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So, who is going to employ all these disabled people the government wants to wean of welfare

1000 replies

Jimisnotmyname · 18/03/2025 16:14

Really wondering. Not saying it is necessarily a bad thing to encourage those who can work, to work but as a carer for 2 disabled family members, I am hugely struggling to find another job as nobody is willing to give me any flexibility (which I need as a carer) and there are always candidates who do not need the same accomodations I do. I would imagine that many of those currently not in work because of disability or a health condition, will often need a similar level of flexibility. I just wonder who on the the government think will offer jobs galore on these circumstances??

OP posts:
WalkingonWheels · 18/03/2025 21:53

BrandonFlowersEyesWithEyeliner · 18/03/2025 21:27

I mean this kindly. There is no 'diagnosis' of fibromyalgia. It's a diagnosis of elimination. Meaning, once they've excluded all illnesses or diseases by tests, they'll call it 'fibromyalgia'. It's a syndrome not an illness if that makes sense.its synonymous with "we don't know what's causing this lady's symptoms"

It doesn't take away your pain and your symptoms. I don't refute your experience.

But there is no process happening within the body in fibromyalgia. It's a functional syndrome. I really don't think the medical profession are doing service to vulnerable patients by chucking a label at them in the hope of validating them so that they'll 'go away'.

That's funny. I have a letter right here dated 2011 that literally says the words,
"DIAGNOSIS - FIBROMYALGIA". It came from a rheumatologist who did extensive scans and tests over three years.

Icanthinkformyselfthanks · 18/03/2025 21:53

WasThatACorner · 18/03/2025 17:09

Are you sure it's our there?

There is a woman at our GP surgery whose job is to connect people with these things. I begged for this help. She was lovely but the help isn't there.

There was absolutely nothing that she could offer me. All she could do was ensure I was claiming the benefits that I am entitled to and signpost me to places that I could pay for these services.

@WasThatACorner , perhaps the social prescriber at your GP practice is rubbish. I don’t know where to suggest you look but hopefully someone will come along to help. Good luck!

Scutterbug · 18/03/2025 21:55

If they want people back in work, they need to sort MH services surely? That takes money and time. My MH journey and support is shocking.

Nadiaelgato · 18/03/2025 21:56

Thoughtsonstuff · 18/03/2025 21:34

It's just a matter of weeding out the malingerers as absolutely no one (I assume) would want those in genuine need to go without. But we all presumably remember the people at school who used to pretend they had something wrong with them..mainly to get out of games permanently or to get attention or to avoid doing something they didn't want to do. Some sort of disability..and presumably those people acted much the same as adults in the workplace (or avoiding the workplace). Whereas those who actually genuinely struggled with a genuine condition were always much quieter about it and more stoic and just tried to get through each day as best they could. Everyone at school knew who was who and who was real. I suppose no one can tell these days and so everyone gets lumped in the same pot which I assume must be bloody infuriating.

Stop lying to yourself. I qualify as "proper disabled" but will still lose out. You're doing down all disabled people. It's sickening. Be honest to me please. If you're going to kick me when I'm down, that's the least I deserve.

Icanthinkformyselfthanks · 18/03/2025 21:56

NeverDropYourMooncup · 18/03/2025 17:11

The 'little push' is the first bit that makes that unfeasible. The second bit is assuming a belt runs all the way down like they did in the 1980s, instead of ending before things are lifted onto the scale and then lifted and placed into the packing area.

That and a) they're too high to work from wheelchair user height and b) they've been replaced by self checkouts supervised by somebody standing up or people standing up and filling shelves, collecting Amazon packages, taking deliveries, supplying the blokes on bikes with orders packed and ready when not standing behind a security partition for the seven foot high cigarette counter with alcohol and parcels on the floor around them.

@NeverDropYourMooncup , this is absolutely ridiculous! Many fabulous people in wheelchairs have a multitude of jobs.

Thoughtsonstuff · 18/03/2025 21:56

WiddlinDiddlin · 18/03/2025 21:23

That is a lovely idea ... and I'm not saying there isn't some tiny bit of merit to it...

However 'disability' is almost never just one condition, one thing affected. It is usually a combination of things, plus side effects from medication, and then deterioration for a variety of reasons.

Two people with, on paper, the same disability may need very different accomodations and be capable/not capable of a differing range of tasks.

You can't just say 'oh someone with X condition can do this, someone with Y condition can do that'...

I see a lot of this over simplification of disability from people who are not disabled, but even people who are cannot really speak for anyone but themselves.

Also whoever it was who was discussing 'people in wheelchairs' - you realise that covers a HUGE range of disabilities and a huge range of wheelchairs with different sizes and functions. Somewhere wheelchair accessible for my best friend may well NOT be wheelchair accessible to me. We're both ambulatory wheelchair users, both rapidly becoming less ambulatory as conditions deteriorate, we use our wheelchairs about the same amount... but our capability for specific tasks is massively different, because we actually have very different disabilities. You really cannot determine who can do what by what mobility aid they use!

There must be something everyone can do to earn their way even a bit, no matter what. Surely. Even if it is proof reading a document on a phone. Sitting at home doing nothing productive for the rest of a life sounds like hell and an utter waste. I can't imagine many people want that for themselves unless they really cannot do anything at all. The thought of all those young people being classed as disabled due to mental issues brought about by covid restrictions or Adhd etc is utterly tragic.

Thoughtsonstuff · 18/03/2025 21:58

Nadiaelgato · 18/03/2025 21:56

Stop lying to yourself. I qualify as "proper disabled" but will still lose out. You're doing down all disabled people. It's sickening. Be honest to me please. If you're going to kick me when I'm down, that's the least I deserve.

I wouldn't take my comment personally. None of us on mumsnet know what's real or not about anyone that posts.

Scutterbug · 18/03/2025 21:59

Thoughtsonstuff · 18/03/2025 21:56

There must be something everyone can do to earn their way even a bit, no matter what. Surely. Even if it is proof reading a document on a phone. Sitting at home doing nothing productive for the rest of a life sounds like hell and an utter waste. I can't imagine many people want that for themselves unless they really cannot do anything at all. The thought of all those young people being classed as disabled due to mental issues brought about by covid restrictions or Adhd etc is utterly tragic.

Absolutely agree. I would love to work. It needs to be wfh, and deal with my frequent psychotic episodes. I can’t attend real life meetings or interviews as my anxiety is so bad I cannot leave the home. I self harm daily so may need time off for hospital visits. I’ve also had many inpatient stays of that is ok.
Hand me the job, I’ll take it.

BrandonFlowersEyesWithEyeliner · 18/03/2025 22:00

WalkingonWheels · 18/03/2025 21:53

That's funny. I have a letter right here dated 2011 that literally says the words,
"DIAGNOSIS - FIBROMYALGIA". It came from a rheumatologist who did extensive scans and tests over three years.

I don't dispute that. It still doesn't make it a diagnosable condition. It's applied once they've ruled OUT all other conditions.

It doesn't mean your pain and symptoms do not exist.

user1471556818 · 18/03/2025 22:01

Overtheatlantic · 18/03/2025 16:20

Care homes, local authorities and education institutions will offer more flexibility than regular corporate jobs.

So the most vulnerable people are ok to be left without care or deal with people who have their own struggles and difficulties to deal with .That's a ridiculous proposition.

Nadiaelgato · 18/03/2025 22:03

Thoughtsonstuff · 18/03/2025 21:56

There must be something everyone can do to earn their way even a bit, no matter what. Surely. Even if it is proof reading a document on a phone. Sitting at home doing nothing productive for the rest of a life sounds like hell and an utter waste. I can't imagine many people want that for themselves unless they really cannot do anything at all. The thought of all those young people being classed as disabled due to mental issues brought about by covid restrictions or Adhd etc is utterly tragic.

Yes, it's utterly awful being disabled. You understand that? It's really, really the worst option. There's a reason that the phrase "health is wealth" exists. I would swap virtually everything I have - probably not my family - to be well. It's truely shit. I do feel like I'm wasting my life, I agree. It makes me cry. Seeing people doing ordinary things like go to the shop, when I can't, is heartbreaking. But what can you do? I didn't chose to have a brain malformation. It's that one in a million chance.

Lourdes12 · 18/03/2025 22:03

MrsMurphyIWish · 18/03/2025 16:38

@WeylandYutani It must be a really scary time for you. If you don’t mind me asking me, what could help you get into the world of work?

I have the same issue. What would help for me is to not having to go through the interview process. Instead, being trained on a particular high focused job which requires minimal human interaction

WasThatACorner · 18/03/2025 22:03

Icanthinkformyselfthanks · 18/03/2025 21:53

@WasThatACorner , perhaps the social prescriber at your GP practice is rubbish. I don’t know where to suggest you look but hopefully someone will come along to help. Good luck!

The things that are available I was already doing. The things that I needed weren't available.

She really wasn't rubbish, I have a background in that area and I knew going in that I had tried everything that was available to me. I was desperate and went for help. She couldn't work magic.

Another suggestion was I pay for the services that I need and use food banks to feed my family.

The system is a mess before we even start to look at benefits.

DodoTired · 18/03/2025 22:04

LadyMary50 · 18/03/2025 17:12

Yep,got one in the family except she’s too shy to work.She’s now 42 and never had a job,she lived with her parents until she found an equally idle partner they now live with his mother.She got pip on MH grounds without any evidence on a phone interview.I’m hoping she has a face to face review at some point.I know people will now claim she couldn’t possibly have got pip with no evidence but she actually did,much to my horror.I always assumed you needed reems of medical notes but as this was just after covid lockdown a phone interview was all that was needed.Also lots of downright lies.

That explains explosion of these payments after Covid

Lourdes12 · 18/03/2025 22:05

WalkingonWheels · 18/03/2025 21:47

Fucking good for her. If my only disability was that I lopped both my legs off, I'd be able to do all that too.

I’m guessing she doesn’t have to deal with pain

Nadiaelgato · 18/03/2025 22:06

Thoughtsonstuff · 18/03/2025 21:58

I wouldn't take my comment personally. None of us on mumsnet know what's real or not about anyone that posts.

I know what's real about me. It sounds like you are just trying to justify an ableist comment.

Thoughtsonstuff · 18/03/2025 22:06

Scutterbug · 18/03/2025 21:59

Absolutely agree. I would love to work. It needs to be wfh, and deal with my frequent psychotic episodes. I can’t attend real life meetings or interviews as my anxiety is so bad I cannot leave the home. I self harm daily so may need time off for hospital visits. I’ve also had many inpatient stays of that is ok.
Hand me the job, I’ll take it.

Depending on what your skills and background you could look at something that you can do at home in your own time online. Exam marking is one thing and you can earn a fair bit. Proof reading. Data input. Plenty of jobs aren't client facing and now WFH is normal.

I'm sorry you are experiencing what you are and I wish you all the best.

Fryingpanfire · 18/03/2025 22:08

It's not about paying the disabled enough to live on though.
It's paying an "education provider" £40k - £70k a year plus taxi/transport costs for kids under 16 with ASD/ADHD who realistically won't even be helped enough to find jobs that pay money back into the system. Not saying that the children shouldn't have specialised support but if the private sector can do it why isn't the State?

All the young people I know who actually have been successful in supporting themselves or finding employment have started a business. Money would be better spent supporting this aim than giving them £1,000's they spend like water at College on clothes and snacks (inevitably they mostly go mainstream at post 16)

Its a brand new mobility car for claimants who are 16 who get higher level PiP and can't access public transport. Great but there's no onus to pay any back if it does benefit them into paid work. It's not even means tested. I know families that struggle but I many where parents are affluent.

Of course there are lots of exceptions but the amount spent doesn't justify the return - for the country or individual wellbeing.

Thoughtsonstuff · 18/03/2025 22:09

Nadiaelgato · 18/03/2025 22:03

Yes, it's utterly awful being disabled. You understand that? It's really, really the worst option. There's a reason that the phrase "health is wealth" exists. I would swap virtually everything I have - probably not my family - to be well. It's truely shit. I do feel like I'm wasting my life, I agree. It makes me cry. Seeing people doing ordinary things like go to the shop, when I can't, is heartbreaking. But what can you do? I didn't chose to have a brain malformation. It's that one in a million chance.

Edited

I feel very sorry that you are in this situation. Clearly not everyone is genuine though.

StMarie4me · 18/03/2025 22:09

My daughter has PTSD. ADHD, Depression, Anxiety, Chronic Fatigue Syndrome and Chronic Asthma. What kind of employer could make reasonable adjustments to accommodate all of this?

Foxesandsquirrels · 18/03/2025 22:10

WalkingonWheels · 18/03/2025 18:57

At my first PIP assessment I scored zero points. None. Nada.

This is despite reams of evidence, the LA moving me into adapted housing, my OT referrals to wheelchair services and adaptation departments at the LA and hospital, my employer's reports and their referrals to clinical psychology and OT. They came out to do the assessment and saw me unable to move, sit up, engage, etc.

They said I was fit and healthy and did not qualify for PIP.

It definitely applies to me.

That's disgraceful. I'm so sorry. I think the overhaul needs to be around assessors to be completely honest. My sister applied for DLA for her identical twins who both have the exact same disability, exact same paperwork, test results etc. One got higher rate and the other didn't qualify. We had to send their DNA results proving their identical as evidence and thankfully common sense prevailed but it just shows how inconsistent the assessments are.

EmeraldShamrock000 · 18/03/2025 22:10

There is no easy solution to the growing problem.
There is a huge increase in young people claiming anxiety related disability benefits that are keeping them restricted to a life of poverty, if the correct adjustments are made and anxiety diagnosis are dealt with early, many would have a better lifestyle than the circles of poverty, boredom, added depression.

WiddlinDiddlin · 18/03/2025 22:13

Thoughtsonstuff · 18/03/2025 21:56

There must be something everyone can do to earn their way even a bit, no matter what. Surely. Even if it is proof reading a document on a phone. Sitting at home doing nothing productive for the rest of a life sounds like hell and an utter waste. I can't imagine many people want that for themselves unless they really cannot do anything at all. The thought of all those young people being classed as disabled due to mental issues brought about by covid restrictions or Adhd etc is utterly tragic.

I really do hope you don't experience disabling chronic illness... honestly.

There are people (not me, I've found what I can do and do it) who really, really cannot do anything.

Literally existing is the best its going to get - people who still live in their own home or that of an aging parent, who don't quite qualify to live in some sort of home/facility, for whom it is all they can do to complete the basic tasks needed to not die - food intake, toilet, meds.

If you're lying in bed in pain, on heavy medication, no you can't proof read things on phones and, who is it who is employing proof readers who might well be fatigued or distracted - thats a job that requires some skill and a particular education level if not actual qualifications.

One of my freelance roles is illustration and art commissions, if I can't focus enough to do that I might do some original work in the hopes I can sell it via drop-ship sites (for a pittance but its passive income once I've done and uploaded it). There are days when between medication and pain (and Im not talking about the medication FOR the pain, thats an added extra) I can't even do that.

It's a lovely idea that 'everyone can do something' but the reality is, no, they can't. Lots of people can't.

This idea that only the lead swingers and malingerers will be affected is also a double edged sword, as well as naive at best.

It will mean that if you don't qualify for benefits, no one believes that you're actually unwell.

If we had a perfect health care system where missed DX didn't happen, where people didn't wait months or years to begin treatment let alone get a DX, then maybe... but we don't.

It took 2 and a half years of me constantly banging on to Drs that I was not anxious or depressed, I was not having panic attacks, I was not being lazy... I had heart failure, something was horribly wrong, my thyroid was fucked, please help me.

Two and half years later they finally agreed I was actually correct, I did not have 'fibro', I had Ehlers Danlos, I had heart failure, I had damage to my spine (lumbar and cervical) as a result of that, I was not having panic attacks at night I was not breathing properly, drowning in my own fluids, I was in significant pain from nerve damage, arthritic changes in damaged joints, my thyroid was indeed fucked as was the rest of me.

Those symptoms did not on the whole, arrive all at once, I had been suffering with them for YEARS before this, since childhood and early teens (the damage to the joints shows how long my body has been moving incorrectly and chewing itself up!). So yeah, genuinely unwell people fly under the radar despite asking for help, talking about their symptoms, trying to be the squeaky wheel.

It'd be nice if I were an unusual case but I am absolutely not.

But carry on believing that everyone can do something and only the lazy scroungers will be affected. If it makes you feel better. Most people will end up disabled if they live long enough!

BrandonFlowersEyesWithEyeliner · 18/03/2025 22:14

JustMovingUncomfortablySlow · 18/03/2025 21:41

To be fair, I can agree with some of the things you say.

When my doctor first started to mention Fibro, all of a sudden two of my social circle decided they have EXACTLY the same symptoms, one got a repeat prescription for codeine, one got the same meds that I was on (and admitted not taking them) - both applied for PIP (one got turned down). I've never seen either of them actually struggle, turn down a social activity or be anything less than perfectly groomed. A bit sickening when I have to ask my son to brush my hair for me. Yes, I know its an invisible disability but the timing, and the symptoms, made it very suspect.

So yes I can understand that Fibro is a condition which can be taken advantage of.

As I said, it took three years of testing - I was cleared for all the above as well as over/under active thyroid, diabetes, menopause etc etc. Recently been confirmed as Peri menopausal and it's making everything 10x worse unfortunately. Here's hoping the HRT helps.

Until they can come up with a definitive test or find out I have something the medical team haven't thought of yet, I'm stuck with a Fibro dx.

I apologise for "snapping" at you - I saw the words Wishy Washy and just saw red.

I do understand why you took my post offensively and truth be told - I actually felt awful for you when reading about how your daily life is with your pain and symptoms, I can hear it through your words that its a struggle.

My posts probably do come across as insensitive and I can see why someone like yourself who's living In pain may interpret that as me trying to say your pain and condition doesn't exist.

I really do believe you. I feel like 'fibromyalgia' is used as a way to stop all other investigations sometimes. Truthfully, I have seen people that were given a diagnosis of fibromyalgia - only to be seen 5 years later and be diagnosed with rheumatoid arthritis or similar and I can't help but wonder if they were experiencing the beginnings of rheumatoid arthritis without it being detectable at the time. I worry that people (women, let's face it) get given a label and then it impedes them from being tested at later dates.

Anyway, truth be told , it pricked my conscious when I read your replies. That actually, my opinion may be being misinterpreted and is coming across as offensive to people like yourself. It's not my intention I promise. But perhaps this isn't the place for it.

I'm genuinely sorry if I made you feel devalued by your diagnosis. I hope you find some solutions for your pain .

WalkingonWheels · 18/03/2025 22:14

Foxesandsquirrels · 18/03/2025 22:10

That's disgraceful. I'm so sorry. I think the overhaul needs to be around assessors to be completely honest. My sister applied for DLA for her identical twins who both have the exact same disability, exact same paperwork, test results etc. One got higher rate and the other didn't qualify. We had to send their DNA results proving their identical as evidence and thankfully common sense prevailed but it just shows how inconsistent the assessments are.

That just goes to show doesn't it, how terrible the assessments are?

I'm so glad I recorded mine. The lies they told in the report were so unbelievable, without evidence of wgar actually went on, I doubt it would have got anywhere. As is stands, I was able to take them to court for the lying, and I was awarded higher rate without having to go to tribunal.

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