4 yrs for cutting down tree, no jail time for rape

[Barnbrack]

Why are 2 men being given custodial sentences for cutting down a tree when men convicted of rape regularly get suspended sentences.

Is an important tree more important than a random woman! Justice system seems to think so.

Sure. Rees Newman. Two years suspended. There are hundreds of cases going back to 2010, and presumably even before that if records are held. There are cases where men have actually been allowed to leave court with no further action after a rape conviction, as punishment was not deemed necessary, let alone suspended sentences. Other non custodial sentences are also used, like community service orders. Rees Newman was just one man not imprisoned due to overcrowding, as recently as 2023. The government specifically asked that judges considered other sentencing for rapists, due to the overcrowding issue at the time.

This wasn’t a victimless crime. That tree held an important place in thousands of hearts.

Two experienced tree surgeons (and part time tree butchers) spending their days out in the countryside, doing something very much like the work they chose to do in their normal lives? Sounds like fun, not punishment.

The sentence for the tree is fitting.

Sentencing for rape is a completely different matter - I'd have no problem with that starting at ten years, but, let's face it, most men get let off 'because it's not fair to destroy this young/respectable man's life' if they even get to prosecution, thanks to societal misogyny, so they'd probably get even fewer convictions if the sentencing were harsher.

It wasn’t ‘just’ a tree.

Ozhan Ongun is another…

don't disagree with you, I live in the North East too. Ridiculous thing to do, just trying to understand where is sits within all the horrible crimes that happen daily.
There's so much vandalism that goes on I don't know how they can explain why this particular act of vandalism deserves a punishment 100 x worse than other acts of vandalism.
But I love people getting their cumupence (can't spell 😆) so would love to of seen their faces when they got handed the sentence. Wish fly tippers got the same kind of sentences!

It was a tree.

And how does that make it a victimless crime? It caused a lot of pain to all the people around the world who loved it.

Although he was a man when when convicted, he was a minor when the crime was committed and the sentencing guidelines regarding minors is different. Do you have an example of a man at the time of the crime being given a suspended sentence for rape?

The tree was deliberately planted there in the late 19th century as a landscape feature.
It’s not like an oak tree, which takes ages to mature or anything, they’re not hard to grow, more like a big weed. I get loads of baby sycamores popping up on my drive every year.

5 years jail is ridiculous and a new tree could be planted there easily. It would reach a good size in 25 years

But there are different aspects of the law being used as equivalents here.

The main issue is that rape is harder to prosecute, not that the tree issue is more important or serious. It’s likely easier for the tree offence to be evidenced and proven in court, whereas rape tends to be less straightforward due to the nature of the crimes.

Have you taken any proactive steps to address this, ie complaining to the right people, voting the right government in etc?

Don't minimise what they did. There is an inherent wickedness in doing something in which you gain pleasure from hurting people.

It's reductive to just say "tree".

That they could do this means they could do more, and they have done.

There is one act where they could do everyone a favour.

He was also a minor.

I have a family member who sexually abused his niece. He got 3 years, 18 months actually in prison. Another family member SA his own daughter. He pled guilty and served no time at all, just a 3 year community based rehabilitation programme for sexual offenders. Mind boggling. 🤷🏻‍♀️

It’s not that they deserve less than 4 years. It’s that people who commit heinous violent crimes that leave others with lifelong trauma deserve more.

Well id like to see more ‘punishment fits the crime’ sentences dealt out too. I mean, controversial, but I’m for the death penalty in many cases.
If they’d got any less it would have been uproar I think judge had to do it (I watched the live sentencing).
But they’ll be in a soft prison, released early. All fine with me as they’re not dangerous criminals they’re just idiots. Awful stupid idiots.
If only more judges applied the maximum penalty for crimes against humans.

It’s clear you just cannot see what others are seeing OP. Do you actually believe that the Sycamore Gap tree is directly comparable with a random tree at the end of your street?

So What would you like sentencing to change too? Let’s say we lived in the world of make believe and men got life in prison for rape, would two years for sawing down a tree be okay then, or do you think they deserved zero prison time because it’s only a tree?

More than the pain caused to those who know and love women and children who are secually assaulted?

He should be cut in half with a chainsaw. Not the tree.

What’s a ‘soft prison’?

I think it's a long sentence, I think if all sentences for violent crimes were long and harsh it would make more sense. I think it's disproportionate in the current system

Yes I think if harsh sentences were handed down for violent crimes regularly then handing down a custodial sentences for cutting down a tree would be reasonable.

Apologies, can you tell me which prisons please? Genuine question.

I think this has been pointed out a few times to you now but if of course it’s not comparable.
But they got what they deserved.
Its disgusting that sex offenders don’t.

Why are you even comparing the two? Prison sentences are not drawn from a huge pot of ‘years’ to
be handed out.

@Barnbrack Trees are essential to the human existence - like bees. If all Trees and bees were killed, the human race would die shortly afterwards.
You cannot really compare the crimes, it’s too complex.
One could argue that a very old tree is more important than a human life, as humans produce CO2, where as an average tree can absorb one tonne in a year. The argument is too subjective.

Separately, I still believe rape should carry a heavier sentence than it currently does.