I have moved out with eldest daughter due to the way my wife treats her.

[George805]

Hi, I am looking for some advice regarding my wife's treatment of eldest daughter.

Two daughters 8 and 6, eldest is a bit of an old soul, loves fossils, history, animals and cares deeply about the planet, she likes to wear t shirts with fossils and bugs on them with jeans and trainers, not interested in latest fashion or trends.

I love my wife but she can be a bit snobby and judgmental at times, she has to follow the latest trends and is in to everything glamorous, youngest daughter is the same, loves fashion, makeup (big no for me as she's too young) she is naturally very talented, does dance and can sing really well, I love both my children equally but I have to be truthful and say that I see a bit of a mean streak in youngest and I'm worried she is growing in to a bit of a bully.

Now the issue is that my wife massively favours youngest daughter, brings her everywhere, constantly buying her things, always calling her the most beautiful girl in the world (whilst eldest is standing right next to her), phone is full of pictures of just her, never stops speaking about her, always got to be right next to her on the sofa/dinner table etc etc

I've pulled her up on this so many times, told her she never spends time with eldest, never compliments her or shows even the slightest interest in what she's doing.

Had a horrible day at work today so stopped off in town on my way home to buy some snacks and treat the girls to a jellycat each, I bought eldest a caterpillar and youngest a bunny, when I arrived home and gave them to the girls my wife was instantly all over the youngest telling her how beautiful her bunny was just like her and didn't say anything about eldest. Eldest left and I went and spoke to her, she asked if I'd change her caterpillar for a bunny, I was shocked as I know for a fact she doesn't like the bunnies, she likes birds and bugs, what she said next floored me and made me feel like I've really failed her, she said mummy would like her the same way she likes her sister if she got a bunny, she got really upset and said she knows she's ugly and that's why eveyone likes youngest better.

I took both girls across the road to the neighbours and went back home and had the biggest argument with my wife we've ever had in 10 years of marriage, I'm not proud of it but I really lost my cool and accused my wife of neglecting eldest daughter and told her she's causing her to have body issues etc by the way she treats her, in the heat of the moment I packed a bag for myself and eldest and moved out.

But I've now had time to cool down and I realise I don't want to go back, I don't want my eldest to have to live everyday being compared to her sister and not feeling loved, living in her sisters shadow constantly having to hear how beautiful and amazing she is.

My wife has phoned over 20 times and left numerous texts and voicemails, I can't bring mysel to reply yet. I don't think it's good for eldest to be around her mother from now on until she can learn to treat them the same, I want eldest to live with me and youngest to spend half the time with me.

I know it's likely an unusual situation but would I stand a chance with this in court? I'm really worried about the way eldest is talking about herself and I think I'm going to need to get her some professional help, I obviously don't want her to never see her mum again, I just want her to have a brake from having to deal with her behaviour and for wife to slowly one on one build a relationship up with her without comparing her to youngest.

@George805 how is your daughter this morning? I hope you both managed to get some sleep.
Thank you for communicating with your wife that you were both safe, I imagine that was hard to do with the way you were feeling yesterday - and the messages you said she was sending.
I hope you can all work out the best steps for the family going forward.

I'd also be careful with youngest where clothes are concerned. The make-up i fully agree with no 6 year old should be made even for dance competitions, let alone in daily life.
Your youngest will take time to realise she doesn't need to be mummy's little clone.

Let her pick her cloths for when at yours, she may even have her own little style forming and if it's a pink top with an orange shirt and green tights even better 😅 just send her back to mums in the outfit she came to you in.

Good luck OP, it's not going to be an easy few months for you all - please remind your eldest this isn't her fault.
It's due to mummy and daddy growing and changing as people.

I was your eldest child, the geeky bug kid who swam in a different direction to the main shoal. I genuinely wish that I had had a parent like you, or any adult really.
For what it’s worth, I am cheering you on. You are protecting your eldest and attempting to kerb the taught habits of your youngest. I wish you much happiness in your future, although I expect you might get a rough time from the courts. You sound like a fabulous parent to me.

Don't be a dick ffs.

He took them across the road so he could speak to his wife in private, without the girls hearing, in case it got heated.

That's a very sensible decision.

I don’t think OP has said that he’s in Scotland, perhaps he could clarify?

OP I hope you got some good advice on this thread and well done for protecting your DD. Yours wife behaviour is appalling and she is mistreating your DD because she doesn't meet her expectations of a little girl which is madness and cruel.

I work with kids and have met kids who lived in a dynamic like this and it is incredibly damaging to all the kids not just the least favoured one. I understand your oldest DD is your top priority right now though.

First of all I suggest you put together a diary of what happened, dates, times and past events you remember where your DD was treated badly. Secondly you contact a family solicitor asap and get a residency order in place for your DD (or whatever they call it in your area) . Ask for joint custody of your other DD. Once this is done this look into family contact centres. This is where contact can be facilitated in a safe environment for your DD with her mum. Courts will want to see you see willing to facilitate a relationship between your DD and her mum if it's Safe and healthy for her. Will she be staying at the same school? If so tell them what's happened, ask for them to try get professional help in place and put in writing that her mum does not authority to collect her. However until you get residency (if applicable because that depends were you are in the UK) she can potentially collect her so site you have safeguarding and welfare concerns for your eldest DD around her mum and why.

Secondly you need to protect your other DD here to and the relationship you have with her. Her mum may well become far more over bearing and controlling especially if her interests start to change to something different to her mum's as she gets older. Get a 50/50 or even 60/40 custody arrangement in place with you having 60 percent custody. Your wife is not a safe parent for your second DD either. You may find what appears a close relationship now will you be up being a very controlling unhealthy relationship and your youngest DD is going to need you. She will be the sole focus of her mum now but without you to step in to try put boundaries in place so imagine how that is going to affect her.

Thirdly ignore the negative comments. You have every right to protect your DD and are doing the right thing. You do need to protect the sibling bond to if possible as it's neither of your girls fault what there mum has done and both are paying the price for it.

Your poor eldest daughter.

Your wife is committing child abuse. Leave her and take your eldest with you. Your wife sounds cruel and a bully. She will destroy your daughter’s self esteem.

While fresh in your mind write down as many bullying instances as you can think of and include dates if you can. Find an excellent family law solicitor from a big London firm.

I cannot believe any parent would behave this way - but if they do, you must safeguard your child before her self esteem is ruined forever.

Just don’t let your daughter grow up blaming herself for the end of your marriage.

This!

I know OP is prioritising( rightly) the eldest child in crisis... But long term this would seem the best scenario unless the mother suddenly does a volte face re her behaviour.

How difficult for you. It’s great that you are advocating for your oldest here. I do think you’ve pressed the nuclear button though. In the long term bring separated from her mum and sister will be damaging for your daughter. She will likely blame herself. I would look into family therapy urgently. Maybe you could separate but share custody of the girls?

Well done for advocating for your daughter. A brave move.

I have two bits of advice.

One is that your eldest is likely to think that this separation is her fault. So you need to find a way of her understanding that there are certain behaviours that are unacceptable. At the moment her child brain will make the connection between getting upset and the family being torn apart. So I think that needs to be sorted.

Two is that your wife sounds like she might have a narcissistic personality style and if she does you need to learn about it quickly. Dr Ramani on You Tube is a good start.

What an amazing dad you are! Very rare to see these days! As others have said, try family counseling? Give your wife a second chance, there is still time for everyone to learn and grow from this. It would be a shame to breakup a family without giving it another go.

Excellent post.
I think you've handled this the right way so far and if your 6 year old was extending the abuse of your wife towards your eldest, it's right for them to be separated for now.
Those who say they should be together weren't being bullied by a sibling.

I'd get done legal advice and also document the instances of abuse.
It's awful your wife didn't even ask to speak wight your eldest.

I don’t think he has specified whereabouts in the UK he is- I understand that mumsnet is a UK wide site (as well as international) so it is entirely inappropriate to write off an entire legal system and advice on the basis that the terminology used is not ‘English’ (albeit with the legal principles behind the terminology being pretty much exactly the same).

Yes I agree with a previous poster about counselling/ therapy. I think your wife needs help regardless. If she cannot see the effect her behaviour is having on her child, and also not even caring!

You are doing the right thing in advocating for your daughter. She is a child and with you by her side she will be okay I’m sure. Nobody has a manual on how to navigate what life throws at us but you are trying your best and that’s what counts.

I think your whole family needs a reset. It’s not healthy obsessing over one child and being obsessed with materialistic things. Your 6 year old also may feel she has to behave in a certain way to maintain her mother’s attention.

Good Luck you are doing the right thing. But definitely professional help is required.

Good luck 👍. Your wife sounds dreadful, and it’s having a knock on effect with the youngest as well.

Just keep your eldest safe and happy with lots of reassurance for now.

The rest can be sorted out when everyone’s had some breathing space.

Please can we stop diagnosing third hand strangers on the internet and backing it up with Youtube videos.

I think some counselling for everyone would be a good idea. School may be able to help provide some for your daughters.

I also forgot to add that you need to keep all texts, what's up, emails etc between yourself and your wife as a solicitor may need them for a court case.

I know someone has said above they think this is the nuclear option. It's not the damage is being done to your dda already. Unfortunately your wife's parent is already nuclear so you are just having to protect you dds.

I know your oldest is uoit priority right now and she needs to be but please don't underestimate the damage your wife is doing to your youngest either.

Sounds like your wife only wanted stereotypical girly girls, the first didn’t fit her requirements and the second did. Your poor eldest daughter.

i feel some of the comments on here would be very different if this was a mum talking about her son who liked pink and dad hated it…

well done OP. I just want to cry for your daughter… but she had you. She had you to stick up for her.

I would ignore the overly critical posts @George805 men can do no right on mumsnet and some posters will do some impressive mental acrobatics to absolve women of ANY blame in any given situation.

You sound like an excellent dad who has done the right thing. Your wife sounds utterly horrific, based on what you've said here I hope you get custody of both.

I feel terrible for your eldest, I wasnt the favourite growing up (nothing on the level your poor dd is subjected to) and it has really affected me my whole life. Are your parents a positive influence? As in do they indulge her hobbies and interests? Right now she needs reinforcement that who she is, is awesome and exactly what she is supposed to be.

I do think it would be useful over the coming days to get some 1-1with the youngest. At 6 you should be able to course correct her concerning behaviour.

Good luck and I hope your eldest is ok today.

@George805 I am just tagging you on this post because I think it is really good advice and I didn't want you to miss it. Pull in all the professional support you can to ensure you are getting the best advice on how to manage the situation in the best interest of both your children. Best of luck

Coming from a different POV: you were my dad. My dad did this for me. He did what you did. I was the black sheep, the eldest sister. I was constantly compared, bullied, ostracised in my home. It was a miserable place.

I cannot thank my dad enough for what he did. I am now very low contact with my mum.

I don't have time to go into everything now, but thank you for advocating for your little girl. I'll come back later and go into more detail, but you've absolutely done the right thing. (I have a wonderful relationship with my sibs now)

Does your wife know where you’ve taken her/ your daughter?

I think you have taken a good step in supporting your children. I would though ensure that your youngest has freedom to wear what she wants to wear too. I don't think that you should be applying make up to her but if she wants to have nail polish or put some make up on herself (from a limited amount) then give her that freedom. Not because I think it is appropriate on young children (I personally never wear make up) but because that is how she has been programmed to think and behave. If you go too far in the other direction she will just want to be with her mother where she gets all of those things. I think you want to gently lead her to the place where she sees that they both have agency over how they dress and that neither is better than the other. If you can afford it then let her pick out some new clothes in the shop to keep at your parents house, a mixture of practical clothes and more dressy clothes. Trying to do some fun activities together may also help them to get on better. Ultimately though sometimes siblings do not get on with each other so don't feel you must make them.

The youngest is also being emotionally abused by your wife. She needs rescuing as much as your eldest daughter.