To ask you all the take a minute to look at the proposed Green Paper on work & welfare, particularly the cuts to PIP.

[MarvellousMonsters]

The Government has published a green paper which amongst other things proposes to change the PIP eligibility, which will ‘save £5b’ by removing financial
support from those who don’t score 4 points in a single criteria in the daily living component of PIP.

green paper in full

It’s estimated that it can cost up to £1000 a month in extra living expenses as a disabled person, and the daily living allowance of PIP is designed to help towards these costs. The lowest rate is £72.65 a week, (£290.60 a month) and this is a literal life line to those who have a limited capability for work, are ‘not disabled enough’ to qualify for full support, but do need help. It allows people to pay for things like cleaners and domestic help, to buy ready prepped veg etc to allow them to eat proper healthy food, to heat their home if they have poor body temp control, and so on. The proposed changes will push these people into acute poverty, and also reduce their quality of life, not just financially, but because being in receipt of PIP makes people eligible for other types of practical support.

You may feel this isn’t something that affects you, but disability can happen to anyone, as those previous fit healthy people who are now incapacitated by Long Covid can confirm. You could be in a car accident, or become sick, it could literally happen to anyone, so this truly does concern everyone, even if you are currently able-bodied and well.

Please, if you do nothing else, please fill in the consultation form and lobby the DWP not to introduce the ‘4 point rule’. If you only do that you’ll help thousands of people who are currently at risk of losing vital support.

consultation form

TLDR: please tell Liz Kendall not to remove vital welfare support from disabled people.

It is shocking at what they are proposing. No real help and just threats of poverty.
I dont think PIP and the health element of UC should be linked at all. It makes no sense to me.

@WeylandYutani it’s riddled with inaccurate assumptions and misconceptions. There’s no talk of any provision for the ‘under 4 points’ disabled folk who will lose their PIP

I can't believe the English are trying to do this to their disabled people. And who's going to be next, because the money saved won't be enough. Austerity didn't work first time round, why would it work this time round?

Not only will they lose their pip they will lose their lcwra leaving people with nothing

Will also lose LCWRA and be forced to look for work.

It's like they think disabled people will suddenly be employable and capable of working a 50 hr week. Stopping someone's money doesn't suddenly magically get rid of their disability. I claim pip and lcwra and work part time because I genuinely can't work anymore then that if I lose this money I can't afford to pay my bills, the extra costs of being disabled and will end up on the street which means I will lose my job it makes no sense.

@MarvellousMonstersTHANK YOU. I have just filled that in. I found the very language of it fairly chilling I must say.

This is exactly it @feelingbleh, the idea that more work is the answer, when actually if you are disabled it’s often impossible to earn enough to live on due to the restrictions of your disability. Company’s aren’t going to employ someone who can’t guarantee how often they are going to be fit to work, or for how long. It’s hard enough finding part time hours to fit around childcare needs, finding a job that tolerates you working some days but not others due to a variable health issue would be even harder.

Or look for full time work/more hours. Many people entitled to limited capability for work are working part time, because they can’t work full time.

British not English

Most people would rather work than have to rely on benefits, which could be ripped away at any time. Indeed look at the number of people who do work, and due to being paid so poorly are dependent on top ups. Something has gone very wrong along the line.

Labour are making difficult choices apparently. Not difficult for them though is it? What would be difficult for them is to tax wealth and close tax loopholes. Targeting the vulnerable is easy. Guess that makes them cowards doesn't it?

Long overdue. It's become a gravy train.

Exactly this, it's just nonsensical to me that they would target those with next to nothing and leave people destitute rather than make themselves unpopular with the wealthy. And yes, they are fucking cowards!

The standard of living is going down generally for people in this country.

People working full time are struggling to heat their homes and to provide healthy meals for their family.

Should we not all share this reduction in living standard - pensioners, working people, disabled people as members of society?

Or should some people be exempted and have their standard of living maintained to the detriment of others?

I don't think there are simple answers. I think we have to reduce welfare spending. Any other suggestions on how else we do this or which group you think should pay the price?

''@dyKenya · Today 13:47

Most people would rather work than have to rely on benefits,''

PIP is NOT an out of work benefit. How many times are we going to have to repeat this?

I work and I receive PIP.

The government seems to have done a good PR job in muddying the water on this.

Also 'most people' don't have disabilities that might restrict their ability to work.

And cutting PIP for someone who can't work is not going to make their disability magically disappear, it is just going to make them poorer.

Honestly it is like talking to a wall...

What I don't get is if I need four points for one thing (fine, I currently have that) does that mean the points below four for every other category are totally disregarded?

Surely that means they are saying you need to be disabled and it fully affecting only one thing, while not affecting anything else whatsoever, makes no sense?

No disability only affects one thing badly, or every single thing really badly. Well it does for some but the majority will be left completely fucking destitute.

How do they think those people will live when sometimes upto 100% of their income could be completely removed?
The hospitals will be flooded with people in terrible crisis.

Should we not all share this reduction in living standard - pensioners, working people, disabled people as members of society?

We need to work out why this is the case because not ALL people have had their living standards decrease. We have so many children living in poverty now. When I was growing up as a child in poverty I expected this to go down as society advanced. How can we expect anything get better if we all accept this? Do you think they will stop at the disabled?

Also, a reduction in someone's living standards on a very good income has very different outcomes to someone who is already on their arse through disability or economically. Things like inflation affect poorer people more because it is harder to have a basic standard of living and it isn't just cutting days out or a nice dress from your budget. I get what you are saying, but doing things equally does not affect people in an equal way.

Didn't take long. Obviously a shake up is on the cards. And even Labour sees it needs to cut the benefits bill. The money should go to the most needy not for a top up to buy luxuries.

Only Fans can be quite good. You get paid for it too.

Excuse me, I was not talking about PIP, I did not mention it at all. I know that PIP is not an out of work benefit though, thank you. It is not me calling for these changes, so direct your ire at the people that actually have the power!

I'm amazed at your ability to examine everyone's bank accounts in a blink of an eye. 🤖

I’m not going to comment on this thread beyond this comment because I find the arguments cyclical and dull. I research tax and public spending for a living. The Chancellor is trying to balance a few factors:

The benefit bill is soaring exponentially. Absolutely skyrocketing. Like nothing ever seen before. The current spend is totally and utterly unaffordable, the future estimates will cripple this country.

There are no tax loopholes or wealth taxes that will actually boost the national income apart from an increase in VAT or the basic rate of income tax. There is no magic money tree. Wealth is already heavily taxed. Tax it more and tax take will fall not rise.

Given these factors, what would you do OP? There are no solutions.