Teacher showing photos to kids of victorian dead children - slightly disturbing

[whyiwonderwhy]

I am finding this so disturbing I can't sleep! However I might be being oversensitive, who knows. It is the "but - WHY?" bit which is bothering me most.

The lesson was about the industrial revolution, and the subject of photography came up, 2 of the earliest photos were shown to the class (13-14yo) and then....I wish I could say the teacher showed photos of some of the extraordinary engineering inventions of the day, or of busy streets, or China, or something wonderful and extraordinary...but no, the teacher showed 10 photos of dead children and talked about how the Victorians would photograph dead children as though they were still alive, with the rest of the family, in a commemorative way. I have seen some in the past (I didn't learn about it at school however) and they are moving and tragic and disturbing. Nothing else, just these photos.

Just wondering...why? why would the teacher do this? Any ideas?

This teacher has form by the way. A lot of it. But this has for some reason blindsided me.

@Ruthietuthie @nyancatdays
If you can find the post i quoted, it says at the end (and I agree with this) "If it’s not [schools] showing kids awful photos it’s them pushing the trans agenda or pretending they can’t do anything about your child being bullied into mental health issues"
What do you both think about this?

You have also defended the teacher here - do you have a role in deciding/influencing what is being taught in schools?

It has been remarked upon. But it isn't true. I am capable of being wrong - and indeed always admit to it when I find out I am.

I think you're the one talking bollocks and quoting things not relevant tbh

I've yet to see evidence of that
Being as every time you're wrong you make either a more ludicrous suggestion or completely change your point

I was joking here, just in case that wasn't obvious! I just found it quite funny to be told I wasn't capable of being wrong by someone disagreeing with me.

Seamus Heaney. He used his pen instead of digging with a fork is all I can remember when I studied him for A level - so he was on the curriculum then - is he not now?

Seems a cheap shot shock way of engaging the kids.
The Industrial revolution is an amazing period to study, so much more than this.

"I've been called out so I'll pretend it was a joke"

If it’s not [schools] showing kids awful photos ….

It circles back to this. Why would they be considered awful photos. Honestly, no more awful than some of the photos from men in the 70’s wearing ‘disco shorts’, which were unfortunately considered fashionable among certain age groups. It’s all just ‘of the time’. I mean, if they were shown graphic photos of crime scenes (such as those where court is cleared as they are considered so awful), then I’d agree, but these are not awful photos, they just typified a new style of mourning rituals brought about by the Industrial Revolution.

A little pearl clutchy op.
They used to make trinkets out of dead peoples hair too.
Some cultures probably still take post mortem pictures , you are over reacting.

Very well said. She clearly thinks she’s a cut above everyone else and knows best about everything!

Maybe it’s more of a mental health issue than a fear of being wrong!

@whyiwonderwhy, I am originally from the UK, but now live in the US and work at a university there. The Research Institute I am part of is in the US. We are funded by the university - so by the university's endowment and federal funding, by tuition, and by grant-funding, in our case, by the National Endowment for the Humanities and by the National Science Foundation. (Although with Trump in power that is changing). We also have some funding from private organizations, such as the Mellon Foundation and the Henry Luce Foundation. For example, next year we will have funding from the Toyoto Foundation for a project that compares the way various Asian societies are preparing for the demographic tipping point that the World Health Organization calls "Peak Death" (where a large long-lived elderly population combined with a low birth rate means a society suddenly faces more death than ever before).
But I am also affiliated with a UK example, The Centre for Death and Society at the University of Bath. https://www.bath.ac.uk/research-centres/centre-for-death-society/
You can take a look at their current research projects and their funding sources here:
https://www.bath.ac.uk/corporate-information/current-centre-for-death-society-research-projects/

@whyiwonderwhy, I happy to answer your question, quoted from another poster, but also can't find the original post, or I would tag that poster too.

"If you can find the post i quoted, it says at the end (and I agree with this) "If it’s not [schools] showing kids awful photos it’s them pushing the trans agenda or pretending they can’t do anything about your child being bullied into mental health issues"
What do you both think about this?

• On the topic of "pushing the trans agenda" issues, I think that we are on a very different page, BUT I also wouldn't comment on this question as I don't do research on this topic and don't have a child in the UK school system. My child is in the US school system, and despite a great deal of discourse about "the trans agenda," it really hasn't been a topic that has come up in any way in my child's classroom.
• On the issue of bullying and mental health issues, of course I would want schools to act and would want support for any child in this situation. What parent and educator wouldn't?

You then write: "You have also defended the teacher here - do you have a role in deciding/influencing what is being taught in schools?"
Actually, funnily enough, I have consulted on elements of national curriculum. However, my contributions to this post come from:

1. Deep knowledge of how history is now taught - away from the "great inventions by great men" direction, to a more complex, nuanced history, which captures the realities of multiple people's lives.
2. Deep knowledge of pedagogy and of child development at multiple stages, focussing particularly on how children and young adults best learn deeply - how they come to really understand retain material, have the ability to critique it, to teach it to others.
3. Perhaps a different perspective than yours on what is "weird" and what is "traumatic." There are various reasons for this, scholarly and personal.

Recently, something happened in my son's classroom that my son found distressing. I did talk to the teacher, but my framing was very much "I want to understand what happened and go from there." I wouldn't ever presume that I knew what was really going on in a classroom, what was behind curriculum design or lesson design, without talking to that teacher. Either I trust my son's teacher or I don't. Just as, in my classes, either my colleagues and my students' parents trust me, respect my expertise, or they don't. I am ALWAYS glad to answer students' questions about why we are covering certain material, what the big ideas here are, and why this matters. (My students are university age, so I am not in contact with their parents. But were I am teacher in a school, I would be glad to have such a discussion).

I don't think anything I say will convince you. And that's okay. But coming at this as both an educator and the mother of a younger child, I would be grateful for what sounds like engaging teaching. I would not find this way into the period strange, irrelevant, or troubling.

Now. That poem isn’t. It’s about his brother who died in an RTC at the age of 4.
We don’t (shouldn’t) have scripts to follow in lessons anyway.

The camera was an amazing invention of the Industrial Revolution. Kind of cool to teach children how it was used so even poor people could have an image of a loved one as prior to photography only the rich who could commission painted portraits ever got an image to look at as a momento.

At least he wasn’t showing them the Victorian pornography photos. 🤣

I meant we do actually choose what we show/teach. Academies don't have to follow the National Curriculum so we can choose what we teach at KS3.

100% agree.

Really pleased you’ve chosen Seamus Heaney 😊

OP, you are part of the problem of what's going wrong in schools these days. Your antagonistic, self- righteous responses are going to do your child a disservice. Just stop. Please. For your child's sake, turn that aggressive attitude around.

I don’t see the issue with this. Victorian death photography is part of our / Britain’s history and the children are old enough to learn about it.

You are incredibly rude and also taking rubbish. Our children of the victims of what is going wrong in schools, and no it is not remotely my fault! How ridiculous. I am not in the least bit aggressive or antagonistic, I have been perfectly charming even to the rudest posters - the one time I was slightly rude (responding to one of the many rude posts to me) I asked MN to delete my post, because I am that nice and considerate. What right do you have to suggest my parenting is doing my child a disservice?! What a crock.

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

No

You have been rude. PP hasn't

Just absolute rubbish, and this applies to both your post and that of @Lyraloo
which you quoted. On Friday night I was blindsided and posted in an anonymous way to get some insights - which I now have, courtesy of some of the most ridiculous posts on this thread, ironically. There are no outing details here so how could this possibly be trying to get someone disciplined? And how could anonymous posters be useful "on my side"?! The accusations are just bizarre.

You come across as a real piece of work, nasty and spiteful! No I don't. And I am not.