Unpleasant altercation - who was the most unreasonable?

[zerofeeling]

Took my dogs out today and was trying to park in a small space between two cars on a country lane. As I was inching back to fit into the space I heard a loud crunch 😖

The two men from the car behind had just set off on their walk, as I got out of my car one of them was heading back towards me shouting why did I try to park in such a small space. I said sorry and inspected the front of his car - couldn't see any damage at all, and apart from a tiny paint scuff nothing on my car. I said to him 'i can't see any damage, it doesn't look like I hit you'
Man just glanced over at his car then asked me for my details, I asked is that necessary and said again there's no damage. He said that's not the point you have to give your details if you've been in a collision. He was much taller than me and sort of fronting up to me repeating that he wanted my details and me refusing, saying I don't think it was a collision, I think I might have hit something underneath my car. (For info my Mum and a friend have both been scammed on their insurance by people who claimed all kinds of things after very minor prangs)

Then he took an ID wallet out of his pocket and flipped it open to show a photo and badge and said he's Police. I couldn't tell if it was genuine or not. He held his phone up and said he's filming me refusing to comply with the law.
By this time the other man had come back and also filming me and I started to worry - I'm in a secluded area, with two men who are much bigger than me. I told them I felt intimidated and are they trying to scam me?

I got in my car and tried to shut the door but 1st man held onto it to prevent me. I asked if he's trying to detain me and he said no but I will if you don't give me your details, I've identified myself to you as a police officer. I said you've got no right to detain me. Eventually he let go of the door and I had to turn the car round as the lane is a dead end. Once I turned round he said again that I'm breaking the law by refusing to give my details after a collision and he started to recite the Caution they give when you're arrested! I drove away very shaken up, no idea what consequences to expect.

So clearly they were not police.

They are both Police.

A solution at last, I'm so pleased you've posted. Could you post your mobile number? Then all any woman who feels threatened has to do is ring you up and ask if the person they feel harassed by is indeed looking for women to attack, or just out for an innocent stroll. Thank you for your service.

"Then all any woman who feels threatened has to do is ring you up and ask if the person they feel harassed by is indeed looking for women to attack, or just out for an innocent stroll"

God forbid any woman would feel threatened by anyone after having damaged someone else's property then refusing to take reponsibility for it.

If these policemen had not flashed their badges I doubt she would have reported it.

No. The police usually try to arrest drivers who make off after an accident. That's literally part of their job.

Oh good lord… now there is a super secret update…

They were pretty good to be honest. I gave my statement while I was in the Macmillan unit having chemo because the utter prick who was harassing me didn’t know I had cancer. When he found that out, he tried to back track because the things he was accusing me of couldn’t possibly have happened because of the position I was in. He was a friend of my now ex-h’s OW. It’s a much longer story obviously. I did get an apology but he kept his job but was moved. He should have been sacked IMO.

Terrible to know he's still out there with all that power. X

@TheFormidableMrsC did you have to go through the Police's own complaints procedure before you could go to the IOPC?

I did. I told them that I was not accepting their explanation and was referred. It was a quick process.

Oh where, what have I missed?

That's good. I've started the complaints procedure and someone rang tonight to say they've got an 8 month backlog! He said they might be able to 'expedite' it 🤔

He's breached some rules to try to get at me so he's definitely going to be in a certain amount of trouble, even if it's not a dismissable breach.

I would think you will be in more trouble than them op. But glad they filmed it lol

Read the gov website. It is legal to call e police after and report if you haven’t exchange details. Unbelievable that you can in the same short post both minimise the police culpability in the murder if Sarah everard and tell the op lies that she’s committed a crime.

Good lord. Are you the sole inhabitant of a remote island where you live under a literal rock with no internet access and haven’t left for 10 years? Nothing else can explain this comment.

@zerofeeling would have said if there was a visible object that could have been hit or ran over that would have made the loud crunching sound other than the car she hit. Instead she just went from i though i hit it from the sound and the fact I was reversing into a too small space, to I didn't see any damage so I didn't hit it, the sound I heard was the underside of my car and I can't say what under my car caused the loud crunching noise nor can I point out/discribe what I hit other than the car (I'm paraphrasing here) if the mystery object/invisible car hadn't vanished.
Honestly after 20 pages of posts and responses from the op do you really believe that she wouldn't of mentioned the potential object she hit, or even had her partner check for damage under the car before she let him drive it if she really thought that she'd hit/run over anything other than the stationary car she hit?
No me neither hence my comment about the vanishing object.
The OPs story has more holes in it than my sieve

It turns out both these men are Police. There's been a significant update today but I'm not sure I'm able to discuss it on here without it getting too identifiable - sorry to be annoying!

You’ll get absolutely nowhere. It’s their words against yours regarding them being aggressive. They’ve got you on video refusing to give your details. Even to a non involved person it sounds like you’re doing this complaint in order to continue to try and wriggle out of the fact you hit their car. They will say you’re exaggerating/lying about what happened and in the circumstances there is no way any police complaints procedure will believe you over two police officers.

Even with what you describe it doesn’t particularly sound like they did something wrong. Apart from when you say he tried to hold your car door to stop you leaving. He shouldn’t have done that and had no need if he had your car reg. The problem is though even if they were still recording at that point I doubt they’d leave that bit of video in so you have no evidence and they will say you’re making that bit up. 🤷‍♀️

It still doesn’t change the fact you hit their car and at least now they know who you are so can follow that up with their insurance if his car is damaged.

"No. The police usually try to arrest drivers who make off after an accident. That's literally part of their job"

Critical thinking skills absent here I see.

Either

A) These police were undercover walking in the woods perhaps conducting a sting

Or

B ) they were off duty and not "doing their job" at the time......

Which do you think it is here?

To be fair you hit his car. I would be annoyed if someone hit my car trying to park in too small a space. He asked for your details and you refused. They were beginning their walk and had to return when they saw you hit their car it is not like he approached you. Next time give your details and take photos as now you have left the science of an accident.

Aah right…! Bet they were off to play golf. #hobby.

You do know that off duty officers have the same powers of arrest as if they are on duty.

Don't be a dickess.

I absolute do not minimise what happened to Sarah Everad but this is absolutely not the same and I think such comparisons are disgusting.

Sarah was out walking alone and approached by Couzens, while he was off duty posing as on duty and handcuffed and kidnapped her. Before doing unspeakable things.

OP was parking in a small spot, hit something, inspected the car behind her when the owners returned after also hearing an impact, asked for insurance info. She refused citing she didn't hit, she didn't see any damage, it might be a scam.. (even references a scam where her mam rearended someone she believed theyd claim) so they identified themselves. She was quite happy arguing with them, and only got intimidated when she was being filmed doing the wrong thing. Before that all she was scared about was a potential insurance increase.

And she only reported the collision to 101 because of advice here, after some asking.. ooh is it worth. And there was also no thought to report these policemen to 101 or 999 until chat on here but suddenly there's couzens comparisons. I think thats vile towards these two men, who I agree would have been better not touching her door, but were who they said they were and only wanted insurance info.

They didn't approach her unsolicited, they didn't touch her, they didn't ask for anything other than the usual insurance info post collision. She can feel however she likes but the comparisons between these men and couzens is quite frankly awful and I think that minimises what happened to Sarah

Not one person - including me - has said this is 'the same' as what happened to Sarah. Obviously it isn't but neither does it minimise it at all - after what happened to her (and other terrible incidents) the Police were show to be institutionally misogynist and promises were made that they would address this.

When someone with this officer's potential power and influence, knowing he's got his mate to back him up, is dealing with a lone civilian woman in a secluded area there's no excuse for him to not be aware of the power imbalance. There's no excuse for a man who's professionally trained to deal with the public in difficult situations, to react by shouting and trying to stop the woman getting to safety in her car after she's told him she doesn't feel safe with his behaviour. No excuse for pretending to arrest her. Plus his subsequent action which I can't detail at the moment.
It's obvious to me and the rational posters on here that his behaviour was completely out of line to the extent that he could be a serious liability in his professional role.

If you can't see how that ties in with what happened to Sarah and many other women, that's definitely your problem not mine.