To think my mum was ridiculous about a slice of pie

[BeachPossum]

My son and I made a beautiful rhubarb and strawberry pie a couple of days ago, and I shared a photo of it on our family WhatsApp (parents, siblings and partners).

Yesterday afternoon my mum dropped by unexpectedly after visiting a friend nearby. I offered her a cup of tea and a biscuit and she said 'oh no, I'll have a slice of that lovely pie'. I said 'oh sorry! It's all been eaten', to which she responded with the most exaggerated display of astonishment and surprise. She kept saying 'REALLY! A whole pie in ONE DAY?', saying it would have done her and my dad for a week, we must have had huge slices etc. She made five or six comments in total.

The first time she commented I told her my in laws had been over so between them and us we'd eaten five slices, then my husband had had another piece in the afternoon following a 55km bike ride, and then the three of us had had a piece for morning coffee that day, totalling 9 slices of a normal sized pie. Not a crazy amount. Then when she kept on going on about it I tried to brush it off and move on, before eventually snapping at her to stop talking about food and appetites in front of my young children, at which point she left in a huff. She has texted me this morning to let me know she's hurt, she was just surprised, and that she wasn't saying anything inappropriate in front of the children.

She has absolute form for this. She's one of those people who always has to have the smallest appetite in the room, loves talking about meals she's forgotten to eat, loves refusing food. I was stunned she asked for a slice of pie in the first place since ninety nine times out of a hundred she refuses anything I offer her and makes a point of telling me she's totally full after a huge breakfast of one blini and a quail's egg. She's permanently on a diet, obsessed with food but never eats any, thinks that thinness is next to godliness etc. I've learned to live with it but I'll be damned if me and my children will accept being treated as revolting gluttons for eating two slices of pie over two days.

Anyway, the dilemma. She's incredibly defensive and will go nuclear if I try and get her to take any accountability. I swallow a lot of her shit for the sake of family harmony, and I'm at peace with this because she and I now have a very superficial relationship and I let her crap wash over me. But it's going to get to the point of affecting my children and when that happens I'll have to intervene and accept the fallout. So what do I say to her now? She's expecting an apology from me for snapping and reassurance that she's a lovely mother and granny who was treated unfairly. Do I:

1. Give her an insincere apology to get her to fuck off and leave me alone
2. text something very neutral like 'let's not row over pie' and hope she drops it
3. tell her she was being ridiculous and that it's part of a wider pattern of behaviour that I won't tolerate in front of my kids, and deal with whatever histrionics and drama follows
4. other suggestions welcome

Option 3. If you keep letting them get away with it, or only gets worse.

Thank you all, just catching up! I'm about to share the rhubarb strawberry pie recipe in gratitude ☺️

I agree too. My mother is in her 80s, and when she has something like (gasp) a croissant at a cafe she will puff her cheeks out and say 'I'm being so naughty' - my attitude is well, if you want it have it, if you don't, then don't, either way FGS don't make a song and dance about it.

Her friends are equally as bad, she recently went to lunch and said she thought she'd have some pizza and her (similarly aged) friend said oh you don't need that, have a salad. It's so joyless.

She recently took a friend supermarket shopping and wouldn't stop going on about how much food said recently widowed friend had bought - I mean, what business is it of hers?? She also talks about that friends 'Buddha belly' in front of her. Depressing.

I can’t be doing with people who try to make others feel greedy / fat / shit about food. Your pie. Your appetite. Anything more than a passing comment is definitely getting into territory where someone else’s weird food hang ups are being impolitely offloaded onto other people.

3

Or secret option number 5

”fuck off, I’m sick of you wanging on about your disordered eating in front of all of us, it’s boring and I don’t want the kids hearing it”

Bake her a smaller pie!

She's never going to say what you want to hear OP. You'll never have a proper relationship with her and you'll feel better once you accept that. She wouldn't respond to therapy because she isn't capable of self-reflection.

I don't think the food is the important issue here because I don't think your children will be affected. The real issue is the tantrums and sulking and how you deal with that behaviour around your children. You need to stay neutral to ensure that your children don't see your anger and her crocodile tears and side with her.

She's winding you up on purpose btw....she isn't aware she's doing it but she needs a reaction. So don't give her one. She wants you to say how wonderful she is because she's competing with you and she wants to win. I was given a lot more insight into my mum's mind as she started to develop dementia and it was unsettling to say the least.

Option 2

I get it @BeachPossum . My mother is just like yours on many occasions, not about food (generally) but other things.

People always trot out the adage, you can't change them you can only change your reaction to them.

Which is true.

However - what my mum does in situations like these when I'm changing the subject, grey rocking her, or following the path that others on here have suggested is draw attention to it.

So she will literally go, "I know that you heard me and have decided not to respond, etc" "I know you have changed the subject" and will either ramp up or do something that, I'd venture, even a person on the pathway to sainthood would struggle with.

So this is what I have been dealing with. We have lived 4,000 miles apart for the entirety of my adulthood.

The only thing that has helped is eventually I did reach a place where I did not give a shit what she thought. I can ignore her because I guess somehow she can sense that really - she's lost a part of me that ever did care.

This just happened over time, I spent years in therapy and it didn't help during that time frame.

I try to use the situations to think about ways in which I can ensure I am being the parent she wasn't.

The only thing you can do is 'fake it until you make it'.

In your shoes, to answer your question specifically, I'd go with three as I can now cope with the fall out. Or I'd ignore it.

yeah this 👏

Do NOT apologise!

I think its nonsense that this is a 60-80 problem. Just read any of the food threads on MN where its screamingly obvious that disordered eating and attitudes to food are found across all generations. Some of the lunacy on MN food threads has to be read to be believed.

If any generation of women has become even more susceptible its those who have grown up or spent the last 20 years being told by “influencers” and SM in general that unless they look like plastic stick insects they are ugly and fat (but all they need to do is buy product Z to solve all their problems)>

And in any case - this isn’t about the pie. If it hadn’t been pie there would have been another problem for the OP’s mother to confect a disagreement. Some people are just like that and are best kept at arm’s length.

Jaws isn’t about a shark, this isn’t about pie.

OP I have a very similar mum; trauma, orthorexia, passive aggressive communication and jealousy. What I try to remember is that she grew up in a toxic soup of misogyny. This led to her thinking thinness was all-important, and that assertive or even aggressive communication was wrong for women. Many women of her generation only had passive communication and therefore never got their needs met. In their older years, this has turned into PA because they desperately need to have their needs met but still can’t express them in a healthy way.

The one red line for me, and FIL has found this out, we NEVER talk about food pejoratively in front of DC. EVER. He loves to say things like, “I’m so glad my grandchildren are thin” and “my goodness what a lot of food” to them. Not in my house. He still does it to the older two (SIL’s) and one is obsessed with her appearance and dates horrible old men with money. The other is on ADHD meds and struggles to eat and is very thin. Not in a good way. But they’re both thin! Hooray.

Smile and wave and understand. But set a hard boundary around the kids.

Haven’t RTFT. OP, shit like this winds me up no
end. My late father was obsessed with thinness, frequently told my daughter she’d ’get fat’, commented on food we were eating all the time, was obsessed with working out ‘why I (me) couldn’t lose weight’ etc, etc. We had a complex relationship and it wasn’t really the done thing to challenge him, my daughter now has a severe eating disorder. I’m not saying he caused it, there are multiple factors at play, but he certainly didn’t help. I wish I’d had the guts to challenge his toxic behaviour around food. One of my brothers was similar to him, and I have told him in no uncertain terms now my dad is gone and my daughter is so unwell never to mention weight or food or anything of that nature in front of my daughter ever again. 😡

This is the pie crust recipe I use: https://sallysbakingaddiction.com/all-butter-pie-crust/

That makes enough for the bottom and top of the pie. I wanted a lattice top so I doubled it, which made more than I needed so I froze the leftovers.

Your pastry needs to chill for at least 2 hours before rolling out.

If you can't be bothered making pastry, ready made sweet shortcrust from the shops is fine!

The filling is as follows:

800g rhubarb, washed and chopped into chunks
450g hulled strawberries, mix of halved and quartered
160g caster sugar
zest of an orange
Half a tsp salt
35g of cornflour
25g butter

1. Roll half of your pie crust into a circle and then place in a pie dish. Trim the edges.
2. rub the orange zest into the sugar with your finger tips to release the orange scent
3. mix all of the filling ingredients except the butter together in a large bowl and then leave loosely covered on the worktop for two hours, or in the fridge overnight (I think the latter option is better)
4. drain the juices from the mixture through a sieve into a small saucepan. You can squash the fruit a bit to get the juices through the sieve if needed.
5. Put the drained fruit into your pie dish (no need to blind bake this one).
6. bring the juices to a boil then simmer for a few minutes until they're really thick
7. add the juice mixture to the pie. It will firm up on contact with the cold fruit. Give it a bit of a mix but don't worry about it being uneven.
8. dot the butter about over the filling
9. roll out and add your pastry lid. Crimp the edges and cut a small vent in the centre.
10. egg wash (or milk if you prefer) the lid.
11. chill the pie in the fridge for 20 mins while your oven heats to 220c.
12. place the pie on a metal baking tray in the oven and bake for 25 mins. Then reduce the oven temp to 190c and bake for another 35 or so mins, until it is golden brown and the filling is bubbling. If the pastry is getting too brown too soon, cover in tin foil
13. Let the pie cool completely before cutting or it will be too wet to slice properly
14. very nice with cream or custard!

Sadly not everyone gets the Mum they always wanted - a Mum to be best friends with etc. I think you have to accept this at some point. I did. & move on. She'll probably never change.

Sorry of this has been suggested :

Option 5..bake another pie, deliver it.. 'here's yer fecking pie'!

Somehow, when I wasn't watching, I became of the age to be a granny (although I'm not yet), and I am a very proud mother in law. My relationship with my two grown up children is the ultimate priority in my life and my love for them knows no bounds. If I was consistently saying things that bothered my daughter, I'd be absolutely heartbroken to find she withdrew from me without having an honest conversation about what was wrong. Please, please take the time to have a gentle conversation with your mum about this and give her the chance to understand and 'do better'. There are few things harder to bear than feeling your child is withdrawing from you and not knowing why.

One of my kids had an eating disorder (thankfully all long forgotten but it was a nightmare for a few years) my MIL would say the most inappropriate things like the food will be crying because she wouldn't eat it. Like imagining the food on your plate has feelings is going to suddenly give you an appetite. Anyway in the end after many many months of asking her to stop going on about food and her saying she couldn't remember my husband snapped. He said he was sorry but if she couldn't control what she said we couldn't see her anymore as DD wouldn't eat for days after we'd seen her and the doctor had warned us that if she lost another pound she would need to go into hospital.

She never mentioned food or commented on what DD was eating again.

That's all I can recommend if her comments make the children feel bad.

Yanbu

I don't think you have anything to apologise for. I don't think you should offer reassurance either.

You need to set a clear boundary.

I would ask for a chat. State that you would rather not fall out over pie. Food can be triggering. It would be better not to talk about how much or little food people are consuming. In future, if this is brought up you will change the subject. If it continues you will leave the room. Then do follow what you've set out. I think that's reasonable for any subject. You can insert your own. Boundaries are to protect your peace and not punish someone else.

You don't need to justify how the pie was consumed to fit someone else's competitive under eating. Grey rock could be:
The pie is gone what else would you like?
I've explained the pie is gone
There is no pie (repeat)
Then /or no reaction at all.

Your mum probably asked for pie because she thought there was none available. Is perfectly reasonable to finish a pie in a few days. How you consume your calories is no-one else's business.

You don't need to justify your OH doing a 55K bike ride to have a second piece. Definitely talk to your therapist about the FOG or it all

I'm so sorry to hear that.

this is my big fear too. I have a daughter, only a baby at the moment, but I just won't have her hearing this toxic shit.

One of my mum's things at the moment is that I'm breastfeeding, which she doesn't like anyway. But especially because I am not one of those women who finds that breastfeeding assists with weight loss, with both my kids my baby weight really hung on while I was feeding (and I had the appetite of a horse to boot) and then when I stopped feeding I naturally tapered back to my usual weight.

I have no issues with this but my mum CONSTANTLY makes comments about how it will be good when I'm not feeding any more because I can lose the weight, how it's such a shame that the weight doesn't 'fall off' with feeding like it does for other women, how long do I plan on feeding for, etc. Even though my body is doing this brilliant thing of making food to nourish my baby, all she can think about is how it interacts with my weight.

I have told my mum a few times that we don't talk about weight / appetites etc in front of the kids. With my son she's much more likely to talk about how growing boys need plenty and how strong he is (because only women need to starve themselves into thinness, of course). She does do it less as a result of us talking to her but it still happens and when it's just me she still does it all the time.

She's never alone with my children and I do put a stop to it when it happens but it's just a lifelong battle.

You are a more patient person than I am, OP - after the first couple of times, I would have snapped and told her to check in the bloody fridge if she didn't believe me! Also would have told her it was none of her damn business even if I'd eaten the whole thing myself!

I’m torn between 2 and 3. Probably go with 2 but if you feel it’s veering into the territory of affecting your kids on another occasion in future, it will be time for option 3.

Yes this would be my option. Tell her you don’t want any food discussions. Speaking as a grandmother, she will eventually have to give in. She will want to see her grandchild. It might make for better relations in the future.