to think many grandmothers actually do not want to do childcare?

[onlytwo]

I go to a regular toddler group and there are many older women there with their grandchildren.

Been talking to them and many of them do not want to do childcare but have been pressured into by mostly their daughters but also their sons. Their children often think they are delighted to be looking after their grandchildren but often it is a huge struggle for these women (and it mostly women). They feel like they can't take a break because their children rely on them for childcare because of the cost of nurseries and general cost of living. They no longer have the same energy levels and also often have health issues.

Also grandfathers are usually not pressured into doing childcare and are rarely expected to give up their job when grandchildren come along. Their life mostly remains unchanged,

I feel the expectation of women to keep doing childcare is unfair and is coming from their own daughters. Some of the older women are frail and struggling to keep up with young children.

When talking to the mums, they say their mums love spending time with their grandchildren and looking after them. That is not what they have said to me.

That is simple.

Some grandparents will not see their GC unless they agree to childcare. So not quite so simple.

A lot of grandmothers are working and the stats show many of them give up work or reduce their hours whereas very few men do this.

So because grandmothers are more suited the burden should keep being placed on them? So many posters have mentioned being under this kind of pressure. This keeps women placing the burden on other women.

Men get to mostly opt out.

Generally dead people can't help.

One day I hope to be a cheerful retired person sitting in coffee shops, doing my own thing, enjoying myself, etc.
I do not want to be singing wheels on the bus with any GC and standing at the playground again.
My own mother has helped out a wee bit occasionally. But she has always made it clear she is not a childcare resource. I totally respect and understand that. She’s worked hard all her life (three kids and farming) and this is her precious retirement.
People should feel able to set boundaries and have them respected. Retirement is often hard earned.

To be brutally honest I think it's pathetic that people aren't assertive enough to say no if they don't want to do childcare.

So many people martyring themselves and then bitching to others about it. It's awful. Just say no in the first place FFS.

People aren't unreasonable to ask, people aren't unreasonable to say no. They are unreasonable if they say yes but mean no.

For some people saying no means not seeing their GC.

Nothing to do with being pathetic.

My MIL complains about doing so much for SIL kids. But I remember her convincing SIL to have both of those children because she'll be there to help her! I remind my DH all the time because he gets annoyed at SIL taking advantage of MIL.

I won’t be, we’ve made it clear it’s respite care eg illness and occasional for fun nights out not daily drudgery

As part of the grandparent generation (although happily childfree), I do agree with the OP.
But it is the responsibility of these grandparents to stop being so spineless and just say no!

My parents help me a lot with my kids. But I help them in any way I can in return, I often look after their pets and pick up shopping and help with cleaning. When I went back to work my mother chose my work rota and gets first dibs on my holidays after kids birthdays for when she wants off.
I'm very grateful for their help and I generally don't ask for extra other then my work days although they do offer the odd sleep over.
We touch base regularly and I always make sure they know how much we appreciate them so I think our arrangement works for us but I'd say you aren't wrong.
My eldest is 10 now so things are getting easier physically. I often go over and help my parents if they are watching my baby nephew as just carrying him about is hard work as he's very big but my sister helped with my children when they were younger so again it works for us

Seriously? She sounds a little defeated and walked on. Is that what it takes to be lovely?

It may not have been this way for you, but why are people having children when they can't afford childcare? Why, therefore do they think it's OK to use grandparents as unpaid skivvies?
Can't afford the costs = don't have the kids!

I think some grandparents like the idea of looking after grandchildren more than the reality.

My mum went on and on that I shouldn't put eldest in nursery, she would mind him, she would love it etc.

It lasted about 6 weeks

She sounds lovely to me for stepping in and helping out her daughter, who is a single parent (and therefore trying to do the job of 2 people, as well as working for our NHS). If I was on my own in that situation, I’d think myself incredible fortunate to have someone like her stepping in to help me and my kids. It is a lovely thing to do 🤷🏻‍♀️

I think the fact that generally people have babies older is a big factor.
My nan was a huge part of my life. She was very much someone who felt that it takes a village. She goes my mum out, aunties helped her out, lots of childcare etc.
But she was 47-fit as a fiddle when I was born and only worked very part time. My mum (despite being very enthusiastic initially) wasn't able to. She was not in great health and still worked part time. I had my kids older and am likely to be late 50s early 60s and still working full time by the time I'm a grandparent. I won't be able to fully retire until 67. My grandad retired at 55.
I hope I will be an involved grandparent both because I would enjoy it and also because I didn't have much support and don't want my kids to go through that..but I don't think I will have the capacity my grandparents did, and that is a shame.

“Only” one day a week!
That is a lot.

All mentions of women doing childcare - nan, auntie.

It is not the case of women having babies when they are older. It is the expectation of other women doing the childcare and not men.

I’m middle class and in the south east. I’m 60 and DH is 64. We both work full time, as seems typical of our friendship group - though admittedly some work part time - and I won’t retire until I’m 67. Our DDs are in their late 20s and won’t be having children any time soon. There is no way we could do childminding. I have to look after my elderly parents in their 90s who live hundreds of miles away. This to me seems a common scenario- working parents in their 50s/60s who are looking after their own very elderly parents while working full time.

To be fair I commented on this as the title was about grandmother's.
My grandfather was quite ahead of his time in terms of contributing to childcare, household tasks etc. he spent lots of time with us. He did work full time when I was young as did my uncles so they just weren't around the same.

Although they did take on slight gendered roles (although not by the standards of the era) he also believed in the 'it takes a village approach ' and would pick us up from school if his shifts allowed, did loads of DIY and gardening in our house once he retired and my dad had to work away.

Perhaps I should have just said people have babies older Nd work later now.

I am not disputing that in some families there is a greater expectation on women. I am notice a lot of older grandparents out in couples with grandchildren these days.

I'm a professional, albeit self-employed now. Also a granny. I transferred into self-employment deliberately so I could care for my GC. On average, I care for grandchild between 25 & 27 hours a week. I also still work full-time, but a split shift, to allow for the afterschool care. This means I work before the school run, after school drop off until pick up time, and later in the evening when GC has gone home. On average I work between 40 & 50ish hours a week.

I can't retire for quite a few more years. Yes, I'm exhausted at times, but having this relationship with my GC is wonderful.

I am notice a lot of older grandparents out in couples with grandchildren these days.

If you look closely, it is mostly the grandmothers doing the grunt work of feeding, changing, toileting. The grandfathers are often doing the fun part. I have noticed this in so many ladies toilets, grandmothers bringing in grandsons while the grandfathers wait outside.

I don't think grandparents are one homogeneous group who all behave the same way.

Agreed which is why I said most and not all.

I would like to help out more with my 2 Great grandchildren age 2 & 6 ie : take and collect from school / nursery etc but it's a little too far from me to do so.
So for now I have them some week ends maybe monthly or odd nights. If I don't feel like it or im busy that's fine with her
We are looking for new place for my grandaughter to live nearer me.

You're a bit of a broken record, OP! You keep posting minor variations of the same point.

It's hardly breaking news, is it? As a general rule the burden of childcare falls to women and not men; this is still the norm and the expectation. Why is that surprising? Stop press: patriarchy hasn't magically been fixed!

Also, today's generation of parents (which includes me and my DH) are generally doing better at being more egaliatarian in our parenting than previous generations - not that this generation has cracked it, by any means. But more of today's fathers do more of the parenting than our own fathers did. So my dad and FIL - who are some of the grandfathers you're banging on about - didn't do much to raise their own kids (it was all mum or step mum, and MIL or DH's grandmother) so it's hardly a shocker that they're not actively caring for their grandchildren, and only playing a supporting role at best.

What is your point exactly? That grandparents shouldn't be expected to do childcare? Or that grandmothers and grandfathers should be held to the same standards - either both should help with childcare, or neither should? Is that it?

If you feel I am a broken record, feel free to hide the thread!

I am not expecting patriarchy to be magically fixed. Does this mean we should not discuss how the expectations differ for men and women? How even women are contributing to the expectations by putting the burden on other women?

It is sad that many grandmothers feel under pressure to provide childcare.

Neither did I state anywhere that it is surprising how little grandfathers do compared to grandmothers or that it is a shocker.

It is not so simple as either both should help with childcare or neither should. I think it is worrying that the burden continues to be put on women and women's needs are often neglected while this is not the case for men.

I agree. I don't understand this "we couldn't cope without our parents help financially". What if one if your parents was to drop down dead or suddenly become ill all of a sudden? What happens then, you would have to cope and find the means to cope financially.

I find it incredibly selfish of posters like the PP, that know their parents would like more time to themselves and commit less time to childcare yet still do nothing to help their parents out in this respect and still demand that their parents provide unpaid childcare out of their own time and expense when they want to do less of it and make no provisions for this.

I'm aware i have two days childcare provided, a day by each. However I would cope without their help and at ANY point they turned round and said they wanted to commit less time to childcare we would make the necessary adjustments to accommodate this and I would no hold grudge towards them nor do I think it is their duty or responsibility to be helping us out financially for children we chose to have and I'd never expect them to do more than they want.

I never expected anything. They both offered it to us however I'd never guilt trip either oarent to say I couldn't cope without their help.