To think my neighbour is being a CF? Garden fence related.

[MavisTheMonkey]

Our neighbours to the right are the last house in the road on a corner so we are their only neighbours. They have a wall between them and the pavement of the road around the corner and we have a fence in between our gardens.
For 11 years of the 12 years we have been here a couple lived there who had been there for 40+ years. They told us that they were responsible for both the wall to the road (on the right hand side of their garden) and the fence between us (to the left hand side of their house. They always maintained the fence and replaced a number of fence panels over the years. They moved out around a year ago and a new couple moved in.

Yesterday I bumped into the new neighbour and he said “oh I’ve been meaning to talk to you about the fence. I called land registry and they think it is shared. I’ve arranged for someone to come round on Thursday so can you keep your dog inside”

When he caught me I was super stressed and in the middle of something so he said he would catch me later and I didn’t ask questions or make any comments. Later that evening I checked to see if I have a copy of my title deeds as I know these sometimes show who is responsible for each boundary but I can’t find my copies and the originals are with the mortgage company. I also looked on land registry and can’t see how they would have been able to tell him it is a shared responsibility for that boundary.

He has just knocked on my front door and said that people coming tomorrow are replacing the entire fence. Then he showed me pictures of what the new fence will look like and a quote for £2300.

At this point I said “are you thinking I should pay for some of this?” And he said “Well what do you think the split should be?”

I pointed out that I don’t believe it is a shared fence and if it is it should be a shared decision on any work, not something he presents to me the evening before the work starts. I told him to go and see if he had a copy of the title deeds and then we will take it from there but again said if he believes it is a shared boundary it was not up to him to make the decision to replace the fence.

I am now thinking even if he can prove it is a shared responsibility for the fence I’m not going to pay any of the costs as he should have discussed it with me beforehand. AIBU to take this stand or if it is proven to be a shared responsibility then should I contribute towards the cost? I have the money but that’s not the issue in my mind, however I don’t want a bad relationship with our neighbours.

There's information and advice about fences and boundaries on Garden Law Forum. May be worth having a look or posting a query there.

If the boundary is shared/can't be proved (sounds likely), and the fence needs replacing (sounds like it does) then I'd agree to pay half but I'd want to get some quotes myself and discuss the type of fence before proceeding.

Our cf neighbour (who definitely DOES own the fence) has tried something similar. We said no to paying and consequently there's been no fence along the boundary all year. V annoying.

Thanks for all the replies. To update the new fence is half installed and will be finished tomorrow.

I have got the “bad” side of the fence and the first two panels which are on our patio areas are reduced in height - they were previously 2m but are now 1.8m, which is annoying as my husband will now tower over them.

I haven’t said a word as I’m taking the approach that he’s chosen it all, it’s his fence and so I’m not entitled to an opinion, and it’s all ammunition as to why I’m not going to pay for it.

I got chatting to the fence installer whilst I was out with the dog (had to keep her on a lead in the garden so she didn’t wander into their garden) and he said he’s installed fences for 30 years and locally all houses follow the left hand side rule, but I appreciate there is so much confusion and here say re fences. The Scottish system seems much better!

Nothing further from next door neighbour and I am not going to follow up on it. I will just wait and see what he proposes when he’s ready.

Him giving you the bad side is perfect.
Its his fence.
He has only spoken to you to try and extract money from you.
CF.
I wouldn't pay a penny.

My mate's ndn asked her for 2k last month for half the fence costs.
She simply told him she didn't have it.. Deeds(which she had to hand in 5 mins!) showed he was responsible. He kept asking. She kept saying no. He installed new fence. 4ft as before. Enough to keep his shit machine ddog off her grass. Some people are chancers... If you really were jointly responsible op he wouldn't have gone ahead imo.

. He can't make you magic the money.
Responsibility for the boundary could mean a bit of string.

Do you look after the fence on the other side? Usually each house looks after one fence, if from you down everyone takes the fence away from the one you are talking about then that is the consensus. The fact he is at the end and also has a wall is his problem. There is nothing on our deeds, but in our case everyone takes the right hand fence. Also if the previous people accepted responsibility for that fence for many years and particularly if this is the side everyone takes along the road it likely makes it his responsibility.

Are you in touch with the old neighbours would they give you a letter stating which boundaries they looked after?

He called the Land Registry?

No, he did not. He's lying.

He should have the 'bad side', not you. The fence posts should be on his side too. As it's a way of deciding ownership it could cause confusion in years to come if the posts are on your side.

That’s only on newer houses I think.

mine says absolutely nothing like this - builders aren’t even mentioned

This. I have been dealing with LR recently and its just sbout impossible to "just call them" and they don't give individual opinions by phone. Even the general stuff I was dealing with was done by email and it took around 48 hours to get an email reply to each of my questions and they were only simple ones about which form to use and how to send them information. Don't give him a penny.

We have a shared fence
we we wanted to replace it, spoke to our neighbour. They didn’t want to pay towards it (understandable we were having work done and wanted all fences to match but they were functional as they were) so we just confirmed suitable dates & we paid in full

you’re not obliged to pay half just because it’s a shared fence

Why would you agree with a ndn about how your hard earned cash is spent if you weren't consulted /liable?

Do the deeds say there must be a fence? Or give any specifications?

Suggest chicken wire and wood posts.

Fair chance there's no docs saying who owns it so it'll be deemed shared.

You sound reasonable and have a dog who presumably needs to be kept safe so I'd come to an agreement.

Hrft but my answer would be

'Sorry I don't have access to that sort of money right now. Let's talk about it next week when I'm less busy'

you dont even have to have a fence unless its stupulated as part of ownership

tell him to pay for it himself

Is there a nice side to the fence at the moment OP and who has it? Where I live it’s customary to give the neighbour who doesn’t own it the nice side - as all maintenance and installation needs to be done from the owners side. Saying that if you put concrete posts and ranch panels both sides are the same

Tbh imo you are fortunate to have a neighbour who is willing to even think about renewing the fence. I think that's a good start. He's only just moved in and he's being proactive in getting a price and talking to you about it. Now you just have to find out if he's right that it's shared or if one or the other of you is solely responsible for it. I don't think he's being a cf if he honestly believes that it's a shared responsibility. If he's wrong, you'll soon know when you get a copy of your title deeds from Land Registry and shared that information with him. Job done.

I suggest you ask your house insurers: they may have legal aid in your policy. I too am having problems with boundaries, but worse than yours. My house insurers have engages a solicitor who is sorting the problem. They say I stand a chance of winning.

If you don't act fast, you might be in a similar position as I am, though mine is not about what fence, but where fence?

Also, ask your mortgage lender for a copy of your Deeds showing the boundary, and IMMEDIATELY INFORM THEM of the problem.

The copy of the Deeds will tell you which fences are your responsibility, marked with a T.

Also, I think your Deeds will show what height the fences should or should not be. His fancy fence at such a price is his choice, not yours, and if he wants that fence he can pay for it, especially if your deeds say a 3ft fence will do, or even lower, so long as something marks the boundary.

Do not accept what the new neighbour says. You must ask Land Registry yourself, because it sounds as though he is trying it on with you. I would think it unlikely that they would be able to tell him about the fence. I think people have to pay a fee for information like that.

These are just advice you should do immediately. There may be other posters who can add to that from their experiences.

One of my neighbours said the fence needed replacing and offered to give me half the cost, even though the fence showed it was mine to maintain. I was very grateful to her for that.

I share a boundary with six other properties, and am having trouble with one of them.

A very good point. I know people do not like Ai, but being disabled, and the time of night, this is what it says:

In the UK, the posts of a garden fence are typically on the owner's side of the boundary. While it's common for the "good" side of the fence (the smooth side without posts) to face outward, towards the neighbor, there's no legal requirement for this. Fence ownership is determined by the property deeds, and the fence posts being on one's side is a strong indicator of ownership, but not definitive.

I just looked it up online. It confirms what I knew. Please see my post above.

It really should be there. My house was built in 1950 and it still tells me which boundary is mine. Perhaps contact the Land Registry for help? They have an online forum and I've just checked and they have a section headed Register & Title Plan and there's also a section for general info and guidance if you have no luck with the first one. This is here: https://customerhelp.landregistry.gov.uk/forums/

On this page you can use their online form and it has their phone number lower down the page which might be easier: https://share.google/u5bo5PPi76AyAVOjX

I hope you can get the information you need.

I think what ever he’d of done would of been right
He’s done the leg work got a quote all you needed to say was can we discuss what type of fence and it you want more quotes then YOU get them

you could end up shooting yourself in the foot with this
if you tell them it’s there’s and you won’t pay they can just take it down then you would be forced to put your own fence up for your dog

I actually prefer the “bad” side – looks more interesting than a blank, bland length of fence and, when you fix wires between the posts (obviously OP can’t as it’s not hers), you get air space behind for healthy plants.

OP, is it installed properly on the boundary or do the posts encroach onto your land? As it’s his fence he should have it so the posts are on his land up to the boundary (losing him some inches of garden to your gain), not the fence on the boundary and posts jutting out into yours. If you want to be petty.