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Original poster

Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor - you have blood on your hands

737 replies

Muffinmam · 26/04/2025 07:14

Am I being unreasonable to say that Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor - the Duke of York and member of the Royal Family has blood on his hands following the tragic suicide of Virginia Giuffre?

Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor has faced zero consequences for his role in Virginia Giuffre‘s sexual abuse and trafficking because he’s rich and his powerful mummy paid off the victim and the British police failed to pursue charges against him. To be clear, while the age of consent in the UK is 17 years old this does not apply to trafficking victims and Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor has never faced criminal charges.

He probably thinks he’s got away with it now she’s gone.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14649791/Virginia-Giuffre-suicide-perth-mansion.html

OP posts:
IkeaJesusChrist · 26/04/2025 10:18

The only sympathy I have is for her children.

I find it interesting that so many people think Prince Andrew is a rapist, dispite the fact that there is not a shred of evidence.

FantasiaFunFact · 26/04/2025 10:19

GreenApplesRedApplesYellowApples · 26/04/2025 09:45

You're of course entitled to your opinion.

But you are imo - and this is national societal thing - suffering from this perception people have about what women and girls who go through sexual trauma and deserve sympathy should look like:

So if you go through sexual abuse and still emerge able to present yourself in society in a 'psycho-social positive' way then people will tend not only to believe you more, but have great sympathy for you.

But of course damage inflicted on a person in childhood tends to cause long lasting changes in the brain

So if you go through that experience but do not emerge able to still function in a psycho social positive way, but actually only in a psycho-social negative way...if you are overtly promiscuous, self-harming, alcoholic, drug taking, serial lying, vindictive, thieving, attention seeking, mistreat your kids, are selfish and have a 'me first' protectionist attitude - and I know women like this, and they're not nice people, they're people you avoid - you receive little to no sympathy.

It's natural, but it's wrong. We need to not couple and attach our value judgement on what they went through on how they are now presenting. They're victims twice over.

Fwiw I don't think I'd personally have wanted VG as a friend. But she didn't deserve what happened to her and she deserves all the sympathy accorded anyone else who suffers similarly and 'Bad things happen to innocent and formerly nice people, who as a result become 'bad' and 'not nice' people' and that is a double tragedy.

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Excellent post.

TheStrangestThings · 26/04/2025 10:21

HoskinsChoice · 26/04/2025 10:15

You should get this removed, it is libel. There has never been any suggestion by anyone, including VG, that he is a paedophile. You're on very dangerous ground here and putting Mumsnet at risk too.

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@HoskinsChoice You have a really good point. Unless the posters can actually prove that their accusations are true, it could be considered defamation.

Ukisgaslit · 26/04/2025 10:21

IkeaJesusChrist · 26/04/2025 10:18

The only sympathy I have is for her children.

I find it interesting that so many people think Prince Andrew is a rapist, dispite the fact that there is not a shred of evidence.

So the Queen protected Andrew and more importantly paid out untold millions why exactly ?
To make it go away ?

Or to prevent more coming out ?

TheignT · 26/04/2025 10:22

SnoozingFox · 26/04/2025 09:59

I'd imagine it was the culmination of a lifetime of very difficult circumstances and can never be attributed to just one factor.

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Yes I think you are right, impossible to disentangle it all. For me the estrangement from my children would be the hardest to bear but lots of mothers do bear that don't they.

I just wanted to add I don't think her children would be to blame if they chose to estrange her, we don't know if they did or why and we don't need to know and her children shouldn't feel guilty.

CantStopMoving · 26/04/2025 10:27

IkeaJesusChrist · 26/04/2025 10:18

The only sympathy I have is for her children.

I find it interesting that so many people think Prince Andrew is a rapist, dispite the fact that there is not a shred of evidence.

Exactly. There is so much innuendo and no other evidence at all. For all we know he only met her to take that photo. The whole affair from start to finish is holier than a slab of cheese and people have been filling the gaps in many different ways. I have literally no idea what went on and am no closer to knowing now. Doesn’t mean I have a high opinion of him at all but I can’t find him guilty of crimes in my own mind where there is no evidence

RosesAndHellebores · 26/04/2025 10:27

sofiamofia · 26/04/2025 10:03

I do not believe he would have sex with anyone without consent. No-one in his position, with years of being in the public eye, and of the gutter press, would be that stupid

Yes, powerful men have never been known to take advantage of women and girls.

I have to stop reading this thread. The utter bollocks being thrown about by the fawning subjects is sickening. Just ask yourself, if it was your 17 year old daughter, would you be quibbling about the legal definition of things, or time passed, or innocent until proven guilty when the actual Queen paid off the victim in order to protect her criminal son.

The current King and the future King has given Andrew their full support but people will still be horrified by Meghan Markle making her own money while waving their Union Jacks for a family that hold the country in contempt and will do anything to protect their own status and wealth.

Oh, do you mean like Mandy Smith and countless others in the media.

I think it's a shame the matter didn't go to court. We might have got closer to the truth.

Let's not forget that the Queen was dying when Virginia Giuffre was paid to withdraw her claims. We will never know what she felt were her chances of winning the case but she dropped her claim for money, albeit a lot of it.

There is no doubt that as far as Andrew is a bit of a dick with poor judgement, Virginia Giuffre is manipulative and a proven liar. I'd like to know the half of it relating to her relationship with her children and their father. I think it's notable that Andrew's daughters are very nice young women and have stuck by him.

There is much that Andrew shoukd not have done but we do not know if that extends to the claims that Virginia Giuffre made which may be as spurious as the nonsense that she was facing kidney failure having been involved in a serious rtc. She was not.

Puzzled4 · 26/04/2025 10:27

NorthWestToWest · 26/04/2025 09:27

I think that is unfair.
There are several members of the RF who are in fact commoners.
Catherine, Sophie, Camilla and 'Fergie'. Even the late Prince Philip was a relative commoner, albeit with distant royal relatives in Greece but he had a terrible life as a child passed from one family to another and arrived here almost as a refugee.

They bring influence. I think William is especially sensitive and will change the monarchy for the better in some ways.

They all do the best they can given their position, for various charities.

You can't ignore the Prince's Trust, the D of E award, and various other charities that they have established or are patrons of.

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What difference does it make that some royals are in fact commoners? It still doesn’t change the fact that they have immense unearned privilege and wealth, of a family of billionaires and yet we still have to throw hundreds of millions of people’s hard earned taxes at them, every year.

Prince Philip was not a commoner in any shape or form, as he is only descended from many of the different European royal houses, on both sides. And categorically he did not come here as a refugee. Although not rich, he came to this country to marry a princess, and was not fleeing persecution from France. Yes, he had tough times through out his young life, but he was still generally more privileged then most. It’s such over inflated fawning over another royal, who again lived in extreme unearned privilege and wealth.

Yes, they do lovely charity work and i think that some of the royals are seemingly genuinely decent people, but it’s 2025 not 1525, and I don’t think that we should have this one alpha family, who we are continuously told that they are more important and better than us, whom, if they walk into the room we need address them as “your royal highness” or “your majesty” or whatever. This shouldn’t be happening in this day and age. And their privilege will always make them immune from any real world consequences.

Canopies · 26/04/2025 10:28

The strong rumours were that PA was gay, I heard that from someone in those circles, who also knew George Michael was gay during his Wham years long before it was public knowledge.

In many ways it made sense, I don’t think he has had any other relationship other than SF, a few rumours of dalliances, but no real relationship before or after Sarah Ferguson.

So all the young girl interest was a real surprise, I was sure it would come out it was the opposite sex he had abused.

I don’t think anyone will ever know the full extent of what or who Epstein was, Trump, Clinton, Gates, et all, all ensnared in his elaborate plot.

HoskinsChoice · 26/04/2025 10:29

Ukisgaslit · 26/04/2025 08:26

”I can well believe Andrew to be arrogant, entitled, not very bright, a poor judge of character, too easily flattered but I do not believe he would have sex with anyone without consent. No-one in his position, with years of being in the public eye, and of the gutter press, would be that stupid.”

@Meadowfinch

you seem to be implying in your post that Virginia Guiffre was able to consent to sex with Andrew Windsor

Are you not aware that trafficked women and girls are not able to consent ??

'Consent' in this is not black and white. Trafficking can take many forms, some of which include full control, threats of or actual violence, force, cruelty etc. VG was groomed but she was free to come and go as she pleased. For example, when she met her husband, she just simply stopped working for them. She regularly left the house and also began grooming herself. She could have left at any point. Not giving 'consent' usually suggests she was forced into doing it. She wasn't she was groomed and lured into it. She was essentially giving consent as she was agreeing to have sex with men for money and the luxury lifestyle. The crime here is the grooming of a vulnerable person to make her think this is OK which is why Maxwell and Epstein were charged and the men she had sex with weren't pursued.

TheignT · 26/04/2025 10:32

Puzzled4 · 26/04/2025 10:27

What difference does it make that some royals are in fact commoners? It still doesn’t change the fact that they have immense unearned privilege and wealth, of a family of billionaires and yet we still have to throw hundreds of millions of people’s hard earned taxes at them, every year.

Prince Philip was not a commoner in any shape or form, as he is only descended from many of the different European royal houses, on both sides. And categorically he did not come here as a refugee. Although not rich, he came to this country to marry a princess, and was not fleeing persecution from France. Yes, he had tough times through out his young life, but he was still generally more privileged then most. It’s such over inflated fawning over another royal, who again lived in extreme unearned privilege and wealth.

Yes, they do lovely charity work and i think that some of the royals are seemingly genuinely decent people, but it’s 2025 not 1525, and I don’t think that we should have this one alpha family, who we are continuously told that they are more important and better than us, whom, if they walk into the room we need address them as “your royal highness” or “your majesty” or whatever. This shouldn’t be happening in this day and age. And their privilege will always make them immune from any real world consequences.

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Just to say Prince Philip came to England as an 8 year old, I seem to remember he remember he met the then Princess Elizabeth when she visited Dartmouth Naval college when she was about 13 and he was a cadet although I think they had both attended a royal wedding some years before.

JudgeJ · 26/04/2025 10:36

HoskinsChoice · 26/04/2025 09:58

But he can't clear his name. There is no evidence to say he did or didn't do it. The result would almost certainly have been innocent due to insufficient evidence. But along the way, lawyers would have trailed over and publicised every private matter of Andrew, probably dragging his family and friends into it too. He had a choice of paying millions on top lawyers and having years of this being dragged through courts or just close it down with money. It's a no brainer and doesn't make him any more guilty or innocent.

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One only has to read this thread to see that he could never clear his name, whatever a court verdict might have been. As my late mother used to say 'He got away with it' if it was someone she didn't like.

Puzzled4 · 26/04/2025 10:37

TheignT · 26/04/2025 10:32

Just to say Prince Philip came to England as an 8 year old, I seem to remember he remember he met the then Princess Elizabeth when she visited Dartmouth Naval college when she was about 13 and he was a cadet although I think they had both attended a royal wedding some years before.

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Yes, apologies. I stand corrected. But he didn’t come here as a refugee, as was suggested by a previous poster. And even if poor in comparison to other royals, when he was younger, he still lived a very privileged life

HoskinsChoice · 26/04/2025 10:38

IkeaJesusChrist · 26/04/2025 10:18

The only sympathy I have is for her children.

I find it interesting that so many people think Prince Andrew is a rapist, dispite the fact that there is not a shred of evidence.

I would hazard a guess that it goes like this:

Anti-monarchists - assume he is guilty and are delighted to have mud to sling (the OP being the prime example). They have no care whether he is guilty or not or that they are revelling in someone else's distress, they just love the opportunity and relative freedom to make 'paedo' and 'rapist' jibes.

Monarchists - won't have a word said against him and will blindly argue forever that he's innocent.

The middle ground - those that actually look at the case and the evidence and take a view on that.

(I also think social media is increasingly highlighting how stupid people are. Accusing someone of being a 'paedo' without a shred of evidence given by anyone including VG herself is all kinds of stupid!).

savory · 26/04/2025 10:39

MrsElijahMikaelson1 · 26/04/2025 09:59

I think it’s more nuanced than a simple it’s Andrew’s fault. Obviously her past had an impact on her mental health long term. However, with the recent RTA and the bizarre “I have 4 days to live” after that; I understand that she had quite vitriolic online bullying and that has to have an a massive impact on her.
tbh people writing shit on line about other people should be fucking ashamed of themselves and think about what they are doing and the possible impact.

Aye and it appears that an ex girlfirend and long time ally of Andrew is at the head of that bullying. Most reasonable folks will make the assumption no doubt with his blessing.

HelenWheels · 26/04/2025 10:43

BusyBeatle · 26/04/2025 10:14

wow!

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it was 24 years ago that the photograph was taken

Whooowhooohoo · 26/04/2025 10:45

Andrew is literally a paedophile and sexual predator.

Ukisgaslit · 26/04/2025 10:45

HoskinsChoice · 26/04/2025 10:38

I would hazard a guess that it goes like this:

Anti-monarchists - assume he is guilty and are delighted to have mud to sling (the OP being the prime example). They have no care whether he is guilty or not or that they are revelling in someone else's distress, they just love the opportunity and relative freedom to make 'paedo' and 'rapist' jibes.

Monarchists - won't have a word said against him and will blindly argue forever that he's innocent.

The middle ground - those that actually look at the case and the evidence and take a view on that.

(I also think social media is increasingly highlighting how stupid people are. Accusing someone of being a 'paedo' without a shred of evidence given by anyone including VG herself is all kinds of stupid!).

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It is much wider than this

The royals have along history of befriending and protecting pedophiles and other sex offenders
There had long been rumours around Mountbatten and it was all covered up . Anyone raising the issue was mocked and called a conspiracy theorist .
The royals let enough decades go by then drop the defence to focus on hiding more recent crimes .

As for Andrew being gay , I neither know nor care - there are rumours around several of the Windsors . Ironically being gay seems to be something else they cover up , despite it not being an issue for the general public

BMW6 · 26/04/2025 10:46

Canopies · 26/04/2025 10:28

The strong rumours were that PA was gay, I heard that from someone in those circles, who also knew George Michael was gay during his Wham years long before it was public knowledge.

In many ways it made sense, I don’t think he has had any other relationship other than SF, a few rumours of dalliances, but no real relationship before or after Sarah Ferguson.

So all the young girl interest was a real surprise, I was sure it would come out it was the opposite sex he had abused.

I don’t think anyone will ever know the full extent of what or who Epstein was, Trump, Clinton, Gates, et all, all ensnared in his elaborate plot.

Are you sure you're not confusing Andrew with Edward?

Andrew had loads of girlfriends before Sarah Ferguson, Koo Stark being the most "infamous".

mydamnfootstuckinthedoor · 26/04/2025 10:46

He is sleaze, that goes without saying. She was trafficked, also true. She was not trafficked by him. We do not know the whole story because she was paid off. He was never charged nor found guilty of anything. The press and her lawyers went after him alone of all the predators involved because they knew the Royal Family would pay them to make it go away. Trump and Clinton amongst others were part of Epstein’s notorious “party circuit” - no-one’s chasing them for payouts, I wonder why not? This does not in any way excuse Prince A’s behaviour, but there has to be some wider perspective here.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 26/04/2025 10:48

Muffinmam · 26/04/2025 07:50

The term is a colloquialism for any person who sexually exploits a minor for their own (or others) gratification.

The legal definition (as they pertain to specific age ranges) is rarely used.

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There's nothing "colloquial" about paedophilia, Muffinmam, and while the legal definition may be a bit narrow that's no reason to turn the term into something it isn't

We can all see just how repulsive Andrew is, and while it wasn't going to happen it's a shame he never stood before a court, but for me at least there's enough to damn him for without dragging in untested allegations too

Personally I'm more bothered that we're expected to tolerate a known paedophile enabler as Head of State, but of course that's a whole other subject which IMO doesn't get anything like enough attention

Hoppinggreen · 26/04/2025 10:52

Poor woman, what happened to her left her with MH issues and when she posted online recetnly about an accident that probably didn't happen ceratin sections of the media and in fact some people on here too that as evidence she lied about everything.
IMO she was driven to suicide and i hope she finally has some peace now
My thoughts are with her family

Puzzledandpissedoff · 26/04/2025 10:53

It is much wider than this
The royals have along history of befriending and protecting pedophiles and other sex offenders

Precisely, @Ukisgaslit, and while Andrew serves as a useful diversion/lightning conductor, it seems to me a shame that this isn't more widely recognised

CiscoTS · 26/04/2025 10:57

gottakeeponmoving · 26/04/2025 07:29

You lost me at ‘that ginger woman’.

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That’s what I thought.

No need to be offensive OP.

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