To ask you all the take a minute to look at the proposed Green Paper on work & welfare, particularly the cuts to PIP.

[MarvellousMonsters]

The Government has published a green paper which amongst other things proposes to change the PIP eligibility, which will ‘save £5b’ by removing financial
support from those who don’t score 4 points in a single criteria in the daily living component of PIP.

green paper in full

It’s estimated that it can cost up to £1000 a month in extra living expenses as a disabled person, and the daily living allowance of PIP is designed to help towards these costs. The lowest rate is £72.65 a week, (£290.60 a month) and this is a literal life line to those who have a limited capability for work, are ‘not disabled enough’ to qualify for full support, but do need help. It allows people to pay for things like cleaners and domestic help, to buy ready prepped veg etc to allow them to eat proper healthy food, to heat their home if they have poor body temp control, and so on. The proposed changes will push these people into acute poverty, and also reduce their quality of life, not just financially, but because being in receipt of PIP makes people eligible for other types of practical support.

You may feel this isn’t something that affects you, but disability can happen to anyone, as those previous fit healthy people who are now incapacitated by Long Covid can confirm. You could be in a car accident, or become sick, it could literally happen to anyone, so this truly does concern everyone, even if you are currently able-bodied and well.

Please, if you do nothing else, please fill in the consultation form and lobby the DWP not to introduce the ‘4 point rule’. If you only do that you’ll help thousands of people who are currently at risk of losing vital support.

consultation form

TLDR: please tell Liz Kendall not to remove vital welfare support from disabled people.

I'm actually all in favour of a wealth tax on the super rich.

If you can get them to pay it. If not, massive taxes on land and housing assets held in this country.

Even if we did this, we would still need to reform both the NHS and benefits systems.

Both for the same reason - want/need will only ever grow. The expectations that people have now go beyond the basics of what the welfare state existed to provide.

Because a disabled woman who gets none of her own money is in a very vulnerable position.
Also finding a relationship will be even harder if a potential partner is having to pay for the extra costs of your disabilites too.

@WeylandYutani No more vulnerable than a mother looking after her young children.

As for finding a relationship - come on, that is not what the state exists to facilitate.

Where are these employers who will employ people with disabilities, long term sick and mental health problems. The extra allowances which have to be made do not line up with a company wishing to make profits.
It is hard enough for a fit, able bodied Oxbridge graduate to get work in the current climate.

The real issue is that this govt and those before them have created a welfare system that costs the taxpayer billions

The result in giving away all this extra money, tax credits etc meant that the price of things went up because more people wanted them as now they could afford them because the govt is hugely supplementing peoples lives

Previous govts brought in extra benefits and increases to win votes. Now we are all paying the price!!!

FWIW I think the points system is absolutely ridiculous

They should find better ways to do things!!!

It’s not sustainable and something has to give!

I live alone and struggle with it. If my boyfriend moved in with me then I would no longer be able to claim Universal Credit as he has too much in savings. Neither of us want me to be financially dependant on him. That is not the state funding a relationship.

Others will have to make do.

People are quick to say this, but no one ever explains what "make do" actually means.

Make do with a cardboard box and a duvet out on the street.

Standard UC is £316.98 per month for under 25's and £400.14 per month if you are over 25.

This is deemed to be enough to live on if you are NOT disabled.
This is supposed to be enough to pay your living costs!
Is it any wonder that there has been an exponential rise in LCWRA and PIP claims, which if awarded PIP and LCWRA, can increase many claimants income by up to £1232.62 per month?

That is based on enhanced PIP of £110.40 per week for daily living, £77.05 per week of enhanced mobility and £97 per week of LCWRA.

If you consider the huge rise in claims amongst people under the age of 25 for mental health issues, bearing in mind that it is probable that those people suffering with mental health issues are more likely to still be living at home with their parents, it's time to ask the question of whether this is a cost of living issue or are the vast majority of disabilities costing an extra £284.45 per week?

The govt deems £316.98/£400.14 per month is enough to afford to live without a disability? I suspect a majority of people in receipt of PIP/LCWRA need it to top up their meagre UC.
Wouldn't that suggest the basic amount of UC is not enough? And the money isn't being spent on disability, but rather it's being spent on survival?
And survival isn't the same as disability!
Everyone needs enough to survive, not everyone has a disability!

I accept that there are disabled people who need the extra money to accommodate their disability, but many more need it to pay usual electricity, gas, water bills and housing cost top ups!

It's no surprise then that the number of claims have skyrocketed when successful claims can increase income by almost 5X from £316.98 to potentially over £1500!

And with that enormous amount of £316 you may have to top up any rent for your crappy room in a HMO you pay, because it's very likely that the rent is not covered by the shared accommodation rate.

Add to that the times you will have to travel to the job centre, and the costs of any interview you do get (although some places will refund travel costs).
We won't talk about sanctions and what this can do to people.

I totally understand why people applied for LWCRA and PIP given this.

I would ask, do you really think that the individuals living on this little money are physically or mentally healthy? If they're not sick now, they will be soon.

I'm sorry but something has to change. We can't have a threshold of disability that is so broad that it covers a massive proportion of our working age population. Disability is relative, we all have a range of things we can and can't do, or that we find easier/more difficult, and we have reached a point where we can't afford to support some of the people's who challenges are more comparable to those we all face as part of the natural variation in our species, to not work (the vast majority on pip do not work). There have to be enough people working and contributing to provide the food & housing etc for those who truly can't.

How do you think those people on UC are making do?

You seem happy that they have less whilst you have more.

*Standard UC is £316.98 per month for under 25's and £400.14 per month if you are over 25.

This is deemed to be enough to live on if you are NOT disabled.
This is supposed to be enough to pay your living costs!*

No - it isnt. The rate you are referring to is equivalent to what used to be called "jobseekers allowance". It's meant to be a temporary contribution that helps bridge a gap between jobs, not a permanent income.

For those with children etc, there are other elements of UC which kick in to top up your income if you are on a low income.

And when you live in an area that has no jobs?

"Make do" means work to earn money to support yourself. There are people currently not working, receiving, who could do some work. It would be hard. They might be tired, have less time with their children, feel more stressed/overwhelmed. They might find the quality of their leisure time reduces as they need to recover. They may not manage anything more than low waged work.

Welcome to the club - many working people are in the same boat.

They might need to be prepared to move or travel to find work but honestly I don't believe there are areas with NO jobs and if they are they really aren't sensible places to live, are they?

The biggest problem is disabled people don't have the same options and choices non disabled people have. So they are reliant on help from the government, when that help is taken away they won't be able to survive. If the government want less people on disability benefits then they need to sort out the nhs, give employers an incentive to hire disabled people, help individuals realistically work meaning part time work and flexible work. Saying where going to stop all your money so you need to work 50hrs a week or die is inhumane. The reality is being disabled is expensive which means realistically a disabled person would need to work more hours then the average person to afford to live. I really don't understand what the government are doing

How about applying a bit of comprehension? The poster you're responding to said that there are no taxes left which can be raised? any future increases will lead to tax receipts failing?
The self imposed fiscal rules you're talking about are about raising national debt and paying for day to day spending by borrowing more. Google it, it's not difficult

The govt deems £316.98/£400.14 per month is enough to afford to live without* a disability? I suspect a majority of people in receipt of PIP/LCWRA need it to top up their meagre UC.
Wouldn't that suggest the basic amount of UC is not enough? And the money isn't being spent on disability, but rather it's being spent on survival?*

This just seems like wilful failure to understand. UC is not a minimum icone standard. The £400 pcm is job seekers. You aren't supposed to live on it permanently. Its meant to be a stop gap while seeking work.

Well you'll be shocked to hear that they don't have any money to be able to move to places where is work.

Or they have poor education, neurodiversity, are over 50, poor social skills, are a bit dirty and smelly because they live in absolute poverty.

Once you're trapped in this situation, it's very hard to get out of it.

Again, I'm amazed how those receiving high benefits are happy to look down on those who receive far less than they do.

There are currently (January to March 2025) over 2 unemployed people per vacancy in the UK.
The job market is not as abundant as you appear to think it is.

Ok, which taxes ?

How do you think someone who can't even wash themselves is going to be able to just move and travel long distances to work. Like I said previously needing someone to wash your hair and the lower half of your body only scores 2 points

I would totally support a government scheme which paid for relocation expenses to individuals out of work to places where there is work.

They could pay for the first month deposit, rent, basic clothing and shoes suitable for work (ie. outdoor wear for farming work).