Tax increases imminent

[Iwishicouldflyhigh]

Heavy hints that taxes will rise in the next Budget after the recent climb down (as the ‘taxes won’t rise again’ was based on a 5 billion saving in benefits).

I can’t lie, I’m so pissed off about this. I don’t think anyone wants to see someone who is genuinely unable to work to be further penalised, but we all know there are thousands of people who could work but don’t.

this country is going to absolute shit . We pay more and more for less and less.

There may be an infinite amount of money but there is not an infinite amount of wealth. The difference is lost on most people. Including maybe Theresa May.

A lot of people seem to also conveniently forget the flip side of Keynesian economics, which is that the government is supposed to contract spending when the economy is doing well.

In theory the markets might react well to the government borrowing money to invest in infrastructure and boost productivity.

In practice they might take a look at the mess made of HS2 and decide differently.

A brave gamble to take.

The statistic that 52% of working age people are not net contributors in the UK is reflected in this thread…..about 52% of posts supporting / defending tax rises

Ah so we punish the people who were good with money and saved for a private pension as well

The country has some very very wealthy people who wouldn’t even notice a tax increase …. they remain blissfully unaware of any COL crisis

If you’re arguing for more debt then you’ll have to take it up with the markets. If they react you’ll see a blow out.

Well that just confirms that RR absolutely needs to go - when someone as right wing a KB is supporting you, you really are on the wrong side of the centre line!

How do you know this?

I know of 3 very wealthy people leave the uk in the past year. Their contribution combined was around £15m

Maybe not free, but it should be an allowable expense against taxes on wages, same as commuting using public transport and other "essential" costs of working, maybe even rent and mortgage interest too! Other countries DO provide either subsidised employment costs or tax relief on costs of working. The UK by contrast just seems to regard workers as the cash cows to subsidise everyone else.

If you supported lockdowns, you do not have any right whatsoever to complain about tax rises. If you repeatedly hit the economy in the knees, over and over, it will fall over and need reviving. That is obvious. Plenty of people tried to warn abou the knock on effect of shutting everything down but too many people lacked the capability to hold two ideas in their mind at one time - that covid was a serious issue and that locking down would have long term negative consequences. As a result we got the worst of all worlds.

If your tax goes up, you are paying, in literal terms, for the 'safety' you wanted during covid. If you think it was worth it then you should do it gratefully.

For my part, I didn't support lockdowns but I am totally open to paying more taxes. I consider myself lucky to be in a position to pay and all I want is for that money to be spent wisely. In particular I never want anyone who struggles to work, for any reason, to worry about food or heating.

Completely agree with this. I’m not from the UK originally (grew up in a developing country) and the entitlement and laziness of some people in this country is astounding at times. Noone is suggesting taking away benefits from severely disabled people but if benefits suddenly disappeared you would find that there were a lot less people claiming they can’t work due to mental health issues. You see it all the time on here when someone says they are stressed at work / dealing with normal life pressures and suddenly it’s ’burnout’ requiring weeks or months off work, posters saying their mental health is more important than any job and encouraging them to take endless sick leave or quit their jobs.

hmmm, see Scotland...... 🙄

Wealth tax…because loads of examples show there is a limit to what you can tax and the reality is taxing the rich is a group that are able to pay for expert advice and are mobile so it rarely yields what is intended….just look at RR how she is now rowing back on the non doms.

@D23456789 - can you expand/is your daughter studying medicine? My son wants to, and pretty much every doctor friend of ours says 'don't do it'. 😖We've yet to really dig into the reasoning - he's a few years off applying - but would be interested to hear more x

I think they need to put up VAT. That would raise money from those with the money to spend.

Maybe we do all need to pay a bit more tax, though. I know that everyone feels as though they pay too much tax, but in comparison with a lot of other countries, we pay less tax as a percentage of wages (see attached chart).

TBH I think they actually need to put a penny on income tax or VAT. At least that way it spreads the burden across most of the population. (Ideally I would like them to scrap NI completely and increase income rates accordingly).

I am not against the idea of taxes rising - IF I knew it was actually going to lead to an improvement in public services: if it meant I could call my GP at 10am and get an appointment that afternoon. Or if the waiting list for my son’s serious spine surgery wasn’t 9 months just to get a first appointment, let alone the surgery itself. Or if the roads were cleaner and better maintained. Or if schools could actually afford to hire all the subject specialist teachers they needed. Etc etc. The list goes on and on.

But I have a horrible feeling that taxes will rise, but because all our politicians across all parties appear to be incompetent, there will be zero improvement in anything.

The day someone in Westminster dares to suggest that the NHS cannot continue to be free for all at the point of use without it being a massive electoral risk or being accused of "selling off' the NHS", that day we will be much stronger as a country.

Unless you have a lot of money it really won't be very much. I know my tax has gone up recently but it's a negligible amount. I don't work, am long retired.

I presume when you are talking about people not working, you mean those on benefits. Don't judge others, you do not know their circumstances. The likes of the Daily Mail enjoy causing outrage citing individuals who work the system but they are by no means the majority. I always worked and pay some tax now I am retired, no benefits but I know I could claim if I needed. I don't resent anyone else, it's not my business, I count my blessings.

VAT is a very regressive tax.

I've been reflecting on the state of things lately — the cost of living remains brutal, public services are stretched thin, and now there’s more talk of tax increases. It keeps bringing me back to one question: how can the UK government realistically drive economic growth and fund state benefits without resorting to stealth taxes or touching politically sensitive inheritance and wealth taxes?
Here are some ideas that seem practical — but I wonder if they hold up:
GROWTH IDEAS:
Invest in childcare: If the government subsidised affordable, flexible childcare, more parents (especially mums!) could return to work or increase their hours. That means more tax revenue and higher productivity.
Green energy + infrastructure jobs: Create decent, well-paying jobs while modernising the country. It’s a win-win!
Cut red tape for small businesses/startups: Simplify processes to help small businesses grow, especially outside London. Digital, manufacturing, and clean tech sectors could thrive with the right support.
Tackle the NHS backlog: It might sound unrelated, but long-term sickness is keeping many working-age people out of the job market. Fixing the NHS would mean a healthier workforce and, ultimately, more growth.
TAX IDEAS (avoiding wealth/inheritance tax):
Reform capital gains tax: Not suggesting a full overhaul, but at least bring it closer to income tax rates. Most ordinary savers wouldn’t be affected — it’s mainly about investment properties and profitable asset sales.
Close non-dom loopholes: This seems like an obvious political and moral win.
Temporary windfall taxes on excess profits (oil, energy, etc.): Not a permanent measure, but when companies make enormous profits during global crises, it feels fair.
I know there’s no magic solution, but I’m so frustrated hearing “we can’t afford it” while billions are wasted on contracts or taxes rise in all the wrong places.
I know this might be controversial, but I genuinely don’t understand how anyone thinks inheritance tax is fair. DH and I aren’t millionaires by any stretch – we’ve worked hard, saved hard, paid absolutely masses in tax over the years, and now we’re looking at possibly losing a chunk of what we leave to the kids? Just because we dared to own a semi in the South East that’s gone up in value?!
I’m not talking about Russian oligarchs leaving private islands to their heirs. I’m talking about normal families. My parents went without for years, didn’t take holidays, scrimped and saved just so they could leave something behind. Now HMRC wants 40% of it if they go over the threshold?! How is that anything but state-sanctioned double taxation?
We paid tax when we earned it, we paid VAT when we spent it, council tax on the home, stamp duty when we bought it… now they want a cut again just because we dared not to blow it all?! It feels like a punishment for being careful.
A wealth tax would completely undermine ambition and hinder the creation of future wealth. I strongly oppose taxing wealth, as it eliminates the idea that you can ever truly own something. Essentially, it allows the government to impose burdens on any asset you possess, which I believe is entirely unjust.

Means testing pensions will have unintended consequences. Working aged people, earning modest wages, won't continue to put money into private pension schemes if they think it will cost them their state pensions. This money currently gets invested into the economy by UK pension schemes. The goverment will also lose voluntary NI contributions as no-one will have an incentive to pay them.

@genesis92 Many now can't afford to save or pay into a pension. Nothing to do with being good with money.

To be fair, I think she knows that. She was supporting cuts to the benefits bill which her idiotic party colleagues pushed back on. Unless you believe she came into politics to take benefits away from people (in which case I don’t think there’s much point engaging) you kind of have to conclude that she thought it was unpleasant but absolutely necessary.

The problem now is that they have a parliamentary party which, having suffered no consequences for rebelling, has no reason to support any cuts to anything and a tax base which is ageing and shrinking and will change behaviour to nullify any attempted tax increases. They’re stuffed and by extension so are we.

VAT is a regressive tax and impacts the poorest families much more than higher earners.

Not if its more debt that comes with a comprehensive investment plan - the markets blow out when spending is unfunded and lining people's pockets like in the Truss budget and therefore unlikely to circulate properly within the economy

When the borrowing is being used to invest in infrastructure the market tends to go up due to the demand for goods and services and in an underperforming economy like the UK, government investment indicates confidence in future growth and can trigger additional investment.

You have to keep an eye on interest rates and get the balance right not to go too far that it leaves nothing for the private sector to invest in - socialists hates the Blair / Brown PFI schemes, but they were actually really smart because it joined the government investment with private interests, which is why they were able to improve services.

Unless we do something really drastic soon, things will only get worse and we will slide into being even more of a poor shadow of the US than we already are, with privatised health care and crumbling infrastructure and some of the worst health outcomes in the developed world.

@ThisTicklishFatball - agree with everything you're saying, but re wealth tax - what about very big assets? Perhaps I am being naive, but I think it's pretty gross that they're not capping the banker's bonuses or doing anything about the very small but significant percent of the population with assets over 10million, when levels of poverty are rising every day in the UK.