty for any of the decisions you make which are in your and your baby best interests.
Healthy and happy baby = happy parents

Teaforthetotal · 24/07/2025 21:41

Parker231 · 24/07/2025 21:20

Your baby will thrive on breast milk or formula - you won’t be able to tell the difference between her friends as to how they were fed.
The main thing is to enjoy your baby and don’t feel guilty for any of the decisions you make which are in your and your baby best interests.
Healthy and happy baby = happy parents

This is a great post. My formula fed children are school age now and the only time breastfeeding has come up among peers in conversation is two mums I know who've had a breast reduction in recent years as they felt like their breasts had changed shape after feeding. Otherwise I wouldn't know the children were breast fed, all children seem in a normal IQ range, same as mine.

TaterTots68 · 24/07/2025 21:51

IMHO fed is best. I bf my eldest for 6 months, youngest for a week. Youngest is extremely academically clever and always has been. If it smells like bullshit, it usually is

ArabiattaPrawn · 24/07/2025 22:28

When I was having a massive wobble, my midwife told me that no one can tell which children were formula fed or breastfed when they're older, but what they can tell is which children were read to, played with and loved unconditionally. That's what matters. Please be kind to yourself.

Another76543 · 24/07/2025 22:28

DinosandRegrets678 · 24/07/2025 20:15

This is complete nonsense. Firstly, the vitamin D supplements are needed because we are now advised to not expose babies to direct sunlight until 6 months. So if you don't expose them to the sun, there is no vitamin D. No one makes vitamin D, we all get it from the sun, diet or from supplements.

Breastmilk content does not depend on the mother's diet at all. IF mum is deficient in anything (like calcium), the small quantities that the baby needs are taken first anyway.

Formula babies sleep longer because formula is harder to digest and you can also force more formula into them (whereas with breastfeeding you can't overfeed, baby has to actively suck and takes only what it wants). It's also why they are at higher risk of SIDS because they go into a longer deeper sleep than breastfed babies which from an evolutionary standpoint is not actually great.

To say that formula is better for babies is marketing from the 1960s and has been debunked by modern studies over and over.

Breastmilk content does not depend on the mother's diet at all.

This is absolute rubbish and factually incorrect. Breastfeeding mothers are advised to limit certain fish, avoid alcohol, limit caffeine etc precisely because what the mother ingests gets passed on to the baby.

No one can possibly think that the milk of a mother living on UPF foods with high levels of artificial colourings, preservatives and flavourings, washed down with cups of coffee or cola will be of the same quality as milk from a mother who lives on a diet consisting of high quality vegetables, fruit and protein.

It’s almost as if many breastfeeding mothers try to convince themselves that breastfeeding is the best. Why do so many breastfeeding mothers think it’s ok to criticise the feeing choice of other mothers?

What is even more ridiculous is that many breastfeeding advocates bang on about their milk being nutritionally complete and yet have to rely on vitamin D supplements because breast milk is deficient in it. A lack of vitamin D has been shown to be linked to all sorts of health problems and brain function.

Formula babies sleep longer

This isn’t always the case. My exclusively breastfed baby slept through the night very early (much earlier than formula fed babies we knew of). My combi fed baby slept for longer stretches after breast milk than they did after formula. A lot is dependent on the quality of the mother’s milk.

It's also why they are at higher risk of SIDS

The NHS and other “experts” told mothers in the 1970s and 1980s that babies who slept on their backs were more likely to suffer SIDS. That turned out to be wholly inaccurate and yet we are still expected to listen to, and agree with, the so called “experts”. Advice is always changing.

Bryonyberries · 24/07/2025 22:34

I breast fed all mine. They are all healthy and intelligent but none were ever ‘top of the class’ level intelligent. I actually believe now that high functioning autistic children will be top of the class, intellectually.

However, I did - and do - still believe nature knows best so I would still choose to breast feed for that reason. I wouldn’t force this view on someone making different choices.

Op1n1onsPlease · 24/07/2025 23:28

Everyone - however they feed their babies - knows the truth of the matter, which is that all things being equal breastmilk is better for babies than formula, but also, all things are not actually equal and as a result, formula is the better choice for lots of mothers, babies, families. For some people, it’s not a choice at all but a necessity (and thank goodness we have it).

Fed is best is a stupid slogan because it makes no sense but the sentiment is right - babies will thrive on either kind of milk.

Overall, feeding is a tiny part of being a parent and it just seems all consuming at the start because babies don’t do much else. Your feeding choice is not going to be the primary determinant of your baby’s IQ, and IQ isn’t the be all and end all anyway.

summertimeinLondon · 24/07/2025 23:36

There’s an awful lot of grandstanding and airy dismissing of evidence on this thread by posters who aren’t actually engaging with the data itself, but at the most the odd newspaper article. When did people become so anti-science? There’s plenty here on this thread, too, of outdated mid-20th century propaganda about the benefits of formula as “nutritionally complete”, which is quite funny, since none of that has anything like the data to support breastfeeding, and was actually just originally marketing by formula companies.

It’s hilarious (though actually quite sad) that so many posters are happy to reproduce formula company marketing points from the 1960s and 1970s but are dismissing detailed large-scale independent scientific studies conducted between 2010 and today. Including blithely dismissing a large number of robust studies which do control for socioeconomic background and maternal factors.

Not all studies show increases in IQ; but many of the better-designed ones do, usually by a small number of points only, but a measurable effect. There are much bigger results for the correlation between formula and obesity and other health outcomes. Many studies make use of very detailed MRI and cognitive assessments, not just “asking people about their A-levels” as one poster scathingly put it. (Similarly, the data on SIDS risk factors is very detailed, and I spent a lot of time looking at the actual data, not either newspaper articles or old wives’ tales.) Don’t people want the best most up to date data? That doesn’t mean that things might not change in the future; but we’d be silly to dismiss decent evidence today, no? And a Guardian article by a journalist is not actual science: you need to look at the studies themselves, and understand a bit about statistics — many of the relevant studies are linked on this thread, but it’s really obvious that posters haven’t actually taken any time to look at them or even just read the synopses or conclusions.

All of that doesn’t mean that individual mothers shouldn’t choose formula. But dismissing all the evidence on this basis doesn’t really make sense.

I wonder how much this rejection of evidence and statistical method is down to a post-Brexit Trumpian Reform-style mood of “we’ve had enough of experts”. I certainly don’t remember MN being quite so dismissive of factual evidence when my DD was small. It’s really noticeable how ready posters are to dismiss evidence in favour of anecdote or slogans from formula marketing or just what they wish was true, rather than making an effort to look at the evidence.

There is a very entrenched uproar on MN about this topic which is excessive in relation to other comparable health issues. Do people also get quite so angry when they go to the doctor and the doctor says “you need to eat more healthily and lose weight”? Do they fulminate online about how the doctor is a Nazi and unprofessional and must be reported and it’s all nonsense anyway because Uncle Albert ate 4,000 calories a day of suet and lived to be 90 doing 40 press-ups a day so all medical advice on a healthy diet is complete unsubstantiated bollocks? Maybe they do, but I’ve never noticed this level of resistance to most other health advice, compared to the anger at the (by now pretty conventional) notion that breast milk might actually be on the whole a good thing, and possibly also have a few extra benefits at a population level. Which is in general not exactly that controversial as an idea, not for the past sixty years or so at least.

Maybe the closest thing to it on MN is rear facing car seats. Now that’s a bunfight.

Nasrine · 25/07/2025 00:01

That was a very unkind and inappropriate comment.

It's true - but it's not necessarily causal.

Breastfed babies are more intelligent as a group, but that's probably because women who are more intelligent are more likely to breastfeed, and intelligence is highly heritable (and yes - social class and income is controlled for in the studies that find higher intelligence correlates with higher rates of breastfeeding - it's not just 'middle class women are more likely to breastfeed').

Nasrine · 25/07/2025 00:05

@Another76543

"It's also why they are at higher risk of SIDS
The NHS and other “experts” told mothers in the 1970s and 1980s that babies who slept on their backs were more likely to suffer SIDS. That turned out to be wholly inaccurate and yet we are still expected to listen to, and agree with, the so called “experts”. Advice is always changing."

That's not correct. It was common advice in those days to sleep babies on their fronts because it encourages longer, deeper sleep. It wasn't an evidence based recommendation to reduce the risk of SIDS. But the advice to breastfeed and to put babies to sleep on their backs to reduce the risk of SIDS is.

Nasrine · 25/07/2025 00:12

ArabiattaPrawn · 24/07/2025 22:28

When I was having a massive wobble, my midwife told me that no one can tell which children were formula fed or breastfed when they're older, but what they can tell is which children were read to, played with and loved unconditionally. That's what matters. Please be kind to yourself.

Midwives are very kind and it's right that they go out of their way to reassure mums who are doing their best.

But they should stop telling women that breastfeeding doesn't have any meaningful benefits if evidence from healthcare research suggests otherwise.

Also - infant feeding choices can impact on the shape of the palate and the shape of the face. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8522884/

Infant and Baby Feeding and the Development of the Maxillofacial Complex Based on Own Observations and the Literature - PMC

The method and technique of feeding a young child affect the shape of the maxillofacial complex. Breastfeeding is the recommended method of feeding in the first six months of life. It is encouraged to continue natural feeding in later months, ...

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8522884/

DinosandRegrets678 · 25/07/2025 01:16

summertimeinLondon · 24/07/2025 23:36

There’s an awful lot of grandstanding and airy dismissing of evidence on this thread by posters who aren’t actually engaging with the data itself, but at the most the odd newspaper article. When did people become so anti-science? There’s plenty here on this thread, too, of outdated mid-20th century propaganda about the benefits of formula as “nutritionally complete”, which is quite funny, since none of that has anything like the data to support breastfeeding, and was actually just originally marketing by formula companies.

It’s hilarious (though actually quite sad) that so many posters are happy to reproduce formula company marketing points from the 1960s and 1970s but are dismissing detailed large-scale independent scientific studies conducted between 2010 and today. Including blithely dismissing a large number of robust studies which do control for socioeconomic background and maternal factors.

Not all studies show increases in IQ; but many of the better-designed ones do, usually by a small number of points only, but a measurable effect. There are much bigger results for the correlation between formula and obesity and other health outcomes. Many studies make use of very detailed MRI and cognitive assessments, not just “asking people about their A-levels” as one poster scathingly put it. (Similarly, the data on SIDS risk factors is very detailed, and I spent a lot of time looking at the actual data, not either newspaper articles or old wives’ tales.) Don’t people want the best most up to date data? That doesn’t mean that things might not change in the future; but we’d be silly to dismiss decent evidence today, no? And a Guardian article by a journalist is not actual science: you need to look at the studies themselves, and understand a bit about statistics — many of the relevant studies are linked on this thread, but it’s really obvious that posters haven’t actually taken any time to look at them or even just read the synopses or conclusions.

All of that doesn’t mean that individual mothers shouldn’t choose formula. But dismissing all the evidence on this basis doesn’t really make sense.

I wonder how much this rejection of evidence and statistical method is down to a post-Brexit Trumpian Reform-style mood of “we’ve had enough of experts”. I certainly don’t remember MN being quite so dismissive of factual evidence when my DD was small. It’s really noticeable how ready posters are to dismiss evidence in favour of anecdote or slogans from formula marketing or just what they wish was true, rather than making an effort to look at the evidence.

There is a very entrenched uproar on MN about this topic which is excessive in relation to other comparable health issues. Do people also get quite so angry when they go to the doctor and the doctor says “you need to eat more healthily and lose weight”? Do they fulminate online about how the doctor is a Nazi and unprofessional and must be reported and it’s all nonsense anyway because Uncle Albert ate 4,000 calories a day of suet and lived to be 90 doing 40 press-ups a day so all medical advice on a healthy diet is complete unsubstantiated bollocks? Maybe they do, but I’ve never noticed this level of resistance to most other health advice, compared to the anger at the (by now pretty conventional) notion that breast milk might actually be on the whole a good thing, and possibly also have a few extra benefits at a population level. Which is in general not exactly that controversial as an idea, not for the past sixty years or so at least.

Maybe the closest thing to it on MN is rear facing car seats. Now that’s a bunfight.

Edited

It's much easier to say breastfeeding has no benefits than to actually support women to breastfeed. Clearly women feel a lot of guilt over it too so in our efforts to reassure those who couldn't do it, we completely dismiss facts and put down women who did do it and tell them their efforts were pointless.

Summerhut2025 · 25/07/2025 01:39

Only breast fed for 3 weeks then moved to formula. My child has been to the docs probs only about 4 times in her life and she’s 9! She’s so healthy. One of the most intelligent in her class also. The nurse is talking bollocks. Plus with breast milk if the mother isn’t healthy, how can her milk be? Always wondered about that.

xLittleMissCantBeWrongx · 25/07/2025 02:12

xLittleMissCantBeWrongx · 24/07/2025 10:55

God some people are total arseholes about this issue and I will never understand it. Why does it matter so much to some people how other mothers choose to feed their babies? Just do what you want to do.

Edited

Oh hey look I was right.

Sp0rtB3rry · 25/07/2025 06:25

DinosandRegrets678 · 25/07/2025 01:16

It's much easier to say breastfeeding has no benefits than to actually support women to breastfeed. Clearly women feel a lot of guilt over it too so in our efforts to reassure those who couldn't do it, we completely dismiss facts and put down women who did do it and tell them their efforts were pointless.

No we don’t, we acknowledge that deciding between breast milk or formula is one of many parenting choices and given the unimpressive data a few months of breast or formula is probably one of the least important parenting choices you’ll make. What we feed toddlers and children over many years, the amount of vegetables they eat,their consumption of meat, wrong fats
and sugar, the amount of exercise they get, the amount of screens time they get( which has a pretty catastrophic impact on several areas of life), their care in the formative years, their access to books, their education…all of choices far more worthy of thought and worry.