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Thread 4: To feel disappointed after reading this in The Observer about the author and her husband from The Salt Path book and film?

1000 replies

DisappointedReader · 09/07/2025 20:23

The Observer The real Salt Path: how a blockbuster book and film were ...

Second article in the Observer
https://observer.co.uk/news/national/article/the-salt-path-whats-in-the-book-and-what-the-observer-has-found

Third article in the Observer
https://observer.co.uk/news/national/article/the-salt-path-the-truth-behind-the-blockbuster-book-video

Thread One ^www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5368194-to-feel-disappointed-after-reading-this-in-the-observer-about-the-author-and-her-husband-from-the-salt-path-book-and-film?^

Thread 2 Thread 2. To feel disappointed after reading this in The Observer about the author and her husband from The Salt Path book and film? | Mumsnet

Thread 3 https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5369425-thread-3-to-feel-disappointed-after-reading-this-in-the-observer-about-the-author-and-her-husband-from-the-salt-path-book-and-film?

Raynor Winn/Sally Walker's statement Raynor Winn

OP posts:
Thread gallery
49
ThatFluentHedgehog · 10/07/2025 13:51

@HolyPond This is the tumbledown farmhouse on the cider farm! 😄From DM article 10/07

Thread 4: To feel disappointed after reading this in The Observer about the author and her husband from The Salt Path book and film?
Bruisername · 10/07/2025 13:52

Catwith69lives · 10/07/2025 13:50

Interesting take on the controversy in The Independent. Basically we (the readers) are the mugs for wanting to believe the fairy tale in the first place.

The Salt Path: When it comes to the Raynor Winn scandal, we only have ourselves to blame | The Independent

Victim blaming!

aren’t people terrible for wanting to feel positivity and hope only to discover it’s a pack of lies

Daisythepussycat · 10/07/2025 13:54

Bruisername · 10/07/2025 10:07

Yes forgetting the exact price of a fudge bar is perfectly forgivable. And I’m sure there are many minor errors in her book that really don’t matter - like what day they did something, or not mentioning visiting their son or even taking buses a little more often than they say or whatever

the problem is the big lies and the amount of detail she went into on them and then the subsequent repeating of those lies

you had Jason Isaac’s tearful over them having been the victims of the horrible Cooper when the story is actually very different!!

My kids, a few years earlier, had to make do with Freddos (Freddi?) - they were only 10p. Surely anyone who was homeless and penniless would do likewise?

Uricon2 · 10/07/2025 13:54

PrimalScreaming · 10/07/2025 13:47

Coming from the Midlands myself - I would say that Moth has a Black Country accent.

Same here, I'm Black Country and me too. Someone on another thread said the same but I hadn't heard him talking until @EternalLodga s post and was quite surprised.

I know he was apparently born in Melton Mowbray, suppose he could have been bought up elsewhere.

ThatFluentHedgehog · 10/07/2025 13:56

HolyPond · 10/07/2025 09:04

Thanks, @AldoGordo — that makes sense. I did wonder about what happens when a heavily-mortgaged house is legally repossessed with the proceeds (apparently?) going to a creditor other than the mortgage lender…?

Reading The Wild Silence atm, and interested in the fact that they pay the owner of the cider farm rent, even though at times she seems to present it as the owner doing them a favour and despite the house, as RW depicts it, is uninhabitable, with standing water in some rooms, huge mould, and infested with mice. Also, before they move in, someone vandalises the house, gluing the locks shut, throwing red paint everywhere and writing SCUM (and a giant penis) on the exterior. They write it off as ‘kids’, but is it another Walker enemy disgruntled about a debt?

A PP suggested that the descriptions RW gives of the cider farmhouse they stayed at are taken from their experience of the property they bought in France which needed extensive work.

So she's borrowed a bit of reality and plonked it down where it best fits her story, which seems to have happened in TSP too, as well as gross exaggeration and at least some completely made up parts.

Which is all fine for fiction works or even 'inspired by real life events' but not for non-fiction, especially when sold as 'unflinchingly honest'. Something I myself took to mean what it said!

Fandango52 · 10/07/2025 13:57

EternalLodga · 10/07/2025 13:43

So just to confirm: he has never appeared in an interview with her? Ever?

He definitely has appeared in at least one - e.g. this one: www.theguardian.com/film/2025/may/30/gillian-anderson-jason-isaacs-the-salt-path-raynor-winn

mycatismyworld · 10/07/2025 13:58

https://www.abebooks.com/9780957303102/Dy-Wyn-Thomas-Izzy-0957303106/pl
Definitely written by Sally ( or perhaps Tim as has been suggested here)

EternalLodga · 10/07/2025 14:00

Fandango52 · 10/07/2025 13:57

He definitely has appeared in at least one - e.g. this one: www.theguardian.com/film/2025/may/30/gillian-anderson-jason-isaacs-the-salt-path-raynor-winn

But i mean he has never been captured on camera sitting with her for an interview?

Noshadelamp · 10/07/2025 14:03

EternalLodga · 10/07/2025 11:43

I find it really odd that the Dy Dir book featured three male protagonists despite being written by a woman. What if Moth wrote the book?

Which book, the 2012 book or TSP etc?

This is actually a fascinating idea.

What if Raynor/Sally didn't even write the books herself.

Just off the top of my head this would explain why Raynor comes off as not a particularly nice person- something ice always wondered how someone writing their own story about themselves manages to write themselves as so unlikeable.

It would also explain the comment by Sally/Raynor in her statement:
Among the Observer’s many accusations, the most heart breaking is the suggestion that Moth has made up his illness.

Because no one was suggesting Moth made up his illness, the suggestion was that "Raynor", the author of TSP, made up/exaggerated his illness.

Fandango52 · 10/07/2025 14:05

EternalLodga · 10/07/2025 14:00

But i mean he has never been captured on camera sitting with her for an interview?

Ooh I’m not sure.

EternalLodga · 10/07/2025 14:06

Noshadelamp · 10/07/2025 14:03

Which book, the 2012 book or TSP etc?

This is actually a fascinating idea.

What if Raynor/Sally didn't even write the books herself.

Just off the top of my head this would explain why Raynor comes off as not a particularly nice person- something ice always wondered how someone writing their own story about themselves manages to write themselves as so unlikeable.

It would also explain the comment by Sally/Raynor in her statement:
Among the Observer’s many accusations, the most heart breaking is the suggestion that Moth has made up his illness.

Because no one was suggesting Moth made up his illness, the suggestion was that "Raynor", the author of TSP, made up/exaggerated his illness.

I mean the pattern is always the same:

The publishing company was founded by three male friends, two ramblers and a finance guy.

Izzy's book is about three men, two ramblers and a finance guy.

Sally's story is about two ramblers (her and Moth) and a finance guy (Cooper).

My completely unfounded gut belief is that Moth wrote all the books. I dont know why they would have Sally pose as the author though.

AnOlderGranny · 10/07/2025 14:07

PrettyDamnCosmic · 10/07/2025 13:48

Before he moved to North Wales Tim Walker was alleged to be not just a plasterer but a master plasterer. Plasterers are always in demand & well paid. I wonder why he didn't persevere with his trade even part time to bring in some extra cash.

But in the doctor's letters shared about his illness, he is described as a landscape gardener.

Nameychangington · 10/07/2025 14:08

SuffolkSun · 10/07/2025 13:37

On the Doctor and his odd book review of TSP.

He wrote: "A point that’s highly relevant to medical practice, however, is a recurring theme of The Salt Path: when you hit rock bottom, the only way is up. That’s if you allow yourself to try, and are willing to risk that you might die laughing in the effort…" and "I must say that Raynor Winn (et al!) provide a compelling (if not scientifically irrefutable) case for the benefits of positive action and of physical therapy, even for the ghastliest of neurodegenerative conditions."

Like others on here, I have first-hand experience of a relative with a rare, incurable neurodegenerative condition (not CBD in this case). Anyone with this experience knows that when you think you've reached "rock bottom", it can and does get worse.

My relative's diagnosis was year one. By year three he was reliant on a wheelchair, had speech problems and suffered side-effects of medicines including severe hallucinations. At year five this man who used to hike in the Lake District and the Alps was unable to move unaided, was reliant upon PEG feeding, upon others to turn him in bed and wash him, lacked the strength to hold a book and the dexterity to turn the pages, was unable to speak even basic sentences...The implication, even if unintentional, that he just didn't "try" hard enough to halt the progress of his disease is sickening.

For families, the emotional impact and despair at seeing the effects of a neurodegenerative condition on their loved ones - and on their own lives - is devastating. A Consultant Neurologist would know this because it's something they see and deal with every day. And it's inexplicable to me that a Consultant Neurologist should be so flippant (imo) about the issue, regardless of whether they know the individual or not.

For context, I did read TSP a few years ago and remember thinking if "Moth Winn"'s condition and improvement as described was true, then there was a valuable seam of research to be followed up. But, as far as I know, it hasn't been. And now it seems that his condition wasn't as described. He has something - but what that is may never be known. I sincerely hope that his condition doesn't deteriorate any further. However, for his wife to appropriate the misery and very real pain of families dealing with incurable neurodegenerative diagnoses across not just one but three books is unconscionable.

Apologies if it's felt this is a derail of the thread; of all the elements of the sorry saga of TSP, this is the one directly bearing on my (and many others') life and it makes me angry. For those posters/readers who have lived, or are living, it, my thoughts are with you.

Very much this.

A consultant dealing with patients who have cruel degenerative illnesses shouldn't be going on record saying "when you hit rock bottom, the only way is up. That’s if you allow yourself to try". It's much too close to saying that people who get progressively worse just aren't trying hard enough.

People with serious conditions get told versions of that all the time - have you tried yoga?/you need to cut out sugar/ my cousin's hairdressers neighbour cured himself with citric acid you should do that. Posters on these threads have said how guilty they've felt that they haven't done what Moth apparently did and so maybe it's their fault they've as ill as they are. It's bad enough a book which it's now pretty clear is untrue put ill people in that position, but a consultant neurologist should be much more careful about the message he puts across.

People with CBD aren't unwell because they haven't tried to get better FFS.

EternalLodga · 10/07/2025 14:09

To me it doesn't make sense that they would go through these insane physical journeys together, hand in hand, arm in arm... And yet he wouldn't travel to London to do an interview with her side by side.

Just going off superficial things here but... His look, his air. There's a certain style to him. In that short snippet of video posted earlier, I got the feeling he was trying to sound a little kore basic than he actually is. Just throwing that out there but I wonder if he has never been filmed in interview with her because it would be blatantly obvious that he's the wordsmith?

AnOlderGranny · 10/07/2025 14:10

bluegreygreen · 10/07/2025 13:32

I don't have the book (Salt Path) but @DisappointedReader said her copy has a statement on the flyleaf saying that everything was true (can't remember the wording. OP can you help?

That is indeed true.
The publishers say that other than for some changing of names to protect privacy, the author has reassured them that everything in the book is true.

mycatismyworld · 10/07/2025 14:11

https://www.facebook.com/share/1AkBwFd9We/
So they claim they were making the cider themselves.

Noshadelamp · 10/07/2025 14:13

Catwith69lives · 10/07/2025 13:50

Interesting take on the controversy in The Independent. Basically we (the readers) are the mugs for wanting to believe the fairy tale in the first place.

The Salt Path: When it comes to the Raynor Winn scandal, we only have ourselves to blame | The Independent

I'm guessing it was written by a man.

Clicks link

Yep, a man blaming the largely female audience including his own mother and grandmother for our silly naivety! What a bunch of "suckers" apparently.

Fandango52 · 10/07/2025 14:15

EternalLodga · 10/07/2025 14:06

I mean the pattern is always the same:

The publishing company was founded by three male friends, two ramblers and a finance guy.

Izzy's book is about three men, two ramblers and a finance guy.

Sally's story is about two ramblers (her and Moth) and a finance guy (Cooper).

My completely unfounded gut belief is that Moth wrote all the books. I dont know why they would have Sally pose as the author though.

This is a really interesting point about the pattern in the books and of the company founders’ profiles. I still don’t understand though how that suggests Moth wrote the books?

HumbleWarrior · 10/07/2025 14:16

Catwith69lives · 10/07/2025 13:50

Interesting take on the controversy in The Independent. Basically we (the readers) are the mugs for wanting to believe the fairy tale in the first place.

The Salt Path: When it comes to the Raynor Winn scandal, we only have ourselves to blame | The Independent

What a patronising article, blaming stupid, credulous readers for buying the stuff that a billion-pound publishing industry primps and polishes and markets to us via every media channel available.

It was hardly an underground word-of-mouth bestseller from some tiny indie press, or a self-published work that came to public attention by being recommended on forums such as MN and was lapped up by gullible fans. It came from the UK's most respected publisher who gave it a massive marketing budget and huge PR campaign, which in turn led to a major film with internationally acclaimed actors.

Of course, all those clever, sophisticated media types didn't expect us silly little people to believe it. If we did, it's a measure of our limited, undiscerning minds rather than Raynor Winn's moral bankruptcy, and our cultural overlords can't be held responsible for that. 🤷‍♀️

Noshadelamp · 10/07/2025 14:21

EternalLodga · 10/07/2025 14:06

I mean the pattern is always the same:

The publishing company was founded by three male friends, two ramblers and a finance guy.

Izzy's book is about three men, two ramblers and a finance guy.

Sally's story is about two ramblers (her and Moth) and a finance guy (Cooper).

My completely unfounded gut belief is that Moth wrote all the books. I dont know why they would have Sally pose as the author though.

I'm just thinking now that scene in the TSP where Moth earns them some money by busking and telling tales about something or other. I'm sure Raynor says she didn't know he had it in him and the scene was one of huge admiration for Moth.

Also , the weird theme of him being mistaken for Simon Armitage the Poet Laureate.

Maybe it's him throwing her under the bus all along.

I said in an earlier post that the only caveat to Sally being this terrible woman she's now being portrayed as for dishonesty, embezzlement, apparent selfishness at making poor Moth do this walk etc would be if she felt she needed to do it for her own safety or sense of survival.

What if we're all here blaming her and actually she's a victim also.

Or is that a stretch??

Noshadelamp · 10/07/2025 14:24

Also that weird story about the rich history who fed them lasagna and Moth was in a room with younger women giving him massages or something. Such a weird story, but makes more sense as a covert flex if written by a man.

HonoriaBulstrode · 10/07/2025 14:24

Before he moved to North Wales Tim Walker was alleged to be not just a plasterer but a master plasterer. Plasterers are always in demand & well paid. I wonder why he didn't persevere with his trade even part time to bring in some extra cash.

Possibly by the time he needed the cash he no longer had sufficient mobility/manual dexterity. You do need to have a good range of movement in your arms.

DiamondThrone · 10/07/2025 14:25

WestwardHo1 · 10/07/2025 11:06

As someone who's been following this story reasonably closely - though I ran out of stamina and time to keep up with every post on every thread on MN - I've been thinking about what kind of people they are. I don't have a particular axe to grind - I'm not ill, I wasn't particularly into the book though I read it twice, I didn't think the film was great though I went to see it. In short, I have no emotion attached to them at all so while I'm fascinated by it all, I don't feel anything much.

However, thinking about them as people, they remind me of a few I have known in my life, including my own dear brother. Strikes me, that they want to live on the edges of society, to be unique and free spirits, and to be considered special intellectuals, not like other more normal and less special people. Normal rules are not for them, and so they shouldn't have to abide by them. If they want something, it's not the normal kind of wanting...because they are free spirits, and therefore other people should indulge this. As I said, I have known lots of Glastonbury (the town, not the festival) types like this. People who are caught up in thinking higher thoughts and being at one with nature, so shouldn't by rights have to bother about things like jobs, and tax, and bills, and debts. Essentially people like this think everyone else (the normal people) owe them. She wanted/needed that £64,000, so she took it. Why shouldn't she? The aforementioned dear brother used to steal money from me when we were teens - money I'd earned. Why should he have to work when he was so intellectually higher, and the money was there, just waiting to be taken? Why should the Sally and Tim have to pay for campsite fees like normal people, if they could hop over the wall and not bother?

None of their money problems would have happened if they had just got a job and lived within their means. However they were too special for that. People like them need to be AT ONE with the land.

This is so true. These people are speshul and cannot possibly be expected to live like the little people in dreadful cities who work and pay their bills. I've come across a few of them as well.

FurryHappyKittens · 10/07/2025 14:25

Noshadelamp · 10/07/2025 14:24

Also that weird story about the rich history who fed them lasagna and Moth was in a room with younger women giving him massages or something. Such a weird story, but makes more sense as a covert flex if written by a man.

I think we're beginning to wander into the realms of fiction ourselves!

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