Partner shouted at his mum & I interfered

[Sarrainbow]

Hi everyone :) I'm feeling totally stuck and really need some advice from people who are not aware of the people or situation. AIBU?

I witnessed my partner shouting at his mum this weekend, reducing her to tears. He was expressing frustration at her spending some money for a house job which had been an absolutely disaster. I was sat there watching and it was getting heated.

I interjected and said "I think the conversation needs to be paused." My partner responded with "I am having a conversation with my mum, I don't want to end this conversation". I said "I think I better leave the room" and he said "Yes, I think you should". Frustrated back, I stood up and said "You're being unreasonable" before I left. Admittedly, I perhaps shouldn't have said that. But I didn't like seeing him shouting at his mum and his mum was crying. Now we're in a 5 day fight where he's waiting for me to apologise. He said I shouldn't have took sides with his mum.

He was sad that she hadn't asked him for help. He and his mum were fine after the conversation. They are a conflict-based family and arguing seems to be common in their house (but not between those two). I am from a non-conflict family with very calm parents.

When we got in the car, I said I was surprised by him shouting at his mum. It turned into an argument about me going against him in the car. This continued until we got back home. We couldn't come to an agreement, and then he ended up shouting at me, telling me I was in the wrong, that I needed to change my behaviours and that I shouldn't have told him he was unreasonable in front of his mum.

He asked me to leave and we've had space ever since. We are talking each day on the phone but we cannot come to a solution. I have apologised - but I've asked for him to acknowledge my boundary that shouting isn't acceptable in our relationship. He doesn't think shouting is a problem, and it's just men expressing themselves. He also said that angry people are the saddest people.

He said I escalated it by pushing his buttons and putting him in the dog house for shouting at his mum. He also said I didn't leave first when he wanted me to, so he ended up shouting.

Do I wave the white flag and just accept I was wrong and should have not taken sides? Have I been unreasonable?

Thank you in advance for any help.

If his family choose to communicate by anger and shouting then that is shit but you can agree to take a step back and acknowledge that is their way.
If he won't acknowledge that it it NOT the way you are willing to communicate about problems and accept that he needs to find other ways to express himself to you then I would end the relationship.
He's telling you he thinks it's fine to shout at you whenever he is angry and there isn't anything wrong with that.
I wouldn't accept that for myself and I would absolutely not have children with someone who thinks it's OK to shout at them.

Definitely one to walk away from! He will treat you like he treats his mother, in fact he’s gearing up for it.

Get rid asap OP

You're in for a hard life if you stay with this one. Stop being so nice put yourself first and get rid. All the understanding in the world won't change him.

He’s been brought up in a shouty argumentative conflict environment this is his normal

it wouldn’t be for me

He sounds like a controlling and abusive twat.

I have been in an abusive relationship before this, and he also said I pushed his buttons

Yes, all abusive people blame their victims for “causing” the abuse.

The simple fact is that when reasonable people have one of their buttons pushed / are triggered, they might cry or express upset with what was said or done, and then they take a deep breath or walk away for a few minutes to calm down and then come back and explain to their partner that what they just said or did was triggering for them and why.

When abusive people are triggered they start shouting, berating, intimidating, shaming, trying to control what their partner thinks or does, and in some cases get physical by throwing, punching or breaking things
or physically attacking the other person.

Nobody causes someone to react in a particular way. The reaction is all on the person doing the reaction.

He said that he wants us to be a team in front of others, and the fact I went against him was what has bothered him.

Presenting a united front is only workable when there is no abusive behaviour involved and/or both people have gotten themselves on the same page before the united front is presented.

In this situation he is just trying to control what you think/say and shut down your reasonable objections to unreasonable behaviour.

People who come from that kind of environment often don't understand the impact it has on others. It took a lot of therapy for my DH to understand and change behaviour like that.

He may want to look up what a team actually is.

Reducing someone to tears is not okay. Shouting at someone as a way to communicate is not okay. Telling you that men express themselves through shouting is absolutely bollocks. You questioning yourself over this is concerning - you said you had a history of abusive relationships - have you done the freedom programme?

Leave him.. never stay with a man who doesn't respect his mother

I can see my eldest in this situation soon

Vile man. He will shout at you like this before long. Dump him.

This man can not express his emotions without getting angry and shouting people down. If you stay with him you are accepting that he will behave this way and considers it acceptable behaviour. You won’t get your feelings considered on issues he feels he is right on. He will shout you down and then wait for your apology.

statistically this will get worse the more you commit to him. Imagine if you had children and he shouts at you if you express different opinions on parenting or he shouts at his children and believes that’s ok.

Walk away now.

I actually think you did the right thing, although I do understand him being annoyed that you interfered (I'd feel the same if I were you're DH) but you were just trying to duffuae the situation it sounds like so I think that was good. It would be hard seeing your MIL cry and not to say something and he's overreacting.

You don’t flare up his anger.
He is naturally an angry person.

My DH family is exactly the same.
His mother is used to it, sadly.

You like peace & want it at home.
I know how hard it is to live with.

I absolutely could not be with a man that shouted at his mum until she cried. That is absolutely disgusting.

After I'd been with my stbxh about a year I witnessed him do something similar. Like your dp, he grew up in a family where shouting was an accepted form of communication.Gaslighting and passive-aggressiveness were also the norm, even though I didn't have the words for them at the time.
I pulled him up on the incident and told him that he should be ashamed, that I would never accept him or our future children talking to me like that. He told me he had to, otherwise she never listened.

I was in love, we lived 800km from his family, and I came from a dysfunctional damily myself so I didn't see the red flags that kept popping up. Or rather, I did but I didn't recognise them for what they were, and (I see now) I didn't have the self-worth to realise that I didn't have to stay with him.

Fast forward ten years. The red bunting is now the size of the flags being paraded in an Olympic stadium at the opening ceremony. But we're married now and have two kids, and I'm working very part-time because he has a Big Job and someone has to take care of the home and family. I don't let him talk to me the way he spoke to his mum but in so many ways which I don't have time to go into it's clear that he doesn't see me as his equal. He says I contradict him all the time when I see it as preferring another choice/not sharing his view on something/ standing up for myself.

Fast forward another ten years. I am a shadow of my former self. I don't know who I am anymire and can't believe this is my life. There is a total breakdown in communication, we're basically housemates and so unhappy. The dynamics are like a latent fight between him unconsciously trying to recreate what he thinks of us normal, and I see as going back to the 1950s. Lots of other things going on, of course. But the communication style and his expectation that I would submit to him just because he's the man and I'm the woman is a huge part of it.

Five years and a better-late-than-never wake up call later and I'm out. It's been so bloody hard trying to rebuild my life and my self-esteem but I'm doing OK now.

If I'd had the self-worth I have now that l so desperately lacked lacked back then, and Mumsnet, I would have had a very, very different life.

Please do take on board that even if it looks like a pile-on, many of us are speaking from the vantage point of several decades of experience. And they probably, like me, wished someone had tried to help them see that they deserved so much more than this.

the fact that this has turned into a 5day argument sounds exhausting.what happens the next time you argue? This sounds awful. You aren’t compatible. Move on.

If you don't want to one day have grown up children who shout at their mum like that, don't ever have children with him.

Sadly this is probably how your life with be if you choose to stay with this man. Learn the lesson OP.

Shouting at someone until they cry is not a disagreement or an argument. It's abuse.

He abused his mother and then abused you.

It doesn't matter what "buttons are pressed". He is expressing dominance. He will escalate any disagreement until the other person backs down. It's shouting now, but if that stops working then what's next.

You mean he bullied her into doing what he wants and now he is happy.

I would really be concerned that this is how he would parent your children, and when you didn’t agree he would turn on you.

He said that he wants us to be a team in front of others,
He needs to be told that if he wants to be on your team he has to stop shouting as soon as something annoys him.

He has shown you what sort of man he is and has told you he has no intention of changing. Unless you are prepared to stoop to his level and accept that shit, you are incompatible.

Do you have kids with this bully? Either way - get out now!
He's full of it. Saying that's how they communicate as if it's ok but clearly his mum wasn't ok with it despite raising that pig of man all his life if she was in tears? Do you want to be that woman?
Of course not - be free and save yourself and your kids/future kids - imagine having this as a dad, ugh.

If you back down and move on as if nothing happened, you are essentially telling him that you are ok with him shouting at you and that you agree to back him up in ANY situation. He has not only showed you who he is but he as also told you directly. It is up to you now to choose whether you want this in your life. Agreeing to move on will mean you accept it even if you put conditions on it. He is who he is and he is not willing to change no matter what boundaries you think you will be putting. The biggest problem is he is not acknowledging that his behaviour is problematic. That alone should tell you enough.

Try to envision your future life with him…shouting at you, shouting at your kids (if you choose to have them), shouting in your old age. Demanding respect, demanding agreement with him.

Protect your peace and mental health and move on.

He sounds horrible. Do you really want to be in a relationship with a person who shouts and reacts in a temper about every disagreement? And possibly have children who then grow up in that environment?