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The US ultra-right should leave the UK alone!!!

452 replies

StandFirm · 14/04/2025 10:59

I was going to use a rude expletive in the thread title to truly reflect my thoughts on this. I've known about this insidious creeping influence for a little while but reading the article in the link below has made me livid. We are not going to be censored by foreign actors who understand nothing about our culture. I have often observed a false sense of familiarity among Brits regarding American culture but it goes both ways, and this attempt at dragging us along into the dark pit of ignorance should stay the fuck away from here:

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2025/apr/14/librarians-in-uk-increasingly-asked-to-remove-books-as-influence-of-us-pressure-groups-spreads

Librarians in UK increasingly asked to remove books, as influence of US pressure groups spreads

Anecdotal evidence suggests a rise in requests to take books off shelves, particularly LGBTQ+ titles

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2025/apr/14/librarians-in-uk-increasingly-asked-to-remove-books-as-influence-of-us-pressure-groups-spreads

OP posts:
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12
lifeturnsonadime · 15/04/2025 13:17

@TheWombatleague
You are missing the point.

Women shouldn't have to choose between one shit option for them or another shit option for them for different reasons.

Time for the Democrats to recognise this and listen to women on this issue.

Rhaidimiddim · 15/04/2025 13:18

However many they are, they will be single sex.

TempestTost · 15/04/2025 13:18

GrammarTeacher · 15/04/2025 08:29

It doesn’t celebrate it!
Should we stop teaching Romeo and Juliet because it ‘celebrates’ teen suicide?
Books don’t make people do things. Although some use them as an excuse. If people were influenced by what they read the UK would be a very different place given how many students are taught An Inspector Calls!

If we are taking a "message" from Romeo and Juliet, which is literature, surely it would be anti-suicide.

That is quite different from a book that is non-fiction and purports to be factual, telling young people that if they are unhappy with their sexed body something is wrong with it and dangerous medical interventions are the solution.

No one would accept a similar sort of book about bulimia or anorexia in the youth section.

Now - it's clearly true that there is a significantly divided opinion in the public about the medical truth of gender ideology, and I would say it's a very tricky one from the POV of a library collection. It would, in my opinion, be clearly wrong for a public library to restrict adult books taking either side on that debate.

It's trickier with young people however because of the safeguarding question - and by tricky, I mean that there is going to have to be an attempt to balance some really opposed elements.

But it's nothing like Romeo and Juliet or any other book that simply talks about a suicide.

TempestTost · 15/04/2025 13:31

PollyHutchen · 15/04/2025 09:23

This is the key passage from CILIP's Managing Safe and Inclusive Public Library Services'

"There is a key role for librarians and library staff in educating parents about the need to ensure that their children are exposed to a broad and inclusive range of stock. Librarians may wish to run sessions or provide information for parents about stock selection and the importance of an inclusive reading culture for their children and the school community. Librarians may also explain to parents the work that is done to equip young learners with the critical literacy and skills to approach difficult texts critically and with good judgement, to better understand the issues that they address."

There is a strong suggestion that backward bigoted parents need educating by enlightened library staff.

And I really am not sure what work is being done to 'equip young learners with... critical literacy'. Library staff don't have time. It is unlikely that teachers, who are busy with phonics, targets, paperwork etc have time. Nor should even the most caring parent be presenting a child with ideas about the subtext of Grandpa's Pride. 'Now Lucinda, this man is wearing fetish gear? What is fetish gear? Well let's Google and look at some more pictures?'

I find that kind of stuff so frustrating.

There is some truth there, yes, it's reasonable for libraries to say to parents, "yes, there are some things we have that might not be what you approve of for your kids. We will carry Harry Potter even if you don't like that it contains magic, you don't have to allow your kids to read it."

That was at one time the approach, parents have the final say on what is appropriate for their kids. Not just in terms of values, but also, what is too advanced, what is too scary, etc. After all, they know their children best.

This seems to have shifted to an approach which thinks that parents ought to let their kids read anything, no boundaries at all.

Essentially, there seems to be a lack of understanding that children are not just small adults, and their needs are not the same, even in terms of reading materials.

BundleBoogie · 15/04/2025 13:32

PlanetVulcan · 15/04/2025 06:52

This ^

I'm a left wing atheist and women's and children's rights campaigner and have asked for schools to remove particular books from their school libraries... These books contain graphic descriptions of sexual activity that can be accessed by children as young as 11. Sadly they are targeting LGBTQ+ children because it's easier to shoehorn explicit content in and then claim that evil nasty homophobic bigots are trying to ban books.

Certain men have always tried to tag along with gay rights campaigning To try and legitimise their "minor attracted persons" "identity", it's always been insidious and damaging to gay rights and mostly to children for obvious reasons.

Thank you for these sensible posts (yours and the one you’re responding to).

Sadly, people seem to have a knee jerk reaction to what they seem the hard right, or now - the ‘ultra right’ but what do they mean?

The force teaming of trans ideology with gay rights has enabled the extremists of the Democrats (and on the ‘left’ in this country if we want to make it political) to pretend this is all about homophobia and therefore ‘far right’ but in reality, as you say, it is ordinary parents pushing back at the deliberate attempt to indoctrinate children into harmful trans ideology.

Similarly inappropriate books are also being pushed in this country and Stonewall stated their aim to access children as young as 2 and tell them that some people are born in the wrong body and if you like pink and sparkly things the likelihood is that you are really a girl regardless of your actual sex.

If the activists weren’t pushing hard to expose children to sexualised and body harming material I doubt there would be any attempts to remove books from libraries but they are so here we are.

TempestTost · 15/04/2025 13:44

Rhaidimiddim · 15/04/2025 13:09

All of what you say.

With the addition that the Democrats insulted their voter base by asking them to vote for a guy so patently geriatric that I'd be worried about his ability to handle a trip to the supermarket and back. And only withdrew him as their candidate when called out on it by George Clooney.

And a lot of voters thought that Harris was complicit in covering up Biden's issues. (And in fact the information that has come out since indicates that she, and the whole Democrat apparatus including people like Obama, were entirely aware and deliberately tried to cover it up. So those voters were correct in that assessment.)

Maybe not so strange that they didn't trust Harris and her team, when it came time to vote, then.

TooBigForMyBoots · 15/04/2025 13:51

lifeturnsonadime · 15/04/2025 08:13

I'm not trawling posts nor am I lying.

You come on to loads of threads calling women who want to return to single sex or to protect single sex spaces 'Trumpist' or right wing and the like.

If you don't *favour the wishes of males who identify as transwomen' why do you spend so much time berating women who are trying to ensure women have single sex spaces? That's quite an odd thing to do if you agree with those women than women's single sex spaces are more important than the wishes of males who identify as trans.

Would you support the revocation of the GRC (given that it's primary purpose is now irrelevant) and/ or support clarifications to the Equality Act to return to single sex (excluding legal sex) in respect of women's single sex spaces including changing rooms, sport and public toilets? If not why not?

I'm fine with revocation of the GRA.🤷‍♀️

GrammarTeacher · 15/04/2025 13:55

TempestTost · 15/04/2025 13:44

And a lot of voters thought that Harris was complicit in covering up Biden's issues. (And in fact the information that has come out since indicates that she, and the whole Democrat apparatus including people like Obama, were entirely aware and deliberately tried to cover it up. So those voters were correct in that assessment.)

Maybe not so strange that they didn't trust Harris and her team, when it came time to vote, then.

Edited

Yup. The biggest contribution to Trump’s win was Democrats just not voting. Coupled with the weird electoral college system.

However, to get back to the point of the OP, I’m hugely concerned. The US (e.g. Vance) supporting the ‘right’ of people claiming to be Christian to harass women attending clinics under the guise of free speech (They were only praying/protesting). We do not have unlimited free speech in the UK and we would not/do not tolerate groups like the Westboro Baptist Church protesting at the funeral of soldiers.

There are some hugely concerning things going on across the Atlantic. I’d quite like those things to stay over there (or preferably stop!).

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 15/04/2025 14:18

TheWombatleague · 15/04/2025 13:10

None. But if I had to choose between either maga and all that comes with it and limited trans rights (and they were limited in a majority of states even under Biden) under the Democratics it's a no-brainer.

Do you think they'll be more or less single sex spaces for women after this administration than there were before?

In what sense were trans rights limited before? Male born trans people were able to compete in women's sports and be housed in women's prisons. What did they not have the right to do under Biden?

Obviously there will be more single sex spaces for women after this administration because the Trump administration has taken steps to enforce the single sex nature of spaces that were previously being used by members of the wrong sex.

TheWombatleague · 15/04/2025 15:21

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 15/04/2025 14:18

In what sense were trans rights limited before? Male born trans people were able to compete in women's sports and be housed in women's prisons. What did they not have the right to do under Biden?

Obviously there will be more single sex spaces for women after this administration because the Trump administration has taken steps to enforce the single sex nature of spaces that were previously being used by members of the wrong sex.

Obviously? I don't think you're counting things like the closure of planned parenthood & reproductive health clinics.

What we will have is more spaces for men, at the top. For example; Firing National Labor Relations Board (NLRB) Board Member Gwynne Wilcox and General Counsel Jennifer Abruzzo, firing Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) Commissioners Jocelyn Samuels and Charlotte Burrows, as well as General Counsel Karla Gilbride, firing Vice Admiral Shoshana Chatfield the only woman on NATO's military committee and the third top female officer to be fired since Trump took office.

The list is endless.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 15/04/2025 15:41

TheWombatleague · 15/04/2025 15:21

Obviously? I don't think you're counting things like the closure of planned parenthood & reproductive health clinics.

What we will have is more spaces for men, at the top. For example; Firing National Labor Relations Board (NLRB) Board Member Gwynne Wilcox and General Counsel Jennifer Abruzzo, firing Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) Commissioners Jocelyn Samuels and Charlotte Burrows, as well as General Counsel Karla Gilbride, firing Vice Admiral Shoshana Chatfield the only woman on NATO's military committee and the third top female officer to be fired since Trump took office.

The list is endless.

You are talking about something completely different to single sex spaces.

Abhannmor · 15/04/2025 16:19

saltinesandcoffeecups · 15/04/2025 00:13

So I read the article… it seems a bit light in evidence that the US is meddling. Did I miss it or was there something pointing to US involvement?

No..it's a lot of waffle and piffle. Some pupils tore up LGBT posters somewhere. A few people have questions about the suitability of a couple of books in primary schools. Talk about Phil Space.

TheWombatleague · 15/04/2025 17:20

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 15/04/2025 15:41

You are talking about something completely different to single sex spaces.

Two part answer. You don't think health clinics for women are single sex spaces?

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 15/04/2025 17:28

TheWombatleague · 15/04/2025 17:20

Two part answer. You don't think health clinics for women are single sex spaces?

Not in the same way, no.

When we talk about single sex spaces in the context of trans issues, we are referring to spaces which exist separately for both sexes.

A trans woman doesn't need to use women's toilets because there are also toilets for men.

A trans woman doesn't need to be housed in a women's prison because there are also prisons for men.

A trans woman doesn't need to compete in women's sports because there are also sporting categories for men.

A trans woman doesn't need to access an abortion clinic because men cannot get pregnant and so there is no such thing as an abortion clinic for men.

hopeishere · 15/04/2025 17:29

It’s always been here (lots of extreme religious views in Northern Ireland! Some of our politicians don’t believe in evolution!) but there’s no doubt they feel more able to push their views. Social media has given everyone a platform where they are utterly convinced they are right!

JustSawJohnny · 15/04/2025 19:16

Hard agree.

The out and out LIES some of them spout about our country is so embarrassing.

Tw@ts like Farage, Hopkins, Robinson and Truss are out their fanning the flames of hatred and misinformation.

They make me sick.

FrippEnos · 15/04/2025 19:19

GrammarTeacher · 15/04/2025 11:35

You have been sharing spaces with trans women for decades. It’s only become ‘an issue’ recently. I do wonder why that is.

Because the definition of what it is to be trans has changed.
It used to be someone who has gender dysphoria,
who went through years of therapy and had to prove that was what their condition was.

Now its anyone that says that they are a woman.

BundleBoogie · 15/04/2025 19:24

JustSawJohnny · 15/04/2025 19:16

Hard agree.

The out and out LIES some of them spout about our country is so embarrassing.

Tw@ts like Farage, Hopkins, Robinson and Truss are out their fanning the flames of hatred and misinformation.

They make me sick.

Can you specific exactly what these ‘flames of hatred and misinformation’ are?

This thread is high on hyperbole but light on facts.

FrippEnos · 15/04/2025 19:24

TheWombatleague · 15/04/2025 00:16

I don't. I think a majority are simply transphobic. I think the issue has been pushed by the ultra-right, particularly but not exclusively in the US, to get women to vote for them. Which is how we end up with women voting for a proven misogynistic sex offender as President of a government that's removing women from senior positions and from history.

www.cbsnews.com/news/shoshana-chatfield-admiral-to-nato-fired-senior-military-officers-ousted/

First they came for the trans, then the gays, then the blacks & women.

At least they didn't need to come for the lesbians, because the Left has already decided that if they don't want to sleep with trans women they must be sexual Nazis.
So there is a certain irony to your paraphrasing..

TheWombatleague · 15/04/2025 20:19

FrippEnos · 15/04/2025 19:24

At least they didn't need to come for the lesbians, because the Left has already decided that if they don't want to sleep with trans women they must be sexual Nazis.
So there is a certain irony to your paraphrasing..

The left, 😂

FrippEnos · 15/04/2025 21:20

TheWombatleague · 15/04/2025 20:19

The left, 😂

So no rebuttal
or are you going for #nodebate?

JustSawJohnny · 15/04/2025 22:20

BundleBoogie · 15/04/2025 19:24

Can you specific exactly what these ‘flames of hatred and misinformation’ are?

This thread is high on hyperbole but light on facts.

Happy to give examples, although I don't believe for a second that you're unaware of any as it is so rife - mostly that knob Musk via twitter, retweeting absolute bullshit from UK right wing loons or referencing such in speeches, see also Trump for the same, then that loon Marjorie Taylor Greene refusing to answer questions from UK press because 'we have a problem with immigrants raping our women' - all in the last month or so.

Claiming this doesn't happen is nothing short of disingenuous.

Also, if you want hyperbole, you can count on the extreme right!

SensibleJaneAndrews · 15/04/2025 22:40

StandFirm · 15/04/2025 08:42

Whatever the excesses of the hard left, bigots of any kind should not be given the time of day. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Saying men can’t be women is not bigotry. It’s literal, scientific fact.

SinnerBoy · 16/04/2025 00:07

GrammarTeacher ·

Yup. The biggest contribution to Trump’s win was Democrats just not voting. Coupled with the weird electoral college system.

I agree, the Democrats infuriated many of their regular voters, as well as people who would normally have tended towards them, but simply felt that they couldn't that time.

They mostly didn't turn to Trump, they just didn't vote, as shown by the count. Millions stayed home, but the Democrats still don't get it, even though polls show that 69% of registered Democratic voters opposed their stance on trans issues.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 16/04/2025 06:18

JustSawJohnny · 15/04/2025 22:20

Happy to give examples, although I don't believe for a second that you're unaware of any as it is so rife - mostly that knob Musk via twitter, retweeting absolute bullshit from UK right wing loons or referencing such in speeches, see also Trump for the same, then that loon Marjorie Taylor Greene refusing to answer questions from UK press because 'we have a problem with immigrants raping our women' - all in the last month or so.

Claiming this doesn't happen is nothing short of disingenuous.

Also, if you want hyperbole, you can count on the extreme right!

I don't have Twitter or know who Marjorie Taylor Greene is.

Most people I know don't have Twitter, as far as I'm aware.