To shriek from the rooftops that there is No Such Thing as “preferred pronouns”?

[Ddakji]

That’s it.

They don’t exist - any more than preferred adjectives, adverbs or nouns exist.

Even people who don’t like them still seem to think they exist.

Language is a shared, collective endeavour that belongs to all. It’s not a pick’n’mix for individuals to choose and change at will. For words not to be garbage they have clear definitions - in this case she for females, he for males, they (singular) for sex unknown.

Saying my preferred pronouns are she/her, even if that doesn’t fly in the face of reality, is no different to saying my preferred species is human, my preferred adjectives are sporty and lush.

It’s nonsense. Nothing to do with being kind or they don’t affect me, or I don’t mind if others do but I won’t. It’s nonsense.

Let’s make 2025 the year we kick this nonsense into touch.

I’m assuming she writes Doctor or Professor.

I disagree - nothing wrong with having a preference or with following it in the majority of circumstances- there are some limited circumstances when it shouldn’t be followed but even then it is properly described as a preference.

I generally find that people who want to “shriek from the rooftops” about something are using talking bollocks.

I remember a thread during Covid where someone wanted all the schools closed yet again in preference to numerous less onerous limitations, and they wanted to shriek it from the rooftops too.

We didn't "dump" her. We didn't engage her. I don't want to deal with someone who doesn't believe in the most basic facts of life.

Pronouns refer to a person’s sex, not their name. A man and a woman with the same name have different pronouns, and that’s not a choice.

I will never use wrong words. Expecting me to do so is far more disrespectful. “Tolerant of your slips”? No. They are imposing a cognitive headfuck on you, and you are endorsing that, as well as pandering to a delusion that ultimately won’t help.

You could argue that it would he better to get rid of he/she altogether because gender stereotypes help noone.

My name is Caroline but I prefer Carol. So you would call me Carol. Why make this the hill to doe on.

Of course I don't. I use my title - Dr. Why should I have to downgrade myself?

Surely pronouns are what other people call you?

It’s no skin off my nose tbh. If someone want me to refer to them in a particular way I will try to accommodate them. It doesn’t bother me.

There have been many time on here where someone has mentioned the "other girl" or "girl who was serving" and been corrected that this person is a woman. That's correcting a common noun about another person.

Aren’t preferred pronouns what other people call you (unless you refer to yourself in the 3rd person singular)

I don’t think the PP is missing the point. I think what you are trying to exert has been worded incredibly badly, and is, as it stands, totally incorrect.

<and I don’t like this gender identity culture either>

No, that’s an illogical comparison to draw. What OP is saying is more along the lines of you can’t just go around calling a chair a table and expecting people to either agree or also call it a table.

Despite the fact it has nothing to do with her professional capabilities of a financial advisor and she could have been the best woman for the job?

I just can't take anyone who says "the pronoun people" seriously

My biggest issue is I cannot remember peoples names so chances of me remembering preferred pronouns is practically impossible. Pronouns is very instinctual as we can recognise male and female by sight. It isn’t something that we have to learn and remember about someone.

That's a very extreme and over the top interpretation of someone putting She/her at the bottom of their email 🙄

@Bartoz I'm sure you understand what I've written, or are you being deliberately obtuse?

That's not what the OP is saying either though, or not what she said in her initial post and thread title, she's backtracked a little since. The first post seems more to be saying that because most (all) people use the word 'chair' to mean the thing with legs that you sit on, if some people start a social or political movement trying to insist people start calling the things with legs that you sit on a table, or that everyone must publically declare their seating-descriptor preference in order to avoid table/chair based offense, because the table-movement is so obviously wrong/unreasonable, that means the terms table and chair literally don't exist as 'preferred nouns'. That part is what people are saying is wrong about the OP, everyone agrees the words exist, everyone agrees some (most) people have feelings about those words and how they're used, it's the reasonableness or otherwise of policing how people use the terms to refer to themselves or others, and the reasonableness or otherwise of insisting or encouraging declaration of your preferences is what's unclear/the subject of debate. Trying to argue you're right on the basis of things 'not existing' is not a very good way to win an argument when there's general consensus they do exist...

It doesn't. But it does bother me what they demand about how I refer to them.

First world problems, it's a trivial courtesy to address a person in whatever way they prefer.

No one has the right to tell others how to express themselves, adopting a pronoun is a simple freedom, who cares?

Pronouns replace nouns - simple as. You remind me of the boys I used to teach in the late nineties (former English teacher) - and older men of the same era for that matter - who had similar objections to the use of Ms as a title. They felt entitled to the knowledge of my marital status that the ‘old’ titles conveyed, and really didn’t like me using Ms. Of course, they couldn’t stop me using it, but they wouldn’t have it imposed on them! Similarly, my mum used to insist on addressing cards etc to my brother’s wife, who kept their name as ‘Mrs brother’s name’ because she didn’t ‘believe in’ not taking your husband’s name. Like I say, you do you. Maybe language will evolve and using the gender neutral ‘they’ will become the norm; maybe it won’t. In the meantime, I’ll continue to address people by the names, titles and pronouns that they prefer, because I choose to accommodate people’s preferences when they aren’t harming anyone else, tedious though might sometimes be to be ‘corrected’.

@Throughahedgebackwards As I said before, you can call people what you want.

This isn’t a natural evolution though, it’s authoritarian control.

OP a lot of people are missing the point, which is that in the natural use of language, the only thing you can normally dictate to others is the name they call you. Dictating pronouns is unnatural and therefore feels controlling.

Yep. GC people complain about young people and the trans community being hysterical and over reacting.

Then there’s these reactions ….

Honestly, OP, you're coming over as a really nasty piece of work. Sex is immutable, yes. But identity isn't. If a transwoman would like to be referred to as she/her, why wouldn't you be respectful enough to use those pronouns? It's kind, it's inclusive, and it makes fuck all difference to how you live your life. I'm GC too but I'm not an arsehole.

I find it useful. It helps me to see who starts shrieking with rage, and therefore who I know to avoid speaking to. A bigot filter, if you will.