Was I wrong to refuse sale at work urgent advice needed

[LemonBlueberryX]

So this morning at work (I work in retail - but not a supermarket, think along the lines of b&m), someone came in and tried to buy an item. I was working on the till. When they came to the till I felt frozen on what to do as I didn’t feel comfortable selling this item in these circumstances (based on a stereotype of what this person looked like). I asked for ID (it’s a look25 item) hoping they wouldn’t have it so I could refuse sale but they did. After that I felt I had to make a choice and so I refused sale. Because of things that have happened in my area recently I felt that by allowing this sale I would be personally contributing to bad things.

They kicked off and asked for the manager who came over and asked me why I refused the sale and I just froze and couldn’t answer. Manager took over the till and served the person. The rest of my shift went on as normal but Managers just whatsapped me an hour ago asking me to come in at 10 tomorrow for a chat. I don’t work saturdays so not usually in. What do I say?

I dont really want this getting back to my manager so have tried to be vague about said item

Did you miss the part where she said he stunk of weed?

I responded in general to your blanket statement of
It's not for the OP to judge people.

Op did the right thing in this case and the law is clearly behind her. The fact that her manager completed the sale doesnt change that op used her judgement and did her job. Frankly many managers have no clue on such things though they ought too as they have to do the exact same training op has to do.

Ah, had a google and its just an IKEA thing then... but you could use that in your defence?

There’s a huge difference between having a blanket policy about something, and having cashiers use their “discretion” to apply a policy as they feel.

One is a comment on a societal issue and nothing that could be taken personally, because it literally isn’t personal. The other is a judgement on you as an individual, stating you believe them to be a criminal based on having met them.

I understand your concerns OP, but it's wrong to discriminate. You said the man was white, but statistically, at least in my area, knife crime is predominantly committed by black men. With your logic, I could refuse serving a black man a knife because of my lived experiences. Do you see how problematic that argument is?
You may think you are doing a great thing but it's discrimination. If someone wants to hurt someone with a knife and you refuse to sell it to them, best believe they will still hurt someone with a knife! Just not the one they bought in your shop. Point is, it's not your responsibility what they do with it and you will never know their intentions unless they outwardly say "I'm purchasing this for x y intent," which anyone involved in knife crime is unlikely to admit anyway.

No I didn't miss it. She still just needs to do her job and sell the item legally as per the law.

People that smoke weed are less likely to shank someone. If he was coked off his head and gibbering, then she might have a point and as for the PP telling OP to tell the manager the bloke was acting aggressively, is appalling when he clearly wasn't or she would have mentioned this in her OP.

This sort of pathetic attitude is partly why its such a problem.

What happened to the right to refuse service ?

OP I think you were in the right here. Even without your lived experience, I would have done the same thing. Your morals and integrity are intact and I would stand by them.

I say that as a mum of three older teen sons who while they don't stink of weed, would probably get refused sale if they too tried to buy a single knife in a shop. I would be happy they were refused even though I would know their intentions were good.

One of my sons occationally travels to work/college with knives in his bag (trainee chef) and his college gave advice on what to do if he gets stopped by the police with knives on him or how to replace a knife if one of his breaks. They freely said as a young male, out and about at odd hours, dressed in dark clothes with a hat & scarf covering his face and gloves on he was likely to be subject to a stop and search.

So should all retail outlets have a designated person as arbiter as to who looks dodgy and who doesn't?

What qualification would they need to have?

You refused to sell an item to someone who looked 18 and smelled of weed. Good for you. I think it was morally the right thing to do. From a work perspective though perhaps next time though just call your manager, voice your concerns and let him deal.

We had a similar sale . If he didn’t look 25 you were correct to challenge him. Our sale was a test purchase from the local authority !

I don't think this is a black or white situation, OP definitely could have handled it better by not freezing and calling the manager herself but I don't know whether she was right or wrong to refuse the sale.

Unless her shop has a policy that supports her actions I do think she might be in for a bollocking.

You need to stay impartial. If something awful did happen it is not your fault. Just tell your manager you panicked and thought you were doing the right thing.

This is such bollocks! Every time there is a thread on here about average Ms Smith being refused her bottle of wine in Waitrose because she didn't have ID, or had her kid with her, people are always on the side of the cashier who refused the sale. Yet, OP makes a call to not sell a single knife to a kid stinking of weed and this time she's in the wrong? Aye alright.

I would have done the same as you OP.

This (‘selling knives safety’) advises discretion for over 18s: https://nbcc.police.uk/images/knife_guidance_resources/Knife_Sales_Good_Practice_Guide.pdf

How cashiers should apply their discretion will come down to the store’s own policy and staff training.

Of course, it’s unlawful to discriminate based on protected characteristics (e.g. age, ethnicity, gender, nationality etc). But if there are reasonable concerns about safe sale, not solely based on who the person is (e.g. only item bought, smell of drugs, aggressive response), it may be reasonable to be cautious and seek confirmation from a manager. A well-intentioned customer would understand this, if it was explained politely by the cashier that they had to seek confirmation for a dangerous item.

We got soft and mustn’t upset anyone. Same as when they steal, they’ll have us helping them pack it and carry it out soon because there’s no comeback and they know it.

I hear you.
I think the job might not be for you. Back in the day I left a job cos they stuck me in the kiosk flogging cigarettes. Totally against my principles. I could never do a job involving betting either.

I'd find that advice online so that you can show it to your manager. And mention that the customer stank of weed.

Given that most stores have a policy of Think 21 or Think 25 for knife sales, your confusion can be explained to the manager.

But yes, if it happens again, I'd call the manager to ratify (or otherwise) the sale rather than assume the responsibility yourself.

Every shop should have a policy around the sale of singular kitchen knives, especially those in areas where this is a huge issue. Sure people will still find a way, no harm in making it harder. It also avoids putting people like OP in horrible situations.

The qualification would be common sense is what you've mentioned to be hyperbolic was implemented.

She DID do her job and had every right to refuse.

Take this to your meeting @LemonBlueberryX

https://www.essex.police.uk/police-forces/essex-police/areas/essex-police/au/about-us/business-crime-team/knife-retailers-guide/

Show your manager this part and mention the weed smell.

"Before selling a knife or bladed item, staff must take steps to ensure that it is appropriate to sell the item. It is against the law to sell to anyone who is under 18, but businesses should also never sell if they have concerns about how the buyer may use the item."

Then say that in future you'll ask the manager to attend in future rather than make the decision yourself.

Not with a knife, no. A knife is a very basic tool humans have used since primitive times to survive. The lad could have easily wanted it for its intended purpose, ie cooking in his bedsit. It wasn't your choice to make, he had ID, he had every right to buy the knife, you were in the wrong not to serve him.

I think people who smoke weed still cook and eat, it's not a reason.

Age. Sex. Race.

"I was uncomfortable selling a single knife to a teen who appeared aggressive and smelled of weed. Have I misunderstood the purpose of the challenge 25 policy, or was I expected to sell it to him and then come off the till to call the police?" If the manager says it was wrong, apologise that you misunderstood the policy and either act differently next time or look for a new job. They should not give you a written warning unless this was a repeat issue where you had been told before to sell the knives in similar situations.

I don't think you should be going in unpaid on a day off to discuss issues from your shift, but perhaps that's normal in retail and they pay you for your hours?