17 Year Old Daughter- Is my mom abusive? Should I keep in touch with her after I move out?

[ThatDandyReader]

Hi all,

I am a frequent lurker on mn because all throughout my teens I was never sure whether the way my mom treated me was normal/justified, or if 'normal' moms don't treat their daughters this way. I will warn that this post will have a good dollop of melodrama but try and bear with me.

Essentially, I am to move out in September for uni and I finally have control over my relationship with my mom. I am asking everyone here: a) whether her behaviour is justified at all, like would you treat a daughter this way? and b) for anyone who had similar circumstances and is now an adult how they managed it?

Right, so I will start from the start of my secondary school days, as I would say this was when her behaviour verged on abuse. She would always be angry at me for not being a happy child, and tbh I found secondary school hard because I was quite introverted. Anyways, that coupled with frequent screaming matches at home where my mom and siblings would go at each other over small things really took a toll on me. My mental health was so awful, I was constantly getting scolded at school for not having equipment, uniform, etc, (felt scared to ask my mum for this stuff, too busy), and at home it was constant anger and hatred. This culminated in an attempt to take my life when I was 12 (sorry, tw, but this is relevant). Did not work essentially, mom called me a 'miserable bitch' and when I tried to talk to her about how I was feeling she says 'Do you think I don't feel the same way?' Anyways complete hell I felt there. Another incident at that same time was when my mom saw a notification on ,my phone and thought it was a boy. It was not- embarrassingly it was my fan page for a male YouTuber. Anyways, she smashes my phone and screams at me. I genuinely felt so traumatised. That was a year when I couldn't talk to my friends except at school and so very lonely.

What gets me is that there is never any apologies, in fact she would always say, 'Have you stopped putting your face up?' or 'Silly bitch deserved it.' And it's not as if she was always cruel, in fact with other daughters of family friends it was constant praise to them- 'Wow, isn't she gorgeous,' etc, etc. But my mom has never really asked me if I was okay, how I'm finding things, never got any positive validation even though I am a decent person school wise and I think I am quite nice.

I will say, things have gotten better over the years as I have completely knuckled down with my schoolwork. I know her pressure points so I never ask for money, or do anything rebellious, and I managed to perform well in school. What makes me think my mom has some good in her is how she has been in the uni application process. She really came through in terms of coming to open days, and (I really don't mean this as a brag), when I applied to Cambridge she got me practice interviews and paid for train tickets to visit. I did end up getting my place there and I feel like if I cut her off it's a massive betrayal for how hard she worked to get me there. And I am definitely not a perfect daughter- I would say my main faults are using her makeup when I was younger, cleaning up after myself, and when my mom shouts at me I just completely keep to myself and don't really speak to her. She has called me abusive for that before.

But again, I am torn because there was a recent event where I went to see Bristol on an open day and asked her to come with me. She really didn't want to and I did have to beg. It got to the day, I was so tired and I looked at her without smiling. She starts screaming at me for 'having my afce up' and banging the iron on the ironing board. I felt the exact same horrible feeling as when I was 11 again and I just get the sense that I am going to be subject to this anger all throughout my adult life if I do something that displeases her.

Sorry for how long this is, I am going a bit crazy when I reflect on all of it. Any thoughts would be appreciated, thank you for reading

Is your mother a single mom or still with your father?

I think you are saying should you cut your mum off completely and say you are estranged so you can get more financial support.

It's a terrible system in the UK which is financially punishing loving parents while absent parents and ones to be estranged dont pay

If you think you would be happy not seeing or hearing your mum for 3 years go for it. After that time you will both be different people and likely to be better in a distant but better relationship. It sounds like you have siblings so hopefully can stay in touch with them

I believe you.

Your mom probably still suffers mentally as a result of the abuse that she went through as a child. However, that doesn't give her the right to project her own issues onto her children.

Living away from home will offer you some much-needed space and time to think. Enjoy your time, and perhaps consider making the big decision of going low- or no-contact later.

In the meantime, is there an option of staying in Halls over the holidays? If you can, try to get a part-time job and build up savings for funding yourself through university, accommodation during and after it, and also just for independence and peace of mind. You'll need a big confidence boost after what you've been through, and this is just the start of it.

Good luck, and congratulations on getting into Cambridge!

This is a really good post. OP, go to Cambridge, and as above, start the foundations for having a relationship with her on your terms. It's confusing having a mother like this. Mine is similar.

I can relate to a lot of what you say. I moved countries at 23 and that allowed me the space, time and most importantly distance, to be able to process everything and start to heal. To become my own person and away from her influence and negativity, realise that I am good enough just as I am and not an awful and difficult to live and be nice to human being. I realised I don’t need a mother (HA!) , especially not one like her. I don’t need her approval or validation . That making her proud was unattainable and that getting her to accept me for who I am is impossible. This completely changed the dynamic, and while she’s still very much a twat and still has abusive tendencies, it doesn’t cut as much , if at all. She actually tries to manage her behaviours a lot more(even if she still spectacularly fails sometimes) because we are equals and I don’t actually “need” her.We have an okish , if massively superficial relationship .

OP you have done the right thing in posting here. You have done amazingly well to get a Cambridge offer despite everything you have gone through.

I have a daughter there. When she went, our family financial situation was not great. The university and her college made sure that she had access to a Cambridge Bursary which pretty much paid her room rental. She preferred to cater for herself, so her costs were less than eating in college every day. Since being there, she has worked on things like clothing swaps where you take in items you no longer want and exchange them - really popular for balls! She worked at some of the balls, which meant that she got to work for half of the time and then enjoy the rest of it for free.

It is probably worth reaching out to your college to ask about the support available. In DD's case, whilst she did not need a lot, when things went pear-shaped due to the mother of an ex-boyfriend, they were brilliant. One of the things that Cambridge is really keen to do is to become less elitist. There is money available for all sorts, all you need to do is ask for it. They are very keen to attract excellent students from all sorts of backgrounds, so please do ask. Good luck in your exams!

She sounds awful. It’s so sad you are grateful for something as simple as her helping you with uni applications and buying train tickets, which any mother should do. I hope you flourish at uni and do well in your A Levels and never look back.

OP, as other have said, a normal, imperfect parent who loses their shit and shouts at their kids occasionally will own their mistakes, apologise and work hard to do better. That is a world away from the situation you’re describing, which is, unequivocally, abusive. Quite possibly your mother’s behaviour is exacerbated by her money worries and past trauma, but that doesn’t change the outcome or excuse her actions. I’m middle-aged now and it took me decades to see my own mother for the abusive narcissist she is; I’m in awe of young people who recognise this sort of thing early and take steps to distance themselves from it, as I’d never have had the confidence to do so at that age. You sound like a highly thoughtful, intelligent young women of whom any normal mother would be immensely proud, and getting into Cambridge is an outstanding achievement which I hope will give you a huge confidence boost. My advice would be to “grey rock” her for now and distance yourself over time, rather than going NC suddenly (which she’ll likely only use to generate more drama) and focus all your energy on your future. Then pack your bags for uni and don’t look back, only forward to the wonderful future you deserve.

Hmm... not sure how anyone benefits from me being estranged and scraping money from a minimum wage jobs to cover uni costs. If I was money hungry I think I'd just put up with her and get the same money as everyone else

Thank you everyone for the lovely messages. It's so nice to be validated. I am definitely going to knuckle down as much as I can now and then once at uni I'll have to support myself. Most people here have said such nice things thank you again :)

If all goes to plan and you make it to Cambridge, you might find the emotional weight of the past 6 years suddenly hits you like a tonne of bricks.
Familiarise yourself with uni support services and don't be afraid to use them.
The classic thing is for people to wait until an exam deadline and realise they're super stressed and then ask for support, but there will probably be access to counselling for students and it's likely to be quieter in September than later in the year.

Try and develop some coping strategies to help ground you and calm you down if you're stressed.

And if there are any mentoring programmes etc, look into then.

Basically the more support you can scaffold early on, the better.

Hi OP. Your post brought back so much for me. My mother was similar in her behaviour to me. I got into Cambridge too.

It wasn't until a bit later, when my boyfriend at Cambridge helped me understand that it wasn't normal or ok, that it was abuse, that I started to see how very badly I'd been treated. Then I fell to pieces, was either drunk or stoned my whole time at uni (couldn't cope otherwise), started getting what I now know were flashbacks, was suicidal the whole time I was there. I got a good 2.1 and master's degrees, but missed out on what could have been a great time, I was so confused and unhappy.

30 years on, I'm a therapist, and wish I'd known when I was your age that it was abuse and that it really, really wasn't anything wrong with me!

They didn't have counselling or support back in my day, but please do, if you can, find counselling when you get to uni. It could give you the space to find some clarity and breathing space after everything you've been through and to work out what's best for you. You sound like a thoughtful, insightful, lovely person and you deserve to have caring, considerate people around you who treat you with love and respect.

I am in no way defending anything bad she has done to you but is it possible your mother was suffering with mental health issues herself and struggled big time and hike you grew up ? Where was your dad in all if this hun ?
Maybe instead of cutting her off you both could try and have a different relationship and in time as you grow you can talk about all those things ?

Hi, thank you for sharing your story. Can I ask how you found it at Cambridge in general? My offer is for King's college which from what I can see is a bit more diverse and defo more financial support. Do you think you need to be a very confident person there? Is everyone like genius level Sorry this is off topic but naturally I haven't got many connections there. That is amazing you got a great grade in your degree and congratulations on masters.

Not too sure how long these threads last, but I will just give final clarification. 1) Dad is very passive. Does not speak English and mom is kind of the 'breadwinner' literally and also in how she runs the house. He goes to work and then goes to bed etc, etc. 2) I have a sister who cut my mom off because she went through similar stuff to me. Sister was more defiant and there was stuff like trying to burn the house down and putting a knife to sofas (before the living situation turned bad). Have two older brothers whom I really love. We three are close. Mom does not target them, they are more happy 'lad' types and my mom liked them more than me because they could brush off her abuse. It's an understanding between us kids that mom is 'psycho' (just a term we use, not meant seriously) and if mom is in her screaming mood we'll all avoid her. She has been horrible to the boys tbf, but less targeted. I recall her smashing my brother's gaming thing because she was stressed in general. And then generally when mom is stressed she will smash plates or bang things or start literally growling. But the boys just see it as 'old mom' and I guess because they're less sensitive than me they can take it. They don't ignore her after a screaming match and it's a bit of eye rolling 'thats just our mom' and they move on. Then mom will complain that her daughters are ruined, etc etc.

OP, you deserve so so much better. Have you looked at the Stately Homes threads on Mumsnet? They might be useful.

I know what you mean about lurking here to have a sense of 'normal'. There are some topics where I do the same and it's helped a lot.

In Cambridge, the college will have support systems of its own. The Faculty will have different support systems and financial opportunities. Ideally, look at both. There are also temporary jobs in admin or even cleaning at colleges, in student outreach and so on as well.

Join lots of societies that catch your eye at Freshers' Fair or whatever they do these days and soon you'll have lots of new interesting people in your life :) especially try things that don't seem related to your degree.

Do you have any hobbies or social interests or faith background? I can suggest a few places. Others will know more.

Silly question now that I read this back. Am sorry to hear that you had some difficulties in your degree. If you are comfortable sharing I guess I was asking how you found the whole 'Oxbridge' hype because I feel like I'm entering Wonderland or something (if I make my grades!)

I can relate both as a child in this situation and as a mother who is unhappy in her life. Something that jumped out in your post was her saying don’t you think I feel the same way. It’s all about her. I had mental health struggles as a child and my mum also made it all about her and the impact on her and how terrible I was for putting her through that. I sorted my life out and for various reasons it’s become hard again and often I have a fantasy about not having to be alive anymore- it’s really opens my eyes to how shit my mother was. Because no matter how shit I feel I love my dd and could never make her feel bad or take my feelings out on her.

my mother was also very ‘proud’ when I got good grades and did uni. But she wasn’t proud of me really because she is narcissistic so my achievements are seen by her as an extension of how awesome she is and she likes to bask in the reflected glory of her childrens success. It reads very much like this is the case with your mother too? She’s been supportive with open days etc not for you but for her to have a dd at Cambridge. What you need to focus on is that getting to Cambridge and want just going to the open days was it? Who did all the hard work getting the grades without any emotional support? It wasn’t your mother.

I have an intelligent dd. Im so incredibly proud of her and I nag her to do her work and listen to her tell me about what she’s been learning, I’ve paid for lots to support her education despite money troubles. Never once will I scream at her for asking for things that cost money, I frequently have to say mo but she’s not scared to ask me! And when she succeeds in her life I will be proud and also know it’s her achievement not mine. I also have a challenged son, he’s intelligent too but not academic. He has a lot that’s hard in his life due to SEN and he is hard to parent, he is why we are poor as I cannot work due to his support needs, he has poor mental health and it’s gruelling supporting him with that. It breaks my heart when he says he should just die it would be easier for everyone. I tell him it would break my heart and I’d never get over it, that it’s my job as a mother to support my children no matter what and I’m glad to do it because I chose to be a mother. I could not imagine reacting to his struggles the way my mother or your mother have. That’s not love and that just makes things worse!!

if you want to distance yourself from your mother then do that. No child owes their parents the duty is the other way around. And when they have been poor parents you especially don’t need to feel guilty for drawing a boundary. I haven’t fully cut my mother off, there have been periods of no/low contact but I never managed to get up the guts to take the full step of completely cutting her out. I will tell you it’s much easier as an adult living independently and not reliant on a parent to have boundaries. My times of low/no contact have been when I couldn’t take the emotional abuse anymore and subsequently she’s changed now she’s aging as she knows she can’t treat me badly or I will walk away as I don’t need her. So we have a superficial relationship and that works for me.

basically I’m saying whatever you feel the need to do then you do it. You don’t owe your mum anything.

also prepare yourself for a resurgence in this turmoil if/when you become a mother yourself. I felt like I’d don’t a lot of work and moved past it then I became a mother myself and saw that side of the parent child relationship and felt failed all over again because I could never fail my child as my mother failed me. I do see that a shitty childhood and not addressing your own emotions before motherhood is how mothers like mine become shit mothers. I can see how she resented all the opertunities I had and the differences in my childhood to hers led to her resenting me because I have hints of that when I see the sacrifices I make for my own kids and their ingratitude. What I cannot understand is how anyone lets those feelings impact their parenting or how people cannot see past it to the bigger picture which is that no child asked to be born and becoming a parent brings responsibility and duty the impact their existence has on a parent is not and never will be the child’s fault. You can intellectually understand this and you can take what people are saying here and know you have no obligation to your mother but until you are a mother yourself you won’t fully appreciate how terribly she has failed you.

I think you've probably grasped by now that yes, your Mom is abusive and there really isn't any justification for that.

It is likely she's aided you in getting to Cambridge because that looks good for her, Bristol doesn't have carry the same weight when she's telling her friends/customers etc how well she's raised you etc etc.

Take what you can get without it finishing you off.

I left home at 16 first time round, residential college - came back and left again at 18 - tried college again then.

The world was not then, and really still isn't now, set up to really allow people under 21 or even 25, to properly function as independent adults. The general expectation is that you have a parent at least, somewhere, who will support you in some way. There are ways around it, it's not insurmountable.. but it does make life a bit harder.

Hopefully with getting into Cambridge you'll not find it too much of a problem but I would look for any opportunity for extra support that you can find and make sure those who need to know that you are self-supporting and whilst you have a parent, they're not to be relied upon and you are low-contact.

Going low-contact at Uni should be pretty easy - hopefully if you make the odd 'hi how are ya' phone call perhaps once a week or once a fortnight (or better yet, emails!) she'll feel satisfied you're grateful for allllll her hard work and help (I know.. ugh) and won't do anything to chuck a spanner in the works.

There are often opportunities to remain there over the holidays if you're willing to work, and Cambridge is probably better supplied with these opportunities - I did this at college aged 16/17 - (agricultural college), as returning to an alcoholic depressive parent was not appealing (and the other parent said 'I have your sister, you're your mothers problem, fuck off'.. he's such a delight)...

So I worked on the college stable yard and other local yards, did some cleaning work around the campus and as my room was not in one of the nicer halls (it was in a portacabin round the back, cheapest option there was) I got to stay in my room too!

You will need to start looking for those opportunities quickly though as they do go fast, and Christmas can be trickier than summer/half terms.

Best of luck, I think you could do really well for yourself!!

Hi. Good questions! It was a very different era when I was there: only a third of the students were female and msny of the male tutors openly against admitting women (in the 90s!). So I didn't enjoy it, but mainly because my confidence and self-worth were so low (which, I later learned, was due to childhood abuse). I had social anxiety and there was no pastoral care, counselling or financial support for me at that time.

You should find it much better there now! Kings has always been known as one of the friendliest, most diverse and welcoming colleges and I have friends of different ages who all loved it there. It's a truly beautuful place (I go back to visit a few times a year, Cambridge is so beautiful).

Definitely not all geniuses there, but of course to get in you have to be academically very able. My advice to younger me would be cut the drugs and alcohol, find some volunteering you can be passionate about, learn how to stick to a routine, spend more time in the library! :) And definitely as much therapy and other support possible - see what you can find as soon as you're there, as, like another comment here said, it's quite natural for people who've just removed themselves from abusive or traumatic circumstances to find it all floods in at once, or starts coming up. All the emotion and stress you've managed to cope with so brilliantly might need some space to be expressed once you're in a safe place for it.

I think you'll have a great time and do so well.

Sorry if I am dragging this thread. Have been thinking a lot about how to access support at uni. How do I even explain to them my situation? Does anyone have any experience of it? It feels so personal but I think everyone is right that I ought to let them know.

Cambridge University Chaplaincy will not try to convert you but will activate all the help you need and have a good overview of what's available. I know some of the chaplains personally. They are good on safeguarding and confidentiality.

You might also have a college officer for student welfare or pastoral support but these can be hit and miss even when well-intentioned. I've known very effective ones but also some less so.

This is good to hear. I meant more so, how do I even word it? I was thinking that if I need more robust support, like asking to stay over the holidays, maybe I should make a big evidence bank on how she’s treated me?

I think I am just worrried about coming off as a sob story victim. I feel like it comes off as so whiny. And because I was not physically abused maybe they won’t see it as that bad? I mean, some of my replies here are a bit ambivalent about it. I’m so worried about getting there and starting on the wrong foot

They will be used to hearing all sorts. You could print off this thread and show them? Emotional abuse is real abuse.

Cambridge takes some getting used to for everyone...you won't be starting out on the wrong foot. You sound ambitious in a good way. You're starting to plan a different future:)

It's hard not to be ambivalent when it's a close family member. Nobody is abusive 100% of the time but that doesn't mean any abuse is ever ok.

Thank you. One final thing that’s on my mind. My school are slightly aware that my mom has been horrible to me. In Year Seven I did tell them about how she treated me after the attempt on my life. Is it a good idea to get it in writing that the school knew? The only thing is my mom had a meeting with them and was like ‘kids these days am I right’ so maybe the school brushed it off? Ugh really frustrating that I wasn’t exactly kept in the loop.

I just want to have some legitimacy to my claim. So I could always ask? But if I tell the school I’m still in abusive household will they report me for safeguarding? Sorry if you are not well placed to answer this.