“Paedophile hunters”

[Yellowdaffodilss]

I remember quite a few years ago now, these paedophile hunter’s started appearing on social media. Videos of them meeting people who had been talking to what they believed were underage children. I remember thinking , oh wow they’re out there protecting our children. Maybe a naive view , I don’t know.

But now , more and more , I see it becoming a regular thing and I am seeing time and time again that the so called predators they catch ( not all the time, there are times that they are grown adults knowing what they’re doing ) are very clearly people with additional needs / autism. I find it disturbing to watch - I have seen young adults panicking and not really knowing what they’re doing or the implications . It’s clear that the messages in the videos I have seen are between the “ culprit” and an ‘underage child’ discussing meeting up , when yes they have been clear they are underage but it is also clear that it has not been sexual talk and these people are not understanding that what they are doing is wrong.

I remember years ago my sister and her friend talking to a lad of around 19. My sister and her friend were chatting and asking if the lad liked the friend and he was inviting them around to his house for a sleepover and to watch movies. ( my sister told my mom as she was worried ) I went through all the messages and could see it was not sexual . This lad thought they were friends . I looked at his profile and he was clearly autistic and his emotional and mental age was probably the same as my sister and her friend. I spoke to his mother who was so thankful that I messaged and confirmed he was quite severely autistic.

My son is autistic and always been drawn to girls as friends rather than boys . He also always gets on with those younger because he is on their level more. He wouldn’t even know how to talk sexually - he’s got a very limited understanding. I can’t stop him having a phone , he’s now 18 . Luckily I’m very aware and have spoken to him about this and keep tabs on him but it’s very hard. This kind of thing really worries me.

It makes me think whether these groups are doing more harm than good. They’re outing people publicly , and for those who are vulnerable with no understanding then it could do so much harm. I get that parents should be monitoring phone use but quite frankly not all parents do.

I do also wonder - can charges be made if there is no ‘real’ victim - it’s an adult they’re talking to … I guess it could get the culprits investigated more and maybe find out more things but other than that is it not just vigilante behaviour? And also , is their real good intention there from all of them or is it a case of getting social media famous ? Could it even be that they target those who they can see are more vulnerable as it will be an easy ‘catch’ ?

Neurodivergence does not mean there not a sex drive! Nor does it mean that there is no understanding of what is not appropriate. If your children or young adults fall into the category of not understanding, being on the internet is not for them

My issue with a lot of these vigilante types is that they seem to want the attention.

Saying that, there’s also no denying that being SN/ND/what have you doesn’t preclude you from being inappropriate and that’s also a problem. Especially coupled with immaturity.

Not schools, social clubs
Someone else mentioned it upthread too

At the end of the day ,anyone who has a sexual interest in children needs dealing with. But- not in this way. There will be many of these that will be being monitored by the police through their Internet use/ chatrooms etc. Or the police could be gathering evidence ready to put their door in. The 'evidence' these people record on camera could be inadmissible in court. I know the police are shit at times, but there's an awful lot going on behind the scenes that we are not privy to. Leave them to it.

But if he behaved inappropriately towards a younger child the effect on them would be the same regardless of his capacity for understanding.
So I guess you, like many other parents/carers will need to safeguard him and potentially others, especially once he reaches sexual maturity by making sure does not inadvertently harm a younger child without realising.

Im an Adoscents SW and it is very very common for SEN /ND children to behave very unsafely online, both as victim and perpetrator of grooming and or CSE.
However the parents of said children are the hardest to convince that they need to be kept away from tech and will find any excuse to avoid this or down right ignore our advice
Drives me insane.

I work in this area and we are so busy. It is relentless.
Identifying the suspect is reasonably straightforward. Doing it all according to law and getting convictions takes time.

I worded this really badly. I’ve had some midweek alcohol because I don’t have to work tomorrow. Not the media. I am angry at how easy it is for strangers to interact online with absolutely nothing to prevent it. My friends son thought he had a “girlfriend” online and did things he shouldn’t have done or certainly didn’t understand he shouldn’t have done. The other person lied about her age and presented as several years older. He is autistic and quite badly affected with social interaction being a massive problem. Found confidence online. Paid a huge price that will affect him forever and he doesn’t get it at all. He will never have a job, he will never live independently. The access to SM and the ease at which this can happen with lonely and sexually frustrated teens. Not excusing it. As I said I have an AuDHD teen myself who I watch like a hawk because I can see this happening to him.

This is why I think they should ask for ID for dating/ chat sites.

To add, my son is 14. I’d say he was around 4 years behind in development. He prefers friendships with younger kids as he can cope with that. He can’t cope or keep up with kids of his own age. I am aware he still has feelings of a pubescent teen and I worry about that obviously!

I agree. They don’t think of the connotations of putting it out online. Your son will likely have to change his name by deed poll.

Well no they won't be sending a person with the mind of a two year old too prison will they ,he can't talk at all only Has the very basic understanding of the world around him ,he certainly won't be able to send sexually ,explicit messages or have any understanding of what ,it means he can just about trace a few letters of his name and indenify numbers 1-3 ,this isn't going to change .
As an adolescent SW I would thought you should have at least a basic idea that disabilities can range from mild to profound.

Young people lie about their age. The onus is on the ‘of age’ person in that relationship to verify they are 100 percent telling the truth before they engage in any form of sexually activity.

Anyone who does not have ‘ capacity’ to understand that should not have access to social media where they can meet people and then behave inappropriately or illegally in some cases.

@Yellowdaffodilss I'm not sure why quite a few PP have missed the point of your post as I think you've been very clear in the type of circumstances you're talking about. I just wanted to say I've not really watched any of these videos although I am aware of them and I haven't really given it much thought before I read your post.

I have a 5yr old DS who has SN and whilst obviously he is far too young to be chatting to anyone on social media it has made me aware of the need to educate him specifically about how innocent conversations with underage people could be interpreted when he does become of the age where he could be chatting online so thank you.

I'll also be ensuring I have the conversation with my friend who has a 16yr old DC who is very innocent and spends a lot of time chatting online to others (pretty much unmonitored I believe) to make sure she talks to him, as he would be exactly like the person you've described in the video you saw, delighted to make a new friend and has no idea about sex or sexual conversations and would be devastated if he was targeted by these wannabe vigilantes

He was 19 when it happened. Not ideal, perhaps, but hardly shocking and certainly not pedophilic. I was 15 when I lost my virginity to a 19 year old, there was nothing creepy or wrong about it at all.

You probably didn’t realise there wasn’t anything creepy or wrong about it because you were so young. At 19, would you have willingly slept with a 15 year old boy?

Your friends child sounds a like a prime target for online grooming and or CSE.

The police are catching people all the time. In the majority of cases it just doesn't get publicised.
Reoffending is an issue and as many have commented on this thread, how do you deal with that.

I agree with you. But autistic people won’t react in the way you describe. They will just accept what they’re told 🤷🏻‍♀️

Probably not, although girls tend to be more mature than boys in their teens, so it isn't really a fair comparison.

As I previously posted, are you aware that the special sex offenders prisons are full to bursting? The police ARE busy prosecuting but there’s so so many…. And it’s down to cps who gets sentenced

theres not enough police, not enough prisons ( just for this group of offenders, no other group gets their own prison) and there’s simply too many predators… as well as the historical ones

Yes unfortunately, my friend has had the conversation about how older people could pretend to be his age or a bit older but she's never spoken to him (to the best of my knowledge) that people might pretend to be quite a bit younger than him, which obviously changes the point of view from him being a victim to him being put in the position of appearing to be the predator.
He is aware of body privacy and not sharing photos/videos/appearing on live chat that show anything below his neck/shoulders, so basically face only

Trigger warning - SH

YANBU OP.

The live streams and videos of these hunters catching these adults speaking to underaged decoys do more harm than good.

The hunters aren’t arsed about the safety and welfare of children. They care more about their online persona and how many likes/shares etc they get and the uproar of a mob mentality in the comments inciting violence.

I watched one of these live videos out of sheer curiosity once and the man who was caught, ended up grabbing a knife/razor and slashed at his own neck. Was disturbing to see. I’m sure the video is still available somewhere on Twitter/X.

Parents, carers, schools, social workers etc. need to really step up a notch with online safety. So many children have iPhones and access to all apps and corners of the internet.

If people really want to ensure children are safe from paedophiles they would take away their children’s smart phones, ban them from using the Internet unsupervised whilst young and stop posting pictures of their kids on Facebook, Instagram, TikTok etc.

You can’t ban the internet from children and think that’ll help matters. You need to educate them to use it safety, know what to do if someone untoward contacts them online.

Trying to explain that daily to parents of ND/SEN children is like smashing your head against a wall.
By sexual maturity most of the children we are talking about are already massively screen addicted and their life revolves around the online world.
Parents will not implement the basic safeguards we recommend or monitor use, let alone remove the damn tech which often proves to be catastrophic.

The people who do this are awful.

It is very complicated and there should be the correct processes in place for publicising such things. I have met people caught up in these situations, family members, children etc whose lives have been ruined. There are innocent victims harmed through this, so those saying they catch without victims isn’t true. the families or friends of the people caught are often victims and face public scrutiny when they have done no wrong.

ND/SN also complicates things, it’s not so straightforward in these situations either. There are professionals in place for these crimes for a reason and if these people really wanted to help they can pass any info on to be dealt with appropriately. Streaming online and posting in public is not ok.