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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To wish Tess had just gone with Angel

229 replies

WallaceinAnderland · 21/05/2025 23:50

This is probably a popular and well discussed opinion but it just makes me so sad every time. She didn't have to kill Alec, she was legally married to Angel. She could have just walked away.

OP posts:
MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 22/05/2025 10:55

Lol at the idea of "catching culture"... heaven forbid!!

TheBroonOneAndTheWhiteOne · 22/05/2025 10:55

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 22/05/2025 10:52

This thread is giving me flashbacks to the absolute pasting I got after starting this thread. Ten years ago! Still haven't found anything better to do with my time. Ahem.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/2441583-Not-to-tell-my-daughter-that-her-father-isnt-my-husband-but-my-gay-best-friend?

Oh I remember that!
I enjoyed that thread. I thought it had potential.
Grin

SerafinasGoose · 22/05/2025 10:55

Amelie2025 · 22/05/2025 00:20

This nonsense should be posted in the TV section.

😂

SerafinasGoose · 22/05/2025 10:56

WallaceinAnderland · 22/05/2025 00:29

How is Jude bleaker?

Tess was hanged.

Agree it's all miserable.

Yes, but ... Father Time.

Weird with a capital 'W!'

Leafy3 · 22/05/2025 10:58

Confession: I've not actually read any of Hardy's books because I was left scarred by watching several excellent adaptions as a teenager, including Tess, so this obviously doesn't leave me in a strong position for contributing.

But...I imagine that part of the reason for Tess' tragic fate is Victorian moralising. However much a victim, she still needs punishment for her 'sins'

TheBroonOneAndTheWhiteOne · 22/05/2025 10:58

Amelie2025 · 22/05/2025 07:23

Don't 'oh mate' me, patronising!

if belongs in book/tv, whatever form you want to chat about. Not in AIBU.

Don't be silly.
Anything belongs in AIBU.
Grin

Vroomfondleswaistcoat · 22/05/2025 11:01

I still get flashbacks from 'Jude'. Don't make me go there again...

DisapprovingSpaniel · 22/05/2025 11:01

But I don't understand why Tess killed Alec when she could have walked away with Angel, who she still loved and wanted to be with.

BUT in the eyes of the time, she already had a moral husband (Alec) and so her legal marriage was under false pretences.

To us all, this seems daft because she was raped and because being raped does not morally bind you to your rapist. Even without the rape, having sex with someone does not morally bind you to them for life. But Tess lives in a different world. In her world, she is Alec's moral wife and Angel is not her legal husband because he married her ignorant of her experience with Alec.

All that said, I agree that Tess is one of the most frustrating books, everyone in it drives me mad with their dumb decisons Grin

SerafinasGoose · 22/05/2025 11:09

DisapprovingSpaniel · 22/05/2025 11:01

But I don't understand why Tess killed Alec when she could have walked away with Angel, who she still loved and wanted to be with.

BUT in the eyes of the time, she already had a moral husband (Alec) and so her legal marriage was under false pretences.

To us all, this seems daft because she was raped and because being raped does not morally bind you to your rapist. Even without the rape, having sex with someone does not morally bind you to them for life. But Tess lives in a different world. In her world, she is Alec's moral wife and Angel is not her legal husband because he married her ignorant of her experience with Alec.

All that said, I agree that Tess is one of the most frustrating books, everyone in it drives me mad with their dumb decisons Grin

To us all, this seems daft because she was raped and because being raped does not morally bind you to your rapist.

In earlier literature, though, it did. It was as though a victim was 'tainted' and would not be accepted by any other man. A prominent example was Richardson's Clarissa, which made me want to scrub myself after reading it (and what a tortuous read - I can't bear those interminable old 'realist' epistolary novels). More recently Ian McEwan picked up on the same theme in Atonement, which references Richardson among many others.

Given Hardy's own background and published views, there's a satire of all these issues in literature. One being the purity of chastity and sublimation, to which Angel lays claim even though Tess isn't guilty of anything he hasn't done. For him Alex represents the wholly physical and Angel ostensibly the spiritual, although he's completely hypocritical and expects standards of Tess that he has no intention of adhering to himself.

The sexual double standards are so well-drawn for the period and Hardy had a good deal of sympathy for the constraints under which women lived.

WeegieGrannie · 22/05/2025 11:44

This is a brilliant thread; thanks so much to @WallaceinAnderland, as I most likely would never have seen it had it been posted elsewhere.

I have just raked through my dusty old bookshelves, and found seven Hardy books that I picked up decades ago in charity and secondhand shops, thinking I ought to read them but never did. I think a fifty year hiatus is long enough. And I shall start with Tess.

Cherrytree86 · 22/05/2025 12:16

Amelie2025 · 22/05/2025 00:20

This nonsense should be posted in the TV section.

@Amelie2025

oh honey no

JustMeHello · 22/05/2025 12:20

I suppose the 'why didn't she...' comes down to this being a novel, not real life. Tess isn't a person with free will, she is the product of an author who chooses her path for her based on his own goals. I assume he wanted to show the worst possible outcome to show how society punished women and to create sympathy for her. It wouldn't have had the same effect if he'd let her make sensible decisions and have a happy end.

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 22/05/2025 12:21

Hardy had a good deal of sympathy for the constraints under which women lived.

I am no Hardy expert but I love this, which I think first came across on Poetry Please on Radio 4.

https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/44332/the-ruined-maid

The Ruined Maid

"O 'Melia, my dear, this does everything crown!
Who could have supposed I should meet you in Town?
And whence such fair garments, such prosperi-ty?" —
"O didn't you know I'd been ruined?" said she.

— "You left us in tatters, without shoes or socks,
Tired of digging potatoes, and spudding up docks;
And now you've gay bracelets and bright feathers three!" —
"Yes: that's how we dress when we're ruined," said she.

— "At home in the barton you said thee' and thou,'
And thik oon,' and theäs oon,' and t'other'; but now
Your talking quite fits 'ee for high compa-ny!" —
"Some polish is gained with one's ruin," said she.

— "Your hands were like paws then, your face blue and bleak
But now I'm bewitched by your delicate cheek,
And your little gloves fit as on any la-dy!" —
"We never do work when we're ruined," said she.

— "You used to call home-life a hag-ridden dream,
And you'd sigh, and you'd sock; but at present you seem
To know not of megrims or melancho-ly!" —
"True. One's pretty lively when ruined," said she.

— "I wish I had feathers, a fine sweeping gown,
And a delicate face, and could strut about Town!" —
"My dear — a raw country girl, such as you be,
Cannot quite expect that. You ain't ruined," said she.

ThatCyanCat · 22/05/2025 12:21

Hardy also had that philosophy that you are utterly bound by your past and can't escape it. Very fatalistic.

Brefugee · 22/05/2025 12:24

yabu for not putting this in the books section

YABVVVVVU for not putting spoiler alert in the title

BIossomtoes · 22/05/2025 12:28

Thank you so much for your posts @SerafinasGoose, I really enjoyed them.

PlutoCat · 22/05/2025 12:33

Brefugee · 22/05/2025 12:24

yabu for not putting this in the books section

YABVVVVVU for not putting spoiler alert in the title

I can't tell if you are joking or not.

GetMeOutOfHere20 · 22/05/2025 12:35

Haven’t read it since I was doing it for GCSE perhaps I should read again.

EBearhug · 22/05/2025 12:35

The Ruined Maid is one of my party pieces (I grew up by Dorchester, so I have the accent for it.)

MoistVonL · 22/05/2025 12:36

No, Hardy should have done us all a favour and killed the lot of them by page 30.

Christ, that was a miserable bloody book. Harry’s more upbeat stuff in his early years was good, then he became a miserable git determined to make the rest of us as unhappy as he was.

ThatCyanCat · 22/05/2025 12:43

MoistVonL · 22/05/2025 12:36

No, Hardy should have done us all a favour and killed the lot of them by page 30.

Christ, that was a miserable bloody book. Harry’s more upbeat stuff in his early years was good, then he became a miserable git determined to make the rest of us as unhappy as he was.

It'll be in the Quentin Tarantino adaptation. Tess goes nuclear in a two-part revenge series where she takes out her father, Alec, Angel and the prison guards. Turns out Sorrow wasn't dead, it was a ruse to get her to marry Angel. He joins her and they become soldiers of fortune, wasting Bathsheba Everdene and Michael Henchard.

PlutoCat · 22/05/2025 12:51

ThatCyanCat · 22/05/2025 12:43

It'll be in the Quentin Tarantino adaptation. Tess goes nuclear in a two-part revenge series where she takes out her father, Alec, Angel and the prison guards. Turns out Sorrow wasn't dead, it was a ruse to get her to marry Angel. He joins her and they become soldiers of fortune, wasting Bathsheba Everdene and Michael Henchard.

Make sure she takes out that horrible farmer at Flintcombe Ash, too.

Dozer · 22/05/2025 12:58

a young Uma Thurman would have been a great Tarantino Tess!

MoistVonL · 22/05/2025 12:59

PlutoCat · 22/05/2025 12:51

Make sure she takes out that horrible farmer at Flintcombe Ash, too.

And nip along to Egdon Heath to end Damon Wildeve while they’re at it.

ThatCyanCat · 22/05/2025 13:05

The title Two on a Tower was made for this story, I swear.