To wonder if all those gleeful about PIP cuts are going to welcome people with serious mental health conditions as colleagues and employees?

[Somethingthecatdraggedin7]

Given the amount of ableisism I see on MN I think the likelihood of people welcoming people with serious mental health conditions into their workplace is pretty low.
And yes, these people will very likely now be forced to try to work even though their condition makes it impossible. We are not just talking about some lazy twenty year old who expects to sit at home gaming due to his “anxiety” as many people seem to believe is the case. It will be people with significant impairments to social functioning.
Even if they get support to apply for jobs, and even if they then get the position (doubtful) how accommodating will colleagues or customers be if the person seems a bit odd, or gets adjustments workmates deem unfair?
This is going to be a total shit show.

This. The intention is to support people who have additional costs due to their disability. An example would be needing to take a cab to get somewhere. It is not intended to be used for normal living expenses.
Other benifits are in place if you cannot work and need living expenses. The changes however do suggest that the pip assessment will be used to determine eligibility for the extra health top up on these benefits.

I think the answer is for better qualified pip assessors I very nearly didn't get pip as my main part of my application is based on a rare congenital condition. The pip assessor ignored everything my consultants said. Luckily I fought back and the 2nd person I spoke to understood didn't lie took into account what my drs said and awarded me high rate for both. This is what scares me the most its very dependant on who you get, I do think the mandatory recording will help

Jesus christ, ALL of them are unemployable? Why?

I have depression and do a highly stressful job, and I work with colleagues who have a history of severe mental illness.

Some people will need help to build up functional skills after a long period, but this doesn't make someone unemployable, it makes them in need of an understanding employer.

I don't really get people saying "take away my pip and i can't afford my car to get it to work"

Well you pay for the car out of your wages like other people do? There are literally 35 million cars on the road in the UK and they aren't all funded by pip. You might need to buy a second hand car on finance like many other people.

Its this constant approach of looking for barriers to work rather than seeking solutions, that annoys everyone else.

If you genuinely can't understand how assets are mobile then I suggest you think outside the box....

You tell me? They can either work or not. PIP not really relevant to that.

The quote you replied to wasn't referring to that. So what you were saying in your comment was that disabled people who now don't meet the threshold should just become self sufficient like the rest of us.

Why would I tell you? It's something you said I disagreed with, you need to justify it - not me.

Savings have to be made, I don't think they've been made in exactly the right place but I understand from threads on here why the current situation is unsustainable (we can keep talking about billionaires and tax avoiders until the cows come home but we know that's not going to happen so it's not a fair argument).

What I will say is that if there are threads on here after the changes are officially made complaining about colleagues having reasonable adjustments or high amounts of sick leave, we should be referring them back to these threads.

This is what confuses me as i use pip for hospital transport as my hospital is the otherside of the country, aids, a cleaner and private therapy. Then I use lcwra money for bills as I can only work part time so if I lost pip which in turn meant I lose lcwra. I don't know what I would do

...everyone else will end up on JSA or whatever they call it now.

This was in the post I was replying and referring too... go and check

I don't think they'll be paying disability benefits for any mental health conditions apart from severe, uncontrolled psychosis in the future. People's parents will have to support them if the young people are too anxious etc. to leave their bedrooms.

Yes, everyone else who doesn't meet the new threshold for severe disability...the poster is still talking about disabled people

That's certainly one possible outcome of Leadbeater's Assisted Dying Bill - yet another cost that can be cut (along with palliative care). Oh, brave new world!

I was served in a charity shop recently by a young man with learning difficulties - it took him quite a while to serve each customer and he got angry and frustrated and started yelling each time the card machine was slow. I was perfectly happy to wait - but it's made me think, that's all very well for volunteering, but would someone with those difficulties ever qualify for paid retail employment? Would people be frustrated by him?

Work and volunteering are good for people, but this often conflicts with a business's need to keep afloat and make money, and no amount of "well, we can't afford all those disability benefits" will make that reality go away.

Because an adapted car costs significantly more.

I've been ignoring MN for a while because of these somewhat gleeful posters but it's made me think about the jobs that those with learning disabilities and poor MH may take up.
I used to support a woman who was a fabulous Baker, her pies and cakes always looked incredible and she was more than able to cook how her grandmother had taught her, she could probably have made scones in her sleep.
But even though she could do these things and people used to ask why she wasn't working in a bakery, her hygiene even with support to bathe and wash was abysmal. Nobody ever accepted one of her bakes as beautiful as the looked because they'd have been full of snot and worse.
She'd happily have worked a bakery job but nothing would stop her from scratching her bumhole and carrying on working with food. Equally if something went wrong, say she set fire to her oven gloves again her capacity wouldn't have coped, she'd have simply burned to death and possibly others.
Just because she would have been able to do the job as a baker in itself, the basic hygiene required was never ever going to be something she understood. It's people who seem okay on the surface, like she was who will be forced into jobs that they're truly not able to do.

I have suffered with clinical depression for years and been hospitalised before! I take medication for it and will do forever! I find that work helps my mental health and my employer has never had any problems with my illness!

Well I'm referring to the ones claiming disability when not actually having a disability that prevents them supporting themselves.
As in the tired/sad/anxious/can't be bothered claimants.

And a PIP car is the most literal way a disabled person can use the benefit to support their independence, you need to be on upper rate to get it.

I'm not wholly against PIP reform but complaining against a car is just mean minded and short sighted; it doesn't help the person or society for them to be stuck at home without a vehicle.

There isn't as much choice for adapted cars on the open market. Things like being able to put your wheelchair in the back means a lot of cheap run around the non disabled would buy on a budget are no good and anything more specialist like hand controls is expensive option.

I know you mean just a completely ordinary car with no adaptions which probably some will be, but many aren't.

Ok, I'll have a go.

1. redistribution of wealth - healthy life expectancy varies greatly between socio-economic groups, level it. That's a fortune saved there in expenditure.

2. give councils 0% loans to build homes - reduce the cost of housing, boost the economy and raise revenue for councils over the lifetime of those houses.

3. universal basic income - alongside pip

4. restore the rights to Union's that have been lost over the last 40+ years and stop funding employers that pay poverty wages.

There are hundreds of ways we could address the issue.

As for the 'economically inactive', that includes students, the retired and the long term sick, all of which spend money in the economy.

Our GDP per capita is more than double that of Poland and significantly more than that of Spain yet Spain pays more than double our pension and has a lower cost of living and a retirement age of 65.

It's only an issue if you live in a country that has spent 40+ years enriching the wealthy via tax and privatisation of public assets at the expense of everyone else.

Even (some of) the billionaires are embarrassed by it.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-01-18/billionaires-call-on-global-leaders-to-tax-them-more/103363600

Yes now your in recovery absolutely but what about when you where in the depths of it and being hospitalised. Because according to people on here it's just depression so you should of just got on with it and you can't take time of to be hospitalised as then your colleagues have to step in to cover your shift and that's not fair on them

This is what worries me when people say "they can get a job in a care home, they're crying out for carers". Most people just don't have the ability to do this job and why should the vulnerable elderly be expected to be on the receiving end of someone who has been forced into such a role? What could possibly go wrong?! Sure, do the gardening or answer the phone, but care for an immobile, incontinent, in constant pain, at risk of aspirating palliative care resident? Um, probably not.

Just an FYI. Tax is payable on ESA, I receive a P60 every year.
I don’t think many people actually realise this.