Sending love to trans people on MN and beyond

[cassandre]

This isn't an AIBU. I just wanted to send love to trans people, in the UK especially, and to other members of the LGBTQIA+ community.

This hasn't been the easiest week for trans people, but there are a lot of us out there who accept you for who you are. We have your backs and we believe that eventually, tolerance and compassion will win.💖💖💖

Love from a longtime MNer and trans-inclusive feminist.

Why not just give us the stats, with a reference? It’s much less than you lot have been demanding of me

No one asked for this information earlier,

Helleofabore has asked you questions that a lot of us would like the answer to. Do not think for one second that because nobody else is asking that we aren't interested. Please answer her questions.

Were the participants grouped by age or by pubertal developement?
Were the treatments of the participants acknowledged?
How were the mental health comorbidities controlled for?

It's been posted on multiple threads today by various people. I doubt this is the only one you are on.

You're missing the point. A visibly looking man walks into a female only toilet. How do you know they're a trans man and not a cis male abuser? You don't.

Sure some people will claim they can tell the difference, but they're the people who clearly have absolutely no interaction with the trans community.

I know actual trans men and women, if one of my trans male friends stood next to a cis male friend I can guarantee you couldn't tell who was who.

As I said, hate has clouded this whole debate from the start. The issue is abusive men, always has been, always will be

The issue is abusive men, always has been, always will be

And some of those abusive men pretend to be women, and want to access women only spaces.

The issue is abusive men, always has been, always will be
Precisely. And TW are men.

Now please explain how we can tell who is a decent male and who isn't. Do they have a badge?

Actually it is.

How would you describe a bloke in a dress insisting they deserve to gatecrash a rape crisis centre where traumatised and vulnerable women are trying to heal, but find the mere presence of men, any men, cis or not highly triggering and then telling them they need to reframe their trauma? I call someone like that an abuser.

Oh and those "we are at.risk of killing ourselves because you don't let us identify as women/insist on our chosen pronouns/ display our fetish to young children at a parade created for an extremely marginalised group of people who weren't allowed to marry until recently no less"

This I consider to be emotional blackmail and threats to get what you want. That's abuse.

The issue is that many of these TRAs are themselves abusers. A strong word but it is what it is.

Bit bored of doing others’ work so they can use it to make facile arguments.

I asked for it pages ago.

I don't consider you to be in good faith considering the way you made an absolute statement, doubled down, provided studies without links (and didn't come back with them) and didn't give any discussion on the papers you linked. But resorted to telling us you were an academic and therefore could back up the absolute claim that you made, that you then walked back.

You also have demonised Maya Forstater for making a statement about a person that she was not talking directly too. Yet, you have also doubled down on that too. And ignored what that male people said during the interview, just continued to demonise Maya.

So, no. I don't consider you to be someone who has shown any good faith on this thread at all.

The HM prison service stats? Here

So how many of the victims of their sex crimes were female?

Thank you @Nameychangington

It looks like I need to screenshot it too 😬

Well then. Let's do what you did.

Please refer to the ministry of justice statistics. Isn't that what you did. Told us where we should look and tell us to go and look at it.

What??? 😱

So it doesn't matter about the ratio of violence between men and TW, just who they unleashed their violence on?

Apparently.

And let's note that male children who might be also included in the female single sex spaces were ignored.

I just asked one question that is quite mild compared to how several of you have been treating me for hours.

The difference is, if I care I will actually look it up for myself. If you really care you can do the same. I even told you where to find Dr Bakker

That's weird, cos all the transmen I know are under 5'3 and under 8 stone. No one would mistake them for a man. A 10 year old boy possibly.

Do you have any trouble correctly sexing the people in this photo? Humans, particularly women (because it's more important for our safety), are in general really good at it.

And threatening women that men will come into their spaces if they don't do what you want really isn't a great look.

Trans women ARE men. And they are part of the issue given they commit violent sex crimes at higher rates than men who don’t identify as women.

Men (including TW) may enter women’s spaces still - The difference is now if a man enters a women’s space, I can complain and not be accused of committing a hate crime - I will have to be listened to and respected. That means a lot to so many of us who previously would be called bigots and told to STFU and budge up for men

Hahahahahaha

I see.

So, you doubling down on an absolute statement and all, for those pages where we were pointing out the issues with your statement, we should just ignore that behaviour.

???????

Are you actually trying to suggest that the main victims of sex crimes committed by transwomen would be men?You're really scraping the barrel now

Do we really believe that these "trans" nonces like Ian Huntley for example always experienced gender dysphoria their whole lives and never mentioned it until they were in their 40s or whatever ? Seriously? No sign of it in their childhood, no teachers or parents picking up on it?

Nah. Doesn't work that way. Where was the evidence that these men were little boys who hated their gender and wanted to be women?

because it's bullshit. That's why. Children with actual dysphoria feel profound distress .

We would be offended if someone fakes being blind to claim PIP. But it's ok to claim a mental illness they don't have ??

You’re not getting it / we don’t have a problem with appearance. Women can look like Dwayne Johnson, they’re still women.