Was I wrong to refuse sale at work urgent advice needed

[LemonBlueberryX]

So this morning at work (I work in retail - but not a supermarket, think along the lines of b&m), someone came in and tried to buy an item. I was working on the till. When they came to the till I felt frozen on what to do as I didn’t feel comfortable selling this item in these circumstances (based on a stereotype of what this person looked like). I asked for ID (it’s a look25 item) hoping they wouldn’t have it so I could refuse sale but they did. After that I felt I had to make a choice and so I refused sale. Because of things that have happened in my area recently I felt that by allowing this sale I would be personally contributing to bad things.

They kicked off and asked for the manager who came over and asked me why I refused the sale and I just froze and couldn’t answer. Manager took over the till and served the person. The rest of my shift went on as normal but Managers just whatsapped me an hour ago asking me to come in at 10 tomorrow for a chat. I don’t work saturdays so not usually in. What do I say?

I dont really want this getting back to my manager so have tried to be vague about said item

Well said @MincePiesAndStilton As I said, if the manager is intending on questioning the OP because they 'lost the sale,' they should not be a manager. OP did the right thing, for the right reasons.

Retail staff cannot unilaterally decide who and when they sell items against policy.

This thread is bonkers.

The majority of teenagers buy knives to carry as protection and/or use them as a weapon. The statistics are out there for people to research.

This whole “uni student needs to cook” narrative is ridiculous.

The majority of 18 year old uni students will have their mums and dads buying them sets of knives and kitchen utensils anyway. If one breaks they’re more likely to borrow one from a flat mate.

Unless the OP lives in a city centre or area that has a large student population - it’s very unlikely this lad was in B&M to buy ONE knife to chop some vegetables.

This thread is wild!!!!

The reasons seem obvious to you because of what the OP has said on here. The manager might want to hear her reasons for the decision she made.

Op I agree with you but I don’t know if I’d have been brave enough to refuse sale. What does an 18 year old need a single knife for?

But your manager sold him the knife so they’re not going to support you on this

While I can understand concern around knife crime - we seem to have at least one stabbing a week in my town - it does beg the question how far things need to go to prevent it.

Imagine if knives or everything with blades were just banned. All food would have to be sold pre-prepared, you couldn't cut paper or material.

Or perhaps everyone wishing to buy a knife should undergo mandatory psychiatric evaluation.

In the hands of the determined, anything could be a potential weapon, where would it end?

Just musing.

Actually they can and are expected to. There are literally hundreds of examples where retail staff are the gatekeepers against exploitation and violence; vulnerable people being forced to buy gift cards for fraudsters, fake IDs, purchase of dangerous substances, purchase of weapons. Retail staff are the unsung heroes of modern life and so few people recognise the massive role they play in keeping us all safe, often at great risk to themselves.

I can kind of understand where you’re coming from based on your experience and because of that I can see why you didn’t want to say something in front of the customer. I’m also surprised your manager sold him a knife if he became so angry that it was scary. But I think you will need to come up with something concrete to tell your manager rather than ‘I know his type’ or similar as there are reasonable reasons why someone might want one knife and you did discriminate against him based on his appearance

So unless the OP lives in one of many densely populated areas in the UK where a very large proportion of the population live, it's very unlikely?

Think they had to look 25 to buy a knife. Just be truthful op that you felt the id was fake and child was under 18.

That's not the truth; they didn't think that.

And when you or someone you care about is stabbed by an 18-year-old with a knife bought in a hardware superstore you'll be the first to say 'Who sold him a single kitchen knife? Surely they could have guessed what he was buying it for?'

I would just explain what you said here. And say that you'll meet when you're next on shift as you're not down to work tomorrow.
Its not a sackable offence i fyou had genuine concerns about the safety of the sale.

Nope.
If they looked under 25, they needed proof of age ID for being 18+

Unfortunately if they were old enough you can't refuse to sell it. It may be perfectly reasonable even 18 year olds may need a kitchen knife, they are adults and for all you know have their own home and family.

In fact I would ask why the manager sold the item to someone so clearly unfit to have that items (guessing its a knife) and that its made you feel unsafe. What does the manager say to that? Why wasnt the person asked to leave?

Leanne Lucas, the dance teacher and victim of the Southport attack is campaigning for “blunt/round tip knives”

Of course lots of things could be potential weapons, but knives are the main ones in this country. Knife crime is an epidemic.

It would be impossible to ban all blade type utensils and knives altogether but we need to start somewhere.

news.sky.com/story/southport-stabbings-survivor-launches-campaign-to-end-use-of-traditional-kitchen-knives-13370966

Like what?

I think you need to have a really good think about exactly what about him lead you to think the knife was for criminal use so you can articulate that to your manager in a way that won’t come across as discriminating on a protected characteristic (like age). Things like the smell of weed. Clothing might be but you will need to be able to explain very clearly. Maybe language? I would also reference your personal experience of hostels as that’s the basis of your expertise.

My experience of buying kitchen knives for cooking is that buying them on their own is pretty common - tend not to think of them when I’m buying the other stuff. Only realise I need a decent knife (and a tin opener!) when I’m in the middle of cooking the first meal!

I assume the manager asked you what the issue was in front of the customer? If so, when asked why you didn’t speak up at the time say it was because you weren’t sure how to explain it in front of the customer without offending. It sounds a bit as though it was a fear response with the way you clammed up. If you thought the ID was forged, you could mention that but that’s something you really should have said to the manager before he went on to sell to the kid.

Hope the meeting goes well, OP.

I think you did the right thing, OP.

I wouldn't be able to have that on my conscience if it was then used in an attack.

What do you think the age restrictions are other than discrimination? You’re allowed to discriminate providing it isn’t on a protected characteristic without a legitimate reason.

Unless the OP lives in an area which has a large university student population (you know that apparently need their carrots chopping) then it’s very unlikely that this 18yo lad in question was a uni student wanting to buy the knife for cooking.

But that's not what's happened here.

I stand by my comment, you cannot unilaterally decide to not serve spmeone based on a stereotype.

My dad was a raging alcoholic- would by whisky or whatever then come home and beat the crap out of my mum.

When I worked in retail, unless obviously intoxicated, I couldn't refuse sale based on my lived experience.

More people die due to alcohol than knife crime

I am simply stating, despite how OP feels about the situation, they cannot use "lived experience" as a reason not to provide service to another person

I do not disagree with OPs concern.

It’s May. Even if OP works right next to a university campus it’s very unlikely an 18yo lad would be a uni student wanting to buy the knife for cooking.

Nevertheless, 18yo lads who do cook need to be able to buy their knives somehow.