Unpleasant altercation - who was the most unreasonable?

[zerofeeling]

Took my dogs out today and was trying to park in a small space between two cars on a country lane. As I was inching back to fit into the space I heard a loud crunch 😖

The two men from the car behind had just set off on their walk, as I got out of my car one of them was heading back towards me shouting why did I try to park in such a small space. I said sorry and inspected the front of his car - couldn't see any damage at all, and apart from a tiny paint scuff nothing on my car. I said to him 'i can't see any damage, it doesn't look like I hit you'
Man just glanced over at his car then asked me for my details, I asked is that necessary and said again there's no damage. He said that's not the point you have to give your details if you've been in a collision. He was much taller than me and sort of fronting up to me repeating that he wanted my details and me refusing, saying I don't think it was a collision, I think I might have hit something underneath my car. (For info my Mum and a friend have both been scammed on their insurance by people who claimed all kinds of things after very minor prangs)

Then he took an ID wallet out of his pocket and flipped it open to show a photo and badge and said he's Police. I couldn't tell if it was genuine or not. He held his phone up and said he's filming me refusing to comply with the law.
By this time the other man had come back and also filming me and I started to worry - I'm in a secluded area, with two men who are much bigger than me. I told them I felt intimidated and are they trying to scam me?

I got in my car and tried to shut the door but 1st man held onto it to prevent me. I asked if he's trying to detain me and he said no but I will if you don't give me your details, I've identified myself to you as a police officer. I said you've got no right to detain me. Eventually he let go of the door and I had to turn the car round as the lane is a dead end. Once I turned round he said again that I'm breaking the law by refusing to give my details after a collision and he started to recite the Caution they give when you're arrested! I drove away very shaken up, no idea what consequences to expect.

Whether he was actually a police officer or not, I would have done the same thing, OP. I have had police officers in the past try to intimidate me and I stood up to them.

I really do respect you for standing your ground with these men.

Crunch = damage. And he was right in saying you should report it, it's the law: https://www.police.uk/advice/advice-and-information/rs/road-safety/collisions/

None of us can tell whether or not his manner was unreasonable or intimidating, but from his standpoint you've crashed into his car - visible damage or not, you both heard the crunch - and then you've refuted the point and refused to give your details. You can understand him being frustrated at the very least!

From what you've said, you sound the unreasonable one to me and quite irresponsible really I'm sorry to say - you should have given your details and taken photos of both cars. I imagine he's taken your numberplate details down and there will be follow up later. At the very least you should report it to 111 now.

So you were trying to fit in a small space, you heard a crunch, you had paint on your car, and refused to give your details

And you think he was in the wrong for being upset. Did I get all of that correct?

Yes he did - he wasn't far away, just not in a position to be able to see.

That's how I read it too and in his shoes I would be mightily pissed off.

Also if you are ever unsure if someone is a police officer you take down their badge number and verify it with the police.

I think taking a video of the ‘non-damage’ would have been a better option than refusing to give details given the sound of a collision.

I don’t understand how exchanging details would have opened you up to a scam? If he had made up any fake damage and tried to claim your caused it he wouldn’t have been scamming you he would be scamming the insurance company. It sounds like you were immediately evasive. Take photos of the cars involved , exchange details and leave it to the insurance companies to sort out. You made it a much bigger thing that it needed to be.

If the crunch was loud enough that they heard it most likely you did hit the car, it is unlikely to be a scam as it relies on someone trying to park in a small space and hit something within a distance of where they are still around to witness. There are a lot of variables there.

you are best off reporting the accident yourself as most likely they have your licence plate and may report you for driving away without exchanging details.

You are massively in the wrong. You said the space was small, you heard a crunch, you got out to check, there was a mark on your car. If you are involved in an accident you exchange details.

The flip side…. Went for a walk today, just left the car and I heard a crunch, I went back to check and someone had squeezed into a space that was beyond their driving ability, bumped my car, they know they did this because they got out to check. They then denied this because there wasn’t enough visible damage. I explained the rule of exchanging details but instead she went into panic mode, I tried to calm her by explaining my job and she drove off.

Fingers crossed he got your reg so that he can report you properly for leaving the scene of an accident. What you going to do when those officers come knocking? Jump out your kitchen window and hide in the shed?

You were not unreasonable - he was aggressive. But you should report to the insurance company as you should have exchanged details. However I get feeling intimidated. I had similar in a petrol station a few months ago. I was reversing. I checked my mirrors and my reversing camera. I then looked in my wing mirror and heard a bang. I made contact with someone behind me who wasn't there then was. He was turning onto the forecourt but insisted he wasn't moving. He was aggressive. I asked him to stop shouting at me and he got another man to tell me he wasn't shouting. Maybe he wasn't shouting but he was certainly raising his voice and I felt intimidated. We exchanged numbers. There was zero damage to his car. He then tried to get me to admit liability by WhatsApp and claimed he had the CCTV. He didn't. He wanted me to replace his car seats. I said I had reported it to the insurance stating no damage and he should report it. Never heard from him again.

No. I had a scuff on my car paint not paint from his car.
I don't even know if the scuff was caused today, dh has been away with the car for a week. There was absolutely no damage that I could see to his car and he didn't seem at all interested in checking for himself which is what initially made me suspicious.

Isn’t it illegal to not report an incident such as this, if there is damage ? I would get it reported.

You have committed an offence. Leaving the scene of an accident.

My Dad hit a car in our street and went to the neighbours door, she came out effing and blinding and screeching. My dad said ‘I’m not talking to you like this, send your man you d and I’ll sort out the insurance.’ It was her partners car.

The police turned up few hours later and my Dad was cautioned as he was deemed to have failed to stop and report and accident despite the fact he had let the vehicle know what happened and was willing to give his insurance info.

Yes.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=uk+is+it+illegal+to+drive+off+after+hitting+another+car&client=safari&sca_esv=4da7261d6af0beeb&source=hp&ei=rWBlaM_FKsyl0PEPs9DlsQQ&iflsig=AOw8s4IAAAAAaGVuvXV_JLIuko3rIKue4R85ApkoTldt&ved=0ahUKEwiP0Mmzzp6OAxXMEjQIHTNoOUYQ4dUDCCs&uact=5&oq=uk+is+it+illegal+to+drive+off+after+hitting+another+car&gs_lp=Egdnd3Mtd2l6Ijd1ayBpcyBpdCBpbGxlZ2FsIHRvIGRyaXZlIG9mZiBhZnRlciBoaXR0aW5nIGFub3RoZXIgY2FyMggQABiABBiiBDIIEAAYgAQYogQyCBAAGIAEGKIEMggQABiABBiiBEimoQFQrApYmJ8BcAJ4AJABAJgBgQGgAeclqgEFNDMuMTO4AQPIAQD4AQGYAjqgAuYoqAIKwgIKEAAYAxjqAhiPAcICChAuGAMY6gIYjwHCAg4QLhiABBixAxiDARiKBcICCxAAGIAEGLEDGIMBwgIEEAAYA8ICCBAAGIAEGLEDwgILEC4YgAQYsQMYgwHCAgUQABiABMICDhAAGIAEGLEDGIMBGIoFwgIFEC4YgATCAgYQABgWGB7CAgUQABjvBcICCxAAGIAEGIYDGIoFwgIIEAAYogQYiQXCAgUQIRigAcICBxAhGKABGArCAgUQIRifBZgDEfEFXdUq-yPAAsuSBwUzNi4yMqAHxbgCsgcFMzQuMjK4B9AowgcJMC4xMC40Mi42yAeZAg&sclient=gws-wiz

it doesn’t sound like a scam given the circumstances you describe and the veracity of him being a policeman is easy to check.

the fact is a sound was heard like a possible crash, you initially assumed you had and just because there was no visible damage doesn’t mean there wasn’t

I would have spoken to you in exactly the same way probably worse if you hit my car and assumed you did no damage and tried to drive off
( minus the police badge as I’m not a police officer )

a man reversed into my husbands Mercedes a few years ago adament he did no damage but he hit the badge off and and damaged the bumper and cost around 1k quid to get fixed through insurance although apart from the badge you couldn’t see any damage

luckily we had dash cams as proof otherwise it would have been a hit to our insurance

@zerofeeling what you can expect is to be arrested for leaving the scene of an accident and possibly resisting arrest and failing to provide your details to an officer of the law.
You were ridiculously stupid in not providing your insurance details (which you legally have to do) especially after you were shown a warrant card. As for driving off when the officer was holding onto the door that was so reckless you could have seriously injured him and then you'd be facing serious jail time.
Next time you crash into a stationary vehicle hand over your insurance details and take photos of the damage

OP you are in the wrong and you know it. You hit the car and using the sympathy vote to convince yourself you were jn the right.

The idiot shouldn't have stopped you from getting in your car but if that was me I wouls most probably have hurled a rock at your window as you drove away. Or when in a more sane moment taken your reg and reported you to the police and insurance company as they will be able to track you down

If you had concerns about whether he was a police officer why didnt you lock youself in your car and phone the police immediately. Imppersonating a police office is an offence they will take very seriously. And where do you think the paint scuff came from if not his bumper.

@zerofeeling you realise you do need to ring the police now don't you?

I understand leaving because they were intimidating you and you weren't 100% sure they were police. But you do need to contact the police right now and explain yourself.

And yes, I do think you hit the car. Otherwise, what was the noise?

If it is a scam it seems very opportunistic considering he wasn’t even in his car when you crashed into it. Are you suggesting he just parks his car in places all of the time in the hope people crash into it, deny it and then he can claim off of them? The fact he was walking away initially seems a potential flaw in the scam because it sounds like you would have just driven off without leaving details anyway so I’m not sure how he would have benefited.

That’s different than your OP, but ok. So everything else is correct, if so you were totally in the wrong.

I don’t know your laws but this would be considered a hit and run where I live. Appreciate it may be different in your area.

That aside you were totally unreasonable.

You take pictures and video. Talk to the man like an adult. Fine if you don’t admit fault (honestly I wouldn’t admit fault even if I was), exchange details, and let the insurance company sort it out. That would not have escalated the situation. If you were feeling at risk for your safety you could have got into your car and held your details up to the window for him to get a photo.

Again, the paint scuff was solely on my car paintwork, not from his.

If you hit another car (however minor), it is technically law to provide your details if there's any damage (s170 RTA). The problem is there could be 'unseen' damage or they could claim that there is scrapes etc (hope you took pics). It's ok though, you can report an accident within 24 hours to the police and you're covered legally (I.e. won't be charged with an offence).

On second thought… why did you not believe he was police? I’m assuming you would have called the actual police if you thought some rando was impersonating an officer.