There's something racist about toilet provision in the UK.

[The13thFairy]

Am I being unreasonable to think there's something racist about 'oh, women and men can use the same toilets' here in the UK, when in developing countries and refugee camps, providing clean, safe and separate facilities for girls and women is seen to be of the utmost importance - because we know those foreign fellas will prey on them every chance they get; peeping, assaulting, you name it. Our British chaps, though, wouldn't say boo to a goose! Perfectly safe. Won't cause a moment's unease. Totally trustworthy, every man jack of them.

I think this is two separate issues.

The UK does not particularly care about women's rights. Nor does the rest of the world, generally. However, we understand that men in times of war can carry out crimes where they have opportunity to do so. Unfortunately, I think women would have the same concerns here too.

Separately, the public do have a view that sexual offenders are foreign, when the last statics from ONS and released on the gov website on this topic prove otherwise. I blame the media and propaganda.

Would I like unisex public toilets (where there's more than one toilet together)? No because to me ethnicity doesn't matter, the reason is men. Amnesty International need to get in the bin with their toilet stance though.

That's exactly it.

Exactly.

And isn't it racist to suggest that some cultures are better than others?

They're not suggesting that though.

Single sex spaces weren't removed here because everyone agreed Western/white men are no longer a risk to women but because they didn't care enough about that risk to women living in the West to tell men they couldn't use women's single sex spaces if they wanted to.

I do not see it as racist but provision is never fair or equal as the female provision is usually less than the amount of provision for men.

Usually covering the same physical area space but as women need all cubicles and men do not it means there can be more provision for men in the same space meaning there is often less provision for women meaning more queues.

Womens toilets should be 50% bigger than mens to accommodate the same amount of toilet provision as men have. If they can fit in 1 cubicle and 5 urinals then the females should have more space to fit in 6 cubicles to match the provision for 6 men.

OP, wouldn't your time be better spent concerning yourself about those developing counties, which have no toilet facilities at all?

They're not suggesting that though.

Single sex spaces weren't removed here because everyone agreed Western/white men are no longer a risk to women but because they didn't care enough about that risk to women living in the West to tell men they couldn't use women's single sex spaces if they wanted to.

Much of the TWAW rhetoric is predicated on the risk to women being recognised and some men claimed to be women and so claimed to need the same protections as women from other men.

I absolutely agree that the attitude that single-sex toilets are necessary in the developing world, but unnecessary in the white democracies, is racist. It definitely implies that brown men cannot be trusted whereas white men are somehow better.

It is also entirely misogynistic to say that women anywhere should not have access to safer, more dignified, ie single-sex, toilets.

i don’t recall any sign in any toilet in the UK saying ‘British only’. So presumably, as our population is quite diverse, people of all races/cultures use toilets here.
I do think toilets should be separate, but I don’t think think you can spin combining them here as racism because others do not. Plenty of other countries have combined sexes toilets/changing facilities.

Gender neutral public toilets here have cubicles and doors. In some places in India there is nowhere to go except out in the open.

In gender neutral public toilets in the UK nobody has to take their pants down with a man looking on. There's a door you can lock. That's the difference.

A big difference at that!

Racist? 🙄

So why are amnesty international not campaigning for mixed sex toilets with doors in India? They are campaigning for single sex spaces in developing countries. If mixed sex spaces are so safe, why not campaign for them in India?

Can we get some perspective, here? UK gender neutral toilets have cubicles with lockable doors.

Women in the countries various aid groups are campaigning for often have to go out in the open. In fields, as one PP mentioned, by the roadside, sometimes even in the street.

Nobody has to take their knickers down in the UK in the open. That's the difference.

If gender neutral toilets had no doors, or had urinals for the men, you'd have a point.

The only difference between gender neutral and ladies only loos is you might see a man next to you at the wash basin. You cannot compare that with having to take your knickers down and lift your dress up in full view of anyone walking past.

Definition of Racism- Racism is when a person is treated worse, excluded, disadvantaged, harassed, bullied, humiliated or degraded because of their race or ethnicity.

This isn't an issue for Race. It's not xenophobic either. It's gender politics.

I agree with your point OP - the implication is that men in the UK are civilised and can be trusted to not assault women, while men in other countries are uncivilised and can't be trusted. Imo there are men who will happily commit assault anywhere and so both sets of women need protection.

Because at the moment they are campaigning for something that doesn't exist at all in a culture that isn't used to the concept of PT. This is a starting point. But it should be pointed out that there are also sanitation reasons for providing toilets and this issue is also being addressed by aid organisations so that toilet facilities are available to all.

Gender neutral toilets are not a new thing in this country. I have been in plenty of restaurants where there is one toilet area for both genders with two cubicles and a washbasin area. Nobody thought this was a problem, mostly because it isn't a problem.

Unisex toilets have existed here in various spaces for at least 50 years. Not every public space has room for separate toilet facilities.

But isn’t it racist to imply men of certain cultures cannot be trusted in mixed sex spaces but men of other cultures are? Can you imagine if a Reformed politician said that? These orgs are implying men in developing countries are more dangerous to women than Western men. If they did not believe thst, they would be campaigning for mixed sex toilets in developing countries as well as in the UK wouldn’t they?

Of course it's xenophobic to make that claim about men from other cultures. I'm still not sure it's racist, but certainly that statement is xenophobic. But the OP original question/point about the "toilet provision in thus country is racist"....that was odd. I understand the comments about cultural differences impacting the very presence of a unisex facility...but, im just saying that I believe it's possibly xenophobic rather than racist. Being a potential sex offender isn't more likely because of where you're from- and yes, whoever made that sort of statement needs to explain what they're actually saying. There's enough discrimination in this world, without orgs drumming up unnecessary fear.

most people i know are able to be concerned at several different issues before breakfast.

So it is possible to wish for more single sex facilities in the UK and also wish for any single sex facilities in other places. And the two are not equated because they are two separate issues.

The starting point is having access to toilet facilities per se. Anything, thereafter, might be considered a luxury.

No. There are huge inequalities between life in Britain and, say, India in many respects.

So should we stop wanting better things for ourselves, or to get our single sex spaces back, until everyone in India has access to a toilet with a door? Don't be soft.

It is perfectly possible to want both things. Or are you going to forego all your wage increases until everyone in India earns the same as you? Or are you going to stop going to school at 10 until all girls in the world get to go to secondary?

Well if I still had a wage, I wouldn't be comparing any increase to that in India. Why would I? You can be concerned about (perceived) inequalities, without forcing a label on it; which the OP has.

Yes alot of TRAs seem to actively not want universal toilets or individual stalls for everyone. Which makes you think.

It’s not racist to have separate facilities for men and women.
Trans shite has its rancid tentacles everywhere.
Which is another reason why the Supreme Court decision is so important.