Husband says he is embarrassed by our adult kids

[TudorMary]

This is my first post and it’s long and has a few strands and don’t know where to start I keep rewriting.

I thought we were happy and husband was a good father. Kids no longer go on holiday with us etc and this upsets my husband.

Three kids. Elder 2 definitely took scenic route. Dropped out of uni, now happily working, 2 initially took science, failed 1st year exams, took year out now finishing 2nd year of Humanities degree at local university. Both live at home along with number 3 who last week came home to say she was convinced she had failed one of her papers, I think this is correct having done big of research which means she won’t get first choice and she now wants year off.

My husband has gone fucking ballistic and has gone from blaming me to blaming himself for not standing up to me. He has called all the kids losers but thankfully not to their faces but has said to daughter she will have to go to whatever uni will have her.

Now if you are with me! Husband close to brother and I actually like him and his wife but only when we meet them alone. When the kids were younger I used to have anxiety every time we saw them with kids. They had tons of them. It was chaotic. Litter on the floor. Debris everywhere. Rotting food the lot. Kids were sworn in front of, occasionally sworn at, if a risqué anecdote had to be told it was told no matter if the kids were around. and spoken at like they were 30. No concessions were ever made for their age.

First time we went out a four year old actually summoned a waiter to order another fizzy drink. Two year old given a knife to cut their birthday cake. I was on tenterhooks and no exaggeration sometimes took to my bed after seeing them.

Well every single one of their older children are either at medical school, are studying or graduated from an Oxbridge College.

My husband is now suggesting sister-in-law is parent of the year and he should have stood up to my prissy ways. A bone of contention is that they all still holiday together whereas our kids don’t want to know. He is embarrassed by our beautiful kids.

I am so sorry this is a novel. I am heartbroken thinking I must have done something wrong.

None of your kids seem to me like the ‘failures’ your husband obviously thinks they are! If I’m reading this right, two of them are working and happy and one of these two is finishing a course as well? That’s pretty good going. The third ‘thinks’ she didn’t do well on one exam and seems to have written herself off (your OH definitely has). What’s for you won’t go by you as they say, I’m sure all three will end up in a place that’s right for them.
What does he mean by blaming your ‘prissy ways’ for how they’ve turned out? I’m going to assume from that because you possibly didn’t stand over them like a task master while they studied six hours a day it must be your fault and with the benefit of hindsight he would have done a much better job? What a prick. He missed his chance to take a more active role and for what it’s worth it’s probably better he didn’t because you may have ended up with three doctors or lawyers but who are unhappy with anxiety issues.
Im guessing that your in laws had a more permissive and less authoritarian style of parenting, and, while this might have looked like chaos a lot of time, it didn’t do them any harm and they’ve ended up closer to their father because they don’t constantly feel his disapproval.
Lots of older teenage and adult children don’t go on holiday with their parents! It’s not necessarily about their relationship, unless they have directly said as much?
You could try to have a conversation with your OH along the lines of ‘look, we can encourage the children but ultimately we have to let them follow their own paths’. Remind him of what they have achieved and what is wonderful about each of them. And try to discourage him from comparing to his family. Also a reminder what perhaps if he wasn’t so critical they would want to spend more time with him.
Ultimately I couldn’t be with man who would mistreat his children like this, who I wasnt able to have a honest conversation about it with and who would have the audacity to blame me for all his perceived failings of his children! Not only is it not good for you, your relationship with the children could be affected too if they ever perceive you to be taking his side. Try to fix it if you can but you may have to consider taking a separate path yourself for the sake of the children.

Or move it to the next level and get some goats. They will teach everyone about self confidence, pushing boundaries, being part of a herd and finding your place and not judging other goat'slife choices. And they shit everywhere, but it doesn't bother them or any other goat.

Also the state of the house etc is nothing to do with destiny’s of the kids. The kids have some an altitude and school and parents have helped somehow, kids have to want this. Once at uni it’s not really parents responsibility to ensure they are studying!

Agreed. Your kids sound fine, if a little lacklustre.

Your attitude to the other family is very telling however, sounds like their kids have grown up being empowered and trusted/allowed to make decisions within boundaries.

So they were allowed to speak to a waiter, What's so odd about that? Other than being an excellent example of confidence. 2 year old used a knife? Again, What's the issue? Presumably they didn't leave her alone with it? At what age did your kids learn to use a knife? Mine were all using chopping/cutting knives at that age, with appropriate supervision. Surely that's normal.

Sil and niece discussing the pathologising of normal human emotions, sounds much like the coping skills we have gone through with our kids since they were old enough to worry about things. "Yes, worry/anger/sadness etc are uncomfortable emotions, but they're normal and can't hurt you. They don't control you, you have to just ride it out" etc. A perfectly normal conversation, and a very similar one to that which I had with my 14 year old daughter the other week. I'm assuming you're joking about having to go off and look it up.

It does sound very much like you are the deciding factor in your household, and have very much done things your way regardless of whether your husband agreed. You have always assumed you were right, and doing things the only right way. As such, you looked askance at your Sil's family and their way of doing things, assuming you were in the right. But now, their kids are happy, confident and succeeding academically...and yours aren't so much.

So DH is now looking at you and saying "hold on, all these years you've been rolling your eyes at them and insisting we do things your way, and now look how it's turned out". He should have stood his ground if he believed otherwise and if he didn't, then it was his call too obviously

It was chaotic. Litter on the floor. Debris everywhere. Rotting food the lot. Kids were sworn in front of, occasionally sworn at, if a risqué anecdote had to be told it was told no matter if the kids were around. and spoken at like they were 30. No concessions were ever made for their age.

Their kids may very well be anxious over-achievers due to the neglect they experienced in their childhood. You don't know how someone is really doing. You hear about so many successful people who have accomplished amazing things, who were also completely miserable and some even committed suicide. You just don't know.

In my opinion, success in the eyes of others is only worth it if you don't also have a good quality of life and are happy. OP, you kids seem happy and independent (if not yet financially). Your husband needs to wind his neck in. Kids don't exist to make their parents look good, that's not their job. It's the parents job to help the kids become independent.

Furthermore, if "success" is so important to your husband, why did he not pursue it himself? I take it that he is not a nuclear physicist with a degree from Cambridge.

Honestly it sounds like your DH is just having a wobble. He's not doing it in front of your DCs, which is good. He's been a good father and husband up to now, you've been happy. All this is still true, minus a temporary wobble. Your DCs like you enough to comfortably live at home. And bonus, you get to holiday without them. I am a messy parent like your SIL, but my DCs meandered like yours. Now they are all doing really well in life. After crap A levels and the gap year (working in a fast food place)... oldest scraped into uni, found his calling, got a PhD and is now a senior scientist. Second apparently hated her uni course but only admitted this years later and I so wish she had felt confident and secure enough to tell us at the time, as your DC did. That's a credit to you. And yes I also felt pangs of guilt when I looked at relatives with their A-star kids. But I'm so proud of my DCs. They all found their calling because of rather despite their meandering. They had time to reflect, experiment and actively chose their vocations. Many of their A-star friends hate their jobs because their academic success pushed them onto a conveyor belt of high-expectations and achievement. They didn't feel they had autonomy and now feel trapped.
Finally, please ignore those who rush to harsh judgment here. It can become like a feeding frenzy.

Also, learn to enjoy holidays with your husband or even alone. Rediscover yourself before you had kids!

I totally agree with this!

There was no mention of swearing 'at' children in a hostile way as a pp mentioned; simply that language and stories weren't censored around them. So perhaps they did have to grow up more quickly, became more confident, with a wide vocabulary and no issues expressing themselves. Of course a four year old could ask a waiter for a drink and I'd have no issue with a two year old cutting a birthday cake. And if the house is piled with magazines and newspapers, well, at least they're reading.

Tbh I read it as a defensive response to her husband's criticisms and comparisons first and foremost - that's who she is being directly compared to. I get that. I think, contrary to the impression of the Mrs Bennett-esque swooning, that she sounds quite relaxed about letting her children find their own way. Some of us would encourage our children to stick at something no matter what, others of us would encourage them to switch paths if it would make them happier, some of us would try to find a middle ground. I think ultimately her husband is jealous of someone else's kids and is making her feel like shit about her parenting so she's lashing out at those shes being compared to.

Given how critical you are of each other, and those around you, I am not surprised if your children have some.self doubt.

But it's mad to write them off when they are (from the sound of things) in their early 20s!

The whole thing is very odd. Stop comparing to others.

A cautionary tale here OP.

My dad was very much like your husband. He had a scholarship to a boy's public school and then another one to Oxford, he was an academic star. He had an incredibly successful career and he took as read that all his kids would be similarly successful.

He put masses of academic pressure on me as a child and would shout at me for being a "failure" because I wasn't a straight A student. I didn't do badly at school but I wasn't good across the board and I wasn't one of the star pupils and it was never good enough. It damaged my relationship with him considerably and I went fairly badly off the rails as a teenager: lots of drug-taking and staying away from home for days on end etc. My relationship with him never fully recovered.

I pulled it together in time to get OK A levels and got into a decentish university and I'm fine now and have a happy and stable life. But I was left with a lifelong sense of having disappointed him and never being good enough which has cast a shadow over my self-esteem all my life and still causes me problems now. I'm also pretty sure that if I'd been supported more and judged less I would have done better academically: I'd have spent less time trying to blot the judgement out with drink and drugs, slept with fewer men who didn't deserve me and done better in my degree.

Your husband will push your kids away if he carries on like this and if you don't stand up for them they will never forgive you. You have a choice now: you either stand up for them and draw a line in the sand or you leave him.

It's very unfair on you because this isn't your fault. But you will be blamed (as I blamed my mum) if you don't make clear who's side you're on. Your husband is a dick. Don't let him ruin your kids' lives.

All I read is you, you, you.
What about him, him, him?

What has he done?
Did he do the cryptic crossword with them?
How often did he read to them?
What help did he give them with their homework?
How much did he help them with their revision?
Did he go through their textbooks with them?
Was he helping them study?

He’s shirking responsibility by just blaming you.

If he thinks one parent could have done it all, then that parent could have been him.

Ha! Yes, I have to agree with that, in my experience. When my kids were younger, unlike me, my mum friends were academics with PhDs all over the place. Their houses and lives in general were pretty chaotic and messy, but happy.

Much as we loved them, I do recall my late DH and I commenting to each other back on the day about how lax my SIL and her DH were in bringing up their kids, who were the same age as ours. We were pretty conscientious parents and they were completely lackadaisical.

Our kids are now late thirties, and it's my nephew and niece who are the more successful, and have the closer and more relaxed relationship with their parents. Of course my own kids are doing fine, just not as successful as their cousins. And though we love each other very much and get on well, I'm aware that my DDs are not as open and relaxed with me, and I blame myself for that. I've often thought that maybe I should have been more like SIL.

Speaking as someone whose parents have had high expectations of them- I have tried to meet these and often felt a failure, often put what I knew would make my parents happy instead of what I felt was right for me. I have done ok in school/life- got first class degrees but never lived up to their expectations. I don’t think this kind of parenting works at all.

my kids are being raised to follow what they want to do and follow their own dreams- if one wants to drop out of school then I will talk it through with them to make sure they have a plan but if yes then I would support them and build up their confidence.

although your husband didn’t call your kids losers to their face, I would put money on the fact that each one knows exactly how he feels about them. Instead of terrorising your daughter at this point in her life about what will come next and making her even more insecure and worried about it, please talk to him and as a united front talk to your daughter and let her know you can see how hard she has worked and she’ll make the best of whatever situation is ahead of her.

your husband should be be embarrassed of himself not your kids.

the fact that you also seem to crave academic excellence for your kids and compare them to your SIL is also embarrassing I’m sorry to say. Maybe they are there because they have been given a life of freedom and support???

I read the OP as saying number 3 thinks she's failed an A Level paper and won't get into her first choice uni. And her dh is saying she'll have to go to whatever uni will take her. Please don't let that happen OP, is she really has done badly - degrees cost such a lot that she needs to be making the right decision. Surely after number 1 wasting a year (?) of fees then dropping out, and number 2 wasting a year of fees on the wrong subject, he doesn't want the same thing to happen again? First, wait and see what her results are, then if she misses out, see if there's a uni she actively wants to go to in clearing, but if not - a year out to reflect/work/retake etc would be a much better option.

Are your kids happy? In general I mean, as everyone has their occasional low points. Did you do everything you possibly could to support them in whatever they wanted to do? (unless it was dangerous/would hurt others/ is illegal). Then congratulations you are a good parent imo.

It sounds to me like your DH has “grass is always greener” type syndrome. There will nearly always be kids who do better academically/job wise than yours and nearly always kids that do worse too. Just as I suspect there are plenty of people who did better at school/uni and earn more than your husband or yourself. Who knows what could happen in the future with your nieces/nephews - they may continue to be uber successful or suffer from burn out or sadly be unhappy in other ways, no-one can predict these things.

If in 10 years none of your kids are in stable employment that they enjoy or at least tolerate or none have attempted to move out even to shared housing (eg. the usual markers of adulthood unless extreme SN or disability) then maybe you needed to have pushed them harder to be more independent or been tougher on them. But at the moment they are young enough to still be finding their feet/ what they want to do in life. Your husband is being ridiculous imo. We only get one life and happiness is more important that what uni you went to or what job you have.

So you have:

1 child who is working.

1 child at University who changed courses but is completing their chosen degree.

1 child I presume who is doing A'levels and is worried about 1 exam but planning to go to University. They might get their second choice of University rather than first though.

What on earth is the problem? (apart from your husband).

Your children sound absolutely fine and progressing with their choices in life.

To be honest I don't think I would want to holiday with your husband. Why would they choose to spend time with him with his unfairly critical attitude to his children.

You don't know that they are happy.

OP, do you want to holiday with your husband?

Or that they are going to be successful. They are in an academic process and starting careers. That's no indication they will be successful in that area or happy.

Mmm split on this one. I'm thinking of a couple of people i know, the op could be one the sil the other. The chaotic house isn't chaotic as such and is basically clean under the piles of books, papers, musical instruments, pets etc. The other sniffs if so much as one speck of dust is created. Of course the Sil house could br down right disgusting but somehow I think it's not that bad (wiping down baseboards daily???)

The chaotic house people just value other things, getting outside and experiencing life, reading, fostering a love of music. The children were encouraged to reach for the sky but also given the security of knowing their parents loved and would always catch them. The other one isn't as close with her children, was always too busy to spend time with them.

Your husband sounds a knob! Kids often don't flourish if they are criticised (even if it's not openly) as it knocks their confidence. What matters is that they are happy, doing some sort of paid employment to finance themselves and are generally "good" citizens. Some comparing - comparison is of course the thief of joy. Support them and love them, ditch the husband baggage.

Your husband is a bastard. The only thing parents should want their kids to be is happy. Everything else will follow from that.

It doesn’t sound as though your children have done particularly well for themselves, to be honest, and I can see why your husband is disappointed. But what really stands out to me from your post is how judgmental you are about your in laws’ children. What on earth is wrong with a four year old ordering a drink? My daughter was always able to ask for what she wanted in a restaurant by that age. And I don’t see anything wrong in a two year old having a knife if there was a degree of supervision. I think you clearly have a problem if you needed to take to your bed after seeing your in laws 😆😆😆

It sounds like there are a number of things being conflated here.

You sound jealous of your SIL. So what if her kids went to Oxbridge despite being allowed fizzy drinks and having a messy house? Also the fizzy drink incident and the knife thing clearly happened over a decade ago - let it go.

Did your husband go ballistic because he's still supporting three adult kids to live at home rather than fend for themselves in the big bad world? I suspect so from the reluctance to let your youngest have a year out. He probably doesn't want to pay for them to doss around, then drop out of university. And TBH I wouldn't want to, either.

Maybe you don't have academic kids, and that's fine, but I also don't think parents have a responsibility to keep supporting adult children well into their 20s while they decide what they want to do with their lives. Part of being a parent is supporting children to be independent. You need to cut the apron strings, and that sounds like something you're reluctant to do.