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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Airplane drama!

787 replies

FairPlayer274 · 12/05/2025 16:27

DD is a month shy of 4, and we’re flying into California for a hiking/camping trip. The flight is 5 hours, and we booked the cheapest one we could. Naturally, the space between rows of seating are insanely small (that’s what I get for scrimping, I suppose), and DD is at an awkward height where the edge of the seat is hitting her upper/mid calf, so her feet are forced outwards if she’s not sitting closer to the edge so that her knees can bend (if that makes sense?) She’s also inherited my boat feet, so the ends of her shoes are literally a couple centimeters from the seat in front of her.

She was having a hard time getting comfortable in her seat for take off, and every time she went to adjust herself, her feet moved and touched the seat in front of her. Not like, intentionally full force kicking the seat or anything (which I’ve definitely experienced in the past. I’m not sure a car seat would have helped with distancing her from it, either.) She also just fidgets a lot because, y’know, she’s a child. The woman sitting in it (I’m thinking she had to be in her late 40s, maybe 50s) turned around and directly told my daughter to stop kicking her seat. I reiterated to DD to sit still and try to keep her feet to herself.

She was struggling to do that, so I tried to have her lie down with her feet on my lap (it’s an early flight; she should be sleeping anyhow), but the flight attendant came by to say she needed to be sitting upright and facing forward for take off, so I put her back to where she was. A few minutes later, the woman turns around again and loudly snaps (almost shouting) “Stop kicking my seat! This is the last time I’m telling you!” Which, idk seems kind of like a threat ? I certainly would have spoken to the parent, not the child, and used different words, or involved the flight attendant if I was so bothered by something s/he was doing. And I know it’s certainly annoying to have someone touching your seat, and I was (audibly, I think) doing my best to keep that from happening. I apologized to the woman and kept trying to keep DD still.

A few minutes go by, and we’re about to start taxiing to the runway, and DD starts whining that she’s thirsty. (Me being a dummy dumb dumb, I left our drinks from the airport in the carry on I stowed) I told her they’ll bring us something to drink in a bit, once we’re in the air. I honestly think DD was being pretty patient, but she is tired, and started to cry after a while. (Full tears, definitely noisy, but not like, throwing a fit or anything.) I was desperately trying to get her headphones synched to my phone and a YouTube video pulled up in order to distract her. The fidgeting continued, of course.

The woman in front of us (WIFOU) started cursing in both English and Spanish (not turned around again, but definitely directed at us), saying things like “Shut the fuck up!”, “Son of a bitch! Make her stop!” “ And “I’m about to fucking develop Tourette’s!” Which I was aghast to hear in a cabin with lots of children in earshot, and also thought was pretty insensitive to people who actually have Tourette’s.. Her partner made comments about how it’s going to be a long flight and they weren’t going to get any sleep.

The swearing only made DD cry more. I didn’t say anything to them, but just kept working on quieting her down. Used bribes snacks, threats consequences, distractions, and promises, and eventually succeeded. Course, soon as mine stopped, another child started having a tantrum behind us. This elicited “Knock that thing out with some fucking drugs!” from WIFOU. I was surprised the flight attendant (FA) didn’t say anything to her about it. I thought, maybe she should be the one knocking herself out with drugs, but kept that to myself.

By twenty minutes into the flight, WIFOU and her partner had asked three times to be moved, but the only available seats were “upgraded” to be more comfortable and spacious, and cost an additional £60 each, and they refused to pay. The third time, the FA checked in with DD and I and gave me an obligatory “Can you have her stop kicking? I know she’s a child…” I told her “We’re trying,” and she nodded understandingly and went back to her duties.

The fourth time they asked to be moved/upgraded, they were getting irate. FA looked embarrassed to have to insist they pay for the better seats. I interjected and suggested that the couple switch rows with DD and I, so that at least she wouldn’t be behind them. This irritated the people sitting in the aisle seats, who had to get up to allow us to shuffle around, but it at least stopped their complaining. I was worried DD was going to piss off our new neighbors ahead, but thankfully it was a little boy sitting in front of DD, and he didn’t seem to notice
DD’s wiggling about… I finally just got her to sleep, 2.5 hours in.

I think next time we will either cough up the funds for more spacious seating or just fly via a different airline… But honestly, I see airplanes as just another form of public transportation that’s gonna have crying and fidgety kids on it, with parents ranging from desperately trying to keep their littles polite and unassuming, to entitled parents who think it’s their kids’ right to run wild and do as they please... If I didn’t want to hear or feel them, I’d probably wear my hearing protection I use for my job, and purchase the seat behind me. Usually I just put up with it, since I empathize. I don’t think children should have to miss out on traveling before they’re fully developed, either.

What’s your opinion?

OP posts:
pollyglot · 14/05/2025 06:45

FROM THE OP:

Part of the reason why I didn’t react to her was because I was expecting the FAs to intervene, and even possibly remove her (she also called one FA a “stupid bitch” because she instructed her to open the window shade for take off. But I guess they were just trying to get the plane off the ground, after it had already been delayed by waiting for one of the FAs to get there, and having to roll back out the walkway, boarding bridge thingy after some passenger started having a medical emergency just after everyone had finished boarding…

Well I find this INCREDIBLY hard to believe. You mean the staff just stood there and took that? Truly?

All I can say is that American airlines have appallingly low standards of behavioural expectations. Says a great deal about your compatriots too.
In my experience, just try that on any respectable airline, and regardless of schedules, the offender would be deplaned. It opens doubts about how this will end once in the air.

Are you absoutely certain that's what happened, along with all the other stuff? Why didn't you contact the airline for compensation then? Evidently it was not Little Darlin's fault, she did nothing wrong. Sounds like a dit to me...

FairPlayer274 · 14/05/2025 06:50

SnakesAndArrows · 14/05/2025 06:42

But she was wearing her seat belt, so couldn’t have slipped further forwards, so could not have been touching the seat.

If her feet moved upwards at all, because of the angle of the seat, they made contact. She could also slide forward with the seatbelt still fastened by slouching down, which she was doing in order to be able to bend her knees, and then I imagine her back started to hurt, so she wriggled upright again.

OP posts:
nomas · 14/05/2025 06:58

SnakesAndArrows · 14/05/2025 06:42

But she was wearing her seat belt, so couldn’t have slipped further forwards, so could not have been touching the seat.

Airplane seatbelts (lap belts), are designed to prevent passengers from moving upwards, during turbulence or a sudden stop. They’e not designed like car belts, which also prevent forward and lateral motion. Airplane seatbelts focus on the up-down movement to keep passengers secured in their seat.

pollyglot · 14/05/2025 06:59

FairPlayer274 · Today 06:50

SnakesAndArrows · Today 06:42
But she was wearing her seat belt, so couldn’t have slipped further forwards, so could not have been touching the seat.

If her feet moved upwards at all, because of the angle of the seat, they made contact. She could also slide forward with the seatbelt still fastened by slouching down, which she was doing in order to be able to bend her knees, and then I imagine her back started to hurt, so she wriggled upright again.

OK. OP, fair dos. You've made your point. As I said before, your Little Sweetheart is incapable of any misdemeanour. We get that.

I have seen SO MANY parents over 47 years in schools who believe exactly the same. Let them off the hook every time. Always someone else's fault. And you know what? NOBODY likes them. The kids, I mean. They have no friends. Kids, on the whole, are very fair, and respect discipline. They like boundaries. Kids whose parents are always at the school office making complaints about teachers and other pupils are treated as pariahs. Do you want that for your child? Toughen up and give much stronger guidance. Don't make excuses because you are too lazy or inadequate to teach them good manners.

HelplessSoul · 14/05/2025 06:59

nomas · 14/05/2025 06:39

You can point your suggestions elsewhere. Are you another who brags about how much you fly? No one cares.

Facts hurt, dont they?

And yes, I love to fly - if only because it drives eco people up the wall and theres nothing they can do about it 😂

CannotWaitForSummervibes · 14/05/2025 07:07

FairPlayer274 · 12/05/2025 16:46

I encouraged her to sit cross legged until the plane went up, but she kept forgetting and straightening them out again.

I really do think she would have done better if we had more space

Op, surely you are able to actually stop your child from doing something? What do you do if your child wants to do something dangerous, like playing with sharp knives? Do you “encourage” her to not do it, or put your hand out to stop her? This is not different. You should have physically STOPPED her, not just encouraged her to stop. The lady was very rude but your behaviour was also not great. You shouldn’t let your child kick a chair more than once. And stop using the space excuse. You managed to get into the seat and I’m sure you managed to sit without digging your knees into the person in front of you. Your child is smaller and they don’t have to sit with their legs sticking out straight. She could have sat with her knees up, or cross-legged, or either her legs to one side. It was your job to ENSURE she sat in a way that her feet were not touching the chair in front.

nomas · 14/05/2025 07:08

HelplessSoul · 14/05/2025 06:59

Facts hurt, dont they?

And yes, I love to fly - if only because it drives eco people up the wall and theres nothing they can do about it 😂

Statistics are available with a quick Google, so not sure why you think you’re dropping any new facts.

And I wouldn’t class myself as an eco person, because I do fly from to time.

But I think bragging about how much you fly or how well travelled you are is completely passé, seriously, no one cares, it’s not the 1990s anymore.

We know emissions, particularly at high altitudes, contribute significantly to greenhouse gas concentrations in the atmosphere. So whilst you think it’s a measly 2.5%, the impact of altitude and other factors makes it a big source of climate change.

HelplessSoul · 14/05/2025 07:09

nomas · 14/05/2025 07:08

Statistics are available with a quick Google, so not sure why you think you’re dropping any new facts.

And I wouldn’t class myself as an eco person, because I do fly from to time.

But I think bragging about how much you fly or how well travelled you are is completely passé, seriously, no one cares, it’s not the 1990s anymore.

We know emissions, particularly at high altitudes, contribute significantly to greenhouse gas concentrations in the atmosphere. So whilst you think it’s a measly 2.5%, the impact of altitude and other factors makes it a big source of climate change.

If you dont care, why are you still responding?

😂🤦‍♂️

Climate change - boo fucking hoo. Changes every fucking day. 2.5% of CO2 at 30000ft is a lot less worse than 24% at fucking ground level, you know, where PEOPLE are.

JFC.

😂🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️😂

nomas · 14/05/2025 07:12

HelplessSoul · 14/05/2025 07:09

If you dont care, why are you still responding?

😂🤦‍♂️

Climate change - boo fucking hoo. Changes every fucking day. 2.5% of CO2 at 30000ft is a lot less worse than 24% at fucking ground level, you know, where PEOPLE are.

JFC.

😂🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️😂

You are the one responding to my posts. Stop quoting me if you're so triggered.

Your sound like Trump, grow up.

laraitopbanana · 14/05/2025 07:13

Supergirl1958 · 13/05/2025 20:01

Honestly find that post embarrassing. I’m an early years teacher. I’ve met several kids who struggle to follow rules routines and boundaries consistently, because they are children

Exactly…that is the nature of a child. I know children don’t magically behave in a classroom but the person I was answering to said that she is a professional and that children do behave…I am not a teacher so I guess I let her and take on board what her expertise is.

I didn’t think she is an expert more than anyone « outside the class » so I did challenge the « good parents don’t have children that wiggle and wings while traveling statement of hers ».

HelplessSoul · 14/05/2025 07:17

nomas · 14/05/2025 07:12

You are the one responding to my posts. Stop quoting me if you're so triggered.

Your sound like Trump, grow up.

I corrected you with facts.

Facts that disproved your BS claims about air travel damaging the environment when it doesn't when compared to ground operating transport methods.

You did not have to respond after I correctly called you out on your woke climate change drivel.

But you did. Thats on you.

🤦‍♂️

SnakesAndArrows · 14/05/2025 07:18

nomas · 14/05/2025 06:58

Airplane seatbelts (lap belts), are designed to prevent passengers from moving upwards, during turbulence or a sudden stop. They’e not designed like car belts, which also prevent forward and lateral motion. Airplane seatbelts focus on the up-down movement to keep passengers secured in their seat.

Yeah I’ve been on planes.

Spirallingdownwards · 14/05/2025 07:21

Permanentlymildlymiffed · 13/05/2025 20:36

Mumsnet is nuts and full of so many people who seem to hate kids considering it’s MUMSnet 😆 I’ve had someone physically assault my 1 year old because she could feel his tiny little legs touching her seat, princess and the pea and her husband threatened to make him (just turned 1 year old) “pay” for upsetting her! OP the majority of responses here aren’t reflective of the majority of responses IRL. Also if anyone can explain how without being abusive one manages to make a toddler do what they’re told when they’re told at all times please share your secret!

Yes I agree when the toddler is 1 but the OP'S child is nearly 4 so perfectly able to understand the word no. And yes no other adults should be abusive towards the child or OP.

Spirallingdownwards · 14/05/2025 07:25

FairPlayer274 · 14/05/2025 06:50

If her feet moved upwards at all, because of the angle of the seat, they made contact. She could also slide forward with the seatbelt still fastened by slouching down, which she was doing in order to be able to bend her knees, and then I imagine her back started to hurt, so she wriggled upright again.

At what point did you say stop doing that or say no to her? Because frankly it seems from such detail you were well aware what she was doing and the consequences of her doing it.

nomas · 14/05/2025 07:30

HelplessSoul · 14/05/2025 07:17

I corrected you with facts.

Facts that disproved your BS claims about air travel damaging the environment when it doesn't when compared to ground operating transport methods.

You did not have to respond after I correctly called you out on your woke climate change drivel.

But you did. Thats on you.

🤦‍♂️

You didn’t disprove shit. I said flying causes environmental damage. That is a FACT.

How have you disproved that?

Seriously, get an education.

nomas · 14/05/2025 07:31

SnakesAndArrows · 14/05/2025 07:18

Yeah I’ve been on planes.

You’re the one saying she couldn’t have slipped forward, I’m explaining why she could.

Mrsgumdrop · 14/05/2025 07:32

LowDownBoyStandUpGuy · 12/05/2025 16:39

It’s annoying having a kid kicking your seat but it would be a brave person who spoke to my child like that, my reaction would have made theirs look reasonable tbh.

You sound delightful.

HelplessSoul · 14/05/2025 07:35

nomas · 14/05/2025 07:30

You didn’t disprove shit. I said flying causes environmental damage. That is a FACT.

How have you disproved that?

Seriously, get an education.

Suggest you re-read my posts.

Instead of directing me towards education, a dabble of that for yourself wouldnt go amiss given your dire reading comprehension.

Flying is GREAT for the environment. The economic benefits far outweigh the 2-3% CO2 whining you are doing.

SnakesAndArrows · 14/05/2025 07:35

nomas · 14/05/2025 07:31

You’re the one saying she couldn’t have slipped forward, I’m explaining why she could.

But the belts do stop you moving forwards. Unless the belt isn’t properly adjusted.

Dabrat21 · 14/05/2025 07:36

OP you did your best. The woman in front got angry very quickly and you stayed as calm as you could to manage the situation. I think the woman in front was in the wrong for swearing and over reacting. These days everyone is so quick to get angry and complain. Your daughter’s just a child of nearly 4, they can see she is young, they should have some understanding no matter how annoying it can be. You did your best OP and the woman in front sounds ridiculous.

nomas · 14/05/2025 07:37

HelplessSoul · 14/05/2025 07:35

Suggest you re-read my posts.

Instead of directing me towards education, a dabble of that for yourself wouldnt go amiss given your dire reading comprehension.

Flying is GREAT for the environment. The economic benefits far outweigh the 2-3% CO2 whining you are doing.

Bringing in whataboutery about car pollution doesn’t change the fact that flying is bad for the environment.

Flying is GREAT for the environment.

You have totally lost the plot now. Time for a coffee.

nomas · 14/05/2025 07:38

SnakesAndArrows · 14/05/2025 07:35

But the belts do stop you moving forwards. Unless the belt isn’t properly adjusted.

It doesn’t stop you slouching forward, particularly if you’re a small child.

GrahamSmith · 14/05/2025 07:47

Your daughter must have been kicking the woman’s seat pretty relentlessly and for an extended period of time for her to turn round. I wouldn’t even consider turning round during the boarding phase when people are getting settled and there’s a lot of moving around in a cramped space. However, if someone was still kicking me 30/60 mins into a flight I would have to say something.

Cosyblankets · 14/05/2025 07:53

FairPlayer274 · 14/05/2025 05:52

Knowing mine, she’d be like “Really?!” And start jackhammering that seat like it owed her money, because she would think parachuting is fun and exciting lol

She continually surprises me within things like that. You know how some parents count down and if the child doesn’t listen, they issue a consequence? Mine listens when I count down because she sees it as a race/beat-the-clock sort of game. I was so confused the first time I counted down and she started celebrating afterwards, when she had “won.”

How did she win?
What was the consequence?

HeadNorth · 14/05/2025 08:06

Your daughter must have been kicking the woman’s seat pretty relentlessly and for an extended period of time for her to turn round.

Or the woman was unnecessarily stroppy & unreasonable? As the woman was also sweary and unpleasant to the flight staff, that seems highly possible to me.