Men DO NOT have right of way!

[CalmDownCats]

Has anyone else noticed this?

Since around my mid-40s I've noticed that, in particular older men my age or above, just barge straight towards me and expect me to get out of their way.

Since realising this seemed to actually be a thing, I now just hold my ground and keep going. I sometimes even get silly, smirky looks from them as they go around me, as if they know exactly what they are doing.

It's usually older guys, never really younger ones.

Is this just me or does it happen to others too? Is it something that's always happened to middle aged ladies or just a sign of the times?

People keep talking about this and I don't really find it. (Forties, not particularly hot, generally in jeans or gym gear). I have a suspicion there is some subtle signalling people are sending out about who is going to move and I must send out coming through vibes. Obviously sometimes men don't move, but sometimes I don't.

How does that work if everyone does it ?

Yes, I was. Well, not specifically those also with a child and a dog; I don't see many of those. My bêtes noires are pairs of women with a big busy each walking side by side on my neighbourhood's quite narrow pavements. I've no desire for anyone to walk in the road, but they wouldn't have to; they could just go single file for a few seconds. But they seem to think I'm going to step into the road/flatten myself against the wall/hoarding/whatever so they don't have to stop chatting for a few seconds.

The worst offenders for this behaviour are women with buggies. Easily. Not a contest.

As a runner and a walker I've had a lot of time in my life to observe which people think they have an automatic entitlement to the whole of the path or pavement and refuse to even alter their course a tiny bit for someone coming towards them, and women with buggies outrank everyone else.

Groups of people are slightly different but those massive family groups who stretch out across the whole of the path and don't even give any sign that they're aware of anyone else are just awful.

Older men, especially those in "head of the household" mode, definitely like to throw their physical presence around too.

Hand-holding straight couples can be frustrating but I tend to think that's because they're oblivious rather than actively entitled.

I've never encountered this from younger men or women on their own. However interestingly a male friend (short, slightly built, gay) says he encounters this all the time from physically bigger men of all ages.

I especially hate this with couples who HAVE to stay hand in hand even on a narrow pavement or a canal towpath. Sometimes I try to stand my ground and they somehow split and go round me, but I have been known to loudly mutter NO IT'S FINE, I'LL STAND IN THE BRAMBLES, YOU'RE WELCOME.

I'm 5ft nothing, it seems everyone expects me to get out of their way, often they just straight up pretend not to notice me at all and barge into me and they've done it to my children too. I really, really hate it. I don't stand my ground because they absolutely will knock me flying. Even the horrible bloody teenagers do it when I'm walking on the path between secondary and primary schools doing the school run, I've taken to walking with my car keys sticking out sideways so they'll get a nice sharp jab when they barge through me.

If everyone does it we end up with a situation where the entire human population is standing around and, eventually, engaged in chit chat, unable to move.
Peace at last.

@Newbutoldfather "... the system of behaviour followed by knights in the medieval period of history, that puts a high value on honour ..." (Cambs Dict)

I don't see a contradiction. I am simply saying that women should be seen as equal to men. If that involves some adjustment to the playing field (ie not walking behind a person half your size late at night) that is not 'chivalry' (an honour system you can choose to participate in or not) but a basic human right.y

eg in my case, I appreciate it if people help me with big heavy doors. Not because I am a little lady who appreciates courtesy but because I'm a person on crutches that struggles to open the darn things. So, help, M or F is appreciated.

It is certainly not just men but men are (mostly) more intimidating due to size.

I can’t say I’ve noticed men expecting me to give way to them, I didn’t know that was a thing,

I do not give way to pavement cyclists at all. They can cycle where they want but they shouldn’t expect pedestrians to jump out of their way.

We say, "You make a better door than a window".

This is also called pavement bagatelle. Have to be careful, but sometimes I say, "You are very welcome" if I stand aside. Like others, some days I just try to avoid people and then have an odd, sod it, I'm not playing day.

The advantage of keeping left is that it tends to put pedestrians facing oncoming traffic. If it is genuinely too tight, it makes it safer for a (mobile) pedestrian to step off into any suitable gaps in traffic.

I find about ⅔s of people do it by default.

When I'm using off-road mixed use cycle routes, I rarely have issues with cyclists by keeping left. (Cyclists defined as people on legal bikes, and dressed approprately for cycling rather than idiots who happened to be on a two-wheeled contraption and no idea of how to use it safely and legally)

I haven't noticed it particularly with men but I do it with my kids - we live in Cornwall so pavements can get very narrow at times and I always bark at my kids- no stay on the pavement the adult can go in the road... they usually give me a sheepish look and step into the road.

Not according to t’internet. Having checked, I understand that the word in the original Latin phrase means ‘test’, but in contemporary usage ‘proves’ means - er - ‘proves’. It appears to be the subject of some controversy among pedants, but the way I meant it and, indeed, the way it would likely have been understood by most posters on here, is perfectly consistent with modern usage. Unless I’m missing something. I am very happy to have it explained to me. Perhaps I should dig out my old Ecce Romani books and see if I can find anything definitive.

I remember witnessing an older man barging past everyone in his path on my local high street years ago. I’m surprised that noone knocked his head off. Think The Verve’s Bitter Sweet Symphony video but with more aggression

@pinkingshears ,

That is the first definition of chivalry in the Cambridge English Dictionary.

‘very polite, honest, and kind behaviour, especially by men towards women’

Of course, it originated in mediaeval times with knights and horses (it is from chevalerie, from cheval in French), but that is not how it is used now when, very occasionally, it is.

‘I don't see a contradiction. I am simply saying that women should be seen as equal to men. If that involves some adjustment to the playing field (ie not walking behind a person half your size late at night) that is not 'chivalry' (an honour system you can choose to participate in or not) but a basic human right.’

It definitely isn’t a basic human right! That is not what fundamental rights are about if the man is no threat whatsoever. It is chivalrous to consider that a woman might feel frightened of you and make adjustments, nothing to do with human rights.

And, have you taught your 6’2 son to cross the road if there is a smaller man in front of him?

I am a 5’5 guy, albeit in decentish shape, but there is little I could do against a 6’2 young guy in decent shape. And, statistically, he represents far more of a threat to a small guy than to a woman. But I would never have that expectation of a big guy.

This is chivalry. It isn’t necessarily a bad thing, but call it what it is, rather than talking about human rights! Equality is equality and you can say that big people should give way to little people. But you can’t talk about equality and think women have a greater right to a piece of pavement than men, regardless of height or weight.

Yes I have had to explain this to my daughter. No way should the child be expected to step onto the road!

@Newbutoldfather Thanks for the Mansplanation.
I think we'll agree to disagree.

The Highway Code is clear on this, so they are in the wrong.

I am short but fierce and will not move. If they keep walking towards me in their arrogant entitled tone i growl " not a fucking chance" and make sure my walking stick is angled enough to smack them in the shins, or i just stop, don't move and glare at them. They move. I win.

Oh my god yes. Walking through Victoria station yesterday I must have dodged at least half a dozen men in suits barging their way through in a direct line which others had no choice to step out of.

Good to read this thread! I can't bear when someone is walking towards me, and they actually MOVE to be in a collision course with me! It drives me mad!
Also groups who don't want to be go into single file are very annoying, but I would also like to raise: if I'm PART of the big group walking along, it becomes clear we need to make room, somehow it's always me who moves behind first and ends up by myself for a bit... One tries not to dwell on these little things.

Ahaha - I love a good game of Patriarchy Chicken, but I'm quite fighty and enjoy a bit of fucking about and finding out, more so than ever now that I'm in my mid-40s.

(It helps that I am taller than average and of a sporty build)

Men who choose to engage rarely, if ever, win. 😄

Honestly, I'm shocked to hear this is not just a thing men do and so many of you actually do this deliberately to other people. It's such a pathetic way to behave and so unkind.

I suppose I'm more aware of it now...I just nipped to the shops, they were pretty empty but I noticed two other women other women actually doing this to me.

People can behave in such shitty ways nowadays and if you do carry on like this, you need to find something else more positive to focus on. Try being kind instead.

I'm going to go out of my way to not get dragged into mirroring this behavior from now on.

I haven't either. The last time this complaint appeared I made a mental note to see if it happens. The reality is the vast majority of people manage to walk along a pavement , navigating their space.

The exceptions are , if I'm going to make sweeping generalisations, some heterosexual couples, some female couples, groups of women and the urban cycling group.

So far as men, I work in an area where there's always building work going on. The male workies seem to go en masse to sandwich shops, but if I'm going to make sweeping generalisations, are the group most likely to move out of the way.