Discussion about Jesus’s death which now encompasses creationism and the second coming. Thread 2

[ZoggyStirdust]

Continues from here if anyone wants to

www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5318577-to-not-understand-why-christians-think-jesus-died-for-our-sins?page=40&reply=143772264

The quran is full of truth and scientific miracles that are being proved today. Read it.

Utter gibberish
Your life is dominated by a fairy tale
It is totally mind boggling

God authorised Satan to do what he liked.
If you take that story literally God behaved disgracefully.

LOLOLOLOL

😀😂😱

But of course it’s all made up, by men, like Augustine, in the decades and centuries after the death of Jesus, who never wished to create a religion, but which only exists because of these theories. Organised Christianity came after his death, and ultimately some self appointed holy men people took it upon themselves to convince others that they knew what god wanted or was thinking.

Like what, for example?

Jesus appointed the Apostles to spread the word of God - it was the last thing he said before he ascended into Heaven.

So they didn't make it up, they were acting on Jesus/God's wishes.

Organised religion has existed a lot longer than Christianity. Jesus and the Apostles were Jewish. Hinduism emerged over 7000 years ago.

All religion is man made. No one has ever proved gods existence. Someone just saying god is real and they happen to know what god wants for us, still doesn’t make it true or real.

I don’t think anyone would change their beliefs as they are ingrained, mostly from childhood and through upbringing, but science, particularly evolutionary Biology and Astro physics, explain how the universe was created and how we evolved.

It would be extremely difficult to agree with one without rejecting the other. That’s why I can’t possibly believe in a god because the science explains everything with quantifiable evidence. All subject research get things wrong, they realise when they have a better explanation and understanding and correct it, or they have more advanced technology. That’s why 200 years ago it makes sense to assume there was a higher power called god as there was no other rational explanation as there was no technology available but now the technological advances we’ve made have say that evolution absolutely happened.

I hope you’ve noted it in your diary/to do list.

So satan is more powerful than god?

Southern Baptist or UK type Baptist?

The concept of 'rapture' is new one on me, and not somthing we covered in RE at school. But, am I correct in saying that fanatical types see it as the bit before judgement, when believers (and non believers, somehow, as long as they haven't activally rejected religion but just remained quiet) get swept up to heaven, leaving the rest of mankind on earth. Presumably to live happily ever after without religous interefence...

But, where does the second coming fit in to this? I assumed, perhaps incorrectly, that that's when jesus returned to earth. If so, that's a bit disappointing for believers, who have already been swept up to heaven, where jesus presumably used to be and therefore have just missed him. So, they don't get to see jesus when on earth, and then when they to heaven jesus has already left... And, worse than that, non believers get his presence amongst them!

edited for clarity - which might or might not be succesful ;)

You seem to fundamentally misunderstand what religion is or requires. The whole point of religion is about having faith, belief without proof.

It's highly likely that we cannot prove God's existence - I question if we should try!

So you think think Mohammad rode to the moon on horseback and split it in half, or that women are worth only half the value of a man? The Koran is as full of bollocks as the bible.

As I understand it, beliefs about the Rapture/End of Days/Second Coming are very different across different types of Christianity. That part of the Bible, and especially Revelation, is mostly ignored by a lot of Christians.

Some people think John had lost it a bit when he wrote Revelation!

On god's instruction and aquiessence.

This wonderful god who wipes out humanity on a whim with a flood. Condones slavery and child sacrifice and murders small children for laughing at a bald man. What a monster he is.

The Flood thing I completely agree with - the God of the Hebrew Scriptures is vengeful and jealous.

Where does he condone child sacrifice and murder for laughing at a bald man?

One of my favourite passages...

2 King's 2:23 and onwards.

Beware of she bears 🤣

I've just found it and read it! Not something I'd heard of in the Bible, and my first reaction was to think it's maybe not literal?

Or it could be divine punishment for jeering a prophet. I couldn't say!

No, evolution is the fairy tale. My life is founded on truth

It wasn't on a whim. Noah told people of the coming flood and they laughed at him and so didn't go to a place of safety. Much like the way in which Christians on this thread have warned of the second coming and judgement and most of you have laughed...

Agreed, and also surely part of faith is accepting that not everyone needs to or will believe. Because if you can't prove the theory that any god exists, never mind a specifc god, you have to accept that many people will have a different view.

If you then start denying science (I know, many do not and can quite happily let the two - religion and science - coexist) you are going to allienate a lot of people. As I believe Lincoln once said (or, if he didn't it has certainly been attributed to him), "better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and to remove all doubt"...

UK baptist, not the American fundamentalist type! I know of at least 4 similar baptist churches within about 5 miles of the one I attend. It's a mainstream UK denomination, despite people on this thread making us out to be a crazy minority!