The US ultra-right should leave the UK alone!!!

[StandFirm]

I was going to use a rude expletive in the thread title to truly reflect my thoughts on this. I've known about this insidious creeping influence for a little while but reading the article in the link below has made me livid. We are not going to be censored by foreign actors who understand nothing about our culture. I have often observed a false sense of familiarity among Brits regarding American culture but it goes both ways, and this attempt at dragging us along into the dark pit of ignorance should stay the fuck away from here:

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2025/apr/14/librarians-in-uk-increasingly-asked-to-remove-books-as-influence-of-us-pressure-groups-spreads

Of course this is a political thread! About the influence of some right-wing groups from the US trying to replicate here what they've been doing there. I think that is wrong and that people should understand what it means if left unchecked. I am talking about it because it's a topic that I'm familiar with.
As I have pointed out, we are all allowed to make our opinions known. Brits on the US and Americans on the UK. This is a public forum where people can voice their views. As a Brit regularly travelling to the US and affected by what is going on there on various levels, I feel entitled to voicing my views - not least when I see those social and political trends start to influence my own country!

I doubt it. 26 Individual states were already ignoring Biden's change to title IX along with loads of lawsuits challenging the inclusion of trans rights in its interpretation.

It seems pretty stupid to give up your reproductive rights, right to equal pay, and protections against discrimination etc for inclusive bathroom policies that "weren’t related to the number or frequency of criminal incidents in bathrooms or locker rooms, and that privacy and safety violations in those spaces “are exceedingly rare.”

link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s13178-018-0335-z

They were never going to win over the racists and misogynists with Harris anyway.

I call Trumpists, Trumists. That's true and you could find loads of posts where I do so. What you won't find is any sort of support for men in women's spaces from me.

The problem is your tribal politics has narrowed your mind and comprehension to the point where you think if any one criticises the RW or Trump, they must believe men should be able to access women's spaces and that's not true. You have never seen me post support for that shit. So you're either mistaken or lying.

I just wonder how many incidents of harm to women and girls in single sex spaces matter is enough to make you want to protect women Wombat? Do you have a number in mind?

Wrt reproductive rights, this is another carrot that the Democrats dangled over elections . Wasn't it Obama who failed to deliver his election promise to codify Roe v Wade? If he'd kept it then Trump wouldn't have been able to stack the Supreme Court with the aim over overturning Roe v Wade. It was completely foreseeable and Obama failed women by missing that opportunity whether you like to accept that or not.

The only women's rights that the Democrats appear to be interested in are the ones that also benefit males. Be it so called 'trans inclusion' / destruction of women's single sex spaces, sex work and reproductive rights. Funny that.

I see. I think that's not a bad test for where there is likely to be most harm from harmful speech. I'm still very wary of government controls on harmful speech (as in, I'm not a free speech absolutist, so I do support some regulation, but I see how easily regulation of harmful speech can become curtailing of politically inconvenient or unfashionable speech, and I think the harm of that from government action greatly outweighs the harm of most types of individual allegedly harmful, or even actually harmful, speech acts).

And even for the speech controls I support, I would describe those as limiting free speech. I think it's important to have clear terms, or we can't talk about trade-offs properly. I'd strongly limit gun rights, for example, and I think it's more helpful to say that than to say there is no infringement on gun rights provided there is still some set of circumstances where they are permitted short of absolute ban.

This is the key passage from CILIP's Managing Safe and Inclusive Public Library Services'

"There is a key role for librarians and library staff in educating parents about the need to ensure that their children are exposed to a broad and inclusive range of stock. Librarians may wish to run sessions or provide information for parents about stock selection and the importance of an inclusive reading culture for their children and the school community. Librarians may also explain to parents the work that is done to equip young learners with the critical literacy and skills to approach difficult texts critically and with good judgement, to better understand the issues that they address."

There is a strong suggestion that backward bigoted parents need educating by enlightened library staff.

And I really am not sure what work is being done to 'equip young learners with... critical literacy'. Library staff don't have time. It is unlikely that teachers, who are busy with phonics, targets, paperwork etc have time. Nor should even the most caring parent be presenting a child with ideas about the subtext of Grandpa's Pride. 'Now Lucinda, this man is wearing fetish gear? What is fetish gear? Well let's Google and look at some more pictures?'

I can't 'select' posts or posters. The thread takes on a life of its own. That's the nature of a discussion forum.
If you imply that my comments are off-topic then I disagree. The context in which those pressure groups are allowed to thrive in the States and now seemingly getting a foothold in the UK is very much tied to the religious ultra-right that supported Trump. I am not sure how they feel about Musk to be fair, but it's a proven fact that they see Trump as doing God's work. They have an agenda. That is my point.
Edited to add: nowhere have I been 'screaming' about anything. That is such a disrespectful way to qualify my comments. I have called some political trends toxic because that is how I view them, because they undermine values and institutions I hold dear. I have not castigated librarians at any point. It has become sadly a tricky job in some parts of the US and I am disappointed to see that it's getting trickier here as well.

So you won't clarify what you do believe then. Interesting.

You can't possibly know that.

"Kamala is for they/them; Trump is for YOU" was inspired.

This has been happening for years. These groups were all over the Irish referendum on abortion and that was back in 2018. I would imagine they have grown in strength got more organised and are now better funded too

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/05/23/europe/ireland-abortion-referendum-american-campaigners-intl/index.html

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ireland-abortion-referendum-foreign-influence-groups-on-social-media/

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/may/12/ireland-abortion-campaign-foreign-influence-facebook

jewelcase · Today 08:36

OK, we'd better ban Facebook and Reddit, too. They seem to be as bad as, or worse than Twatter.

Yes, I know. It didn't stop women voting for Trump though and watching the bonfire of cuts to research, education & funding for women's reproductive health.

I hear your point and PPs as well. I still think it's a threat that should be highlighted before it's allowed to fester too much.

I really don't think it's a surprise to anyone that the right are a threat to women's rights. What came as a surprise to me is the dawning realisation that the left are as much of a threat to women's rights.

As an aside, I think people forget that many voters simply went for the guy who promised to make them wealthier on day one.

How about the UK hard left just leaving the US alone and let them get on with their chosen system? They voted a certain way -which is none of your business. Why the obsession with another culture’s choices?

I think "progressives" need to do some hard thinking about why women might have voted for Trump. (Or why progressive leaning voters might have failed to vote.)

You’re seriously deluded and obsessed. The last thing your typical MAGA voter in the middle of the US cares and even gives a moments thought about is trans issues. 🙄

You think "typical MAGA voters in the middle of the US" are what won the election for Trump?

Jeez.

One Alarming issue for me is the unexpected but not surprising meeting of minds of religious extremism from the US far right colluding with extreme religious ideologies of other faiths to push archaic thinking and agendas. Keep your gods out of schools and libraries please.

The US isn’t ready for a female president that was a big reason, the few women that did vote believed his lies and that they’d be better off financially.

Trans rights really didn’t win the election 😂( however much frothing MN wish they did).

Not one person has claimed they did.

’Screaming’ may have been a poor choice of words, I’ll accept that. It won’t let me edit now - and of course that would remove the evidence too < small entertaining example of censorship / editing in action>. As long as we agree it is a wider debate than just the luckless souls on the frontline taking the crap.

There are questions about the nature of ‘free speech’ , and what it means to whom when. There always have been. In Europe we have generally accepted that there are limits to be explored and negotiated. The US has always been vociferous in support - and I find I’m trying to choose words again, probably unsuccessfully as I’m not the best at this. Their level of free speech, I have always noticed, appears to support the freedom of men to do what they want. It was notable to me, in that regard, that Vance’s recent example was about a man imposing on a woman in an exclusion zone around abortion clinic. Not a good example to start criticising foreign ‘allies’ over: but exactly the kind of critique of ‘freedom’ I expected from the US, with no understanding of negotiation with other parties affected. Those exclusion zones are exactly the kind of compromise they can’t stand.

I despise the far right but it’s been in the UK and EU as long as it’s been in the USA. It’s disingenuous and historically inaccurate to suggest otherwise.

And yep, the most interesting comment I heard was on the radio - forget who - about politicians have neglected working people and they need to start, simply, making working lives easier. It’s about deprivation. An awful lot of the politics of our time is about the increasing deprivation working people are suffering. I came across something interesting the other day about the German context. https://www.bigissue.com/news/politics/germany-wealth-inequality-europe-broken-republik/

Why is it always the case that men take difficult economies out on women. Always.

(that was supposed to quote your 9.35 point. I don’t think it’s an aside. It is highly relevant.)