To be gleeful that most of us were right

[Wranglestar]

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/news/adding-vat-to-private-school-fees-has-had-no-obvious-impact-on-state-sector-applications-390546/?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR2ATdaVlNkJsbtC-KizuW4Fw41obnpvezxnFv4IAFwzJPHXmU90Awr5eqAaem9tMIsn9I0vHSC4jrdYONIA#0rd9makyd4264nstc4us9j77yk5kaoswtLondon Economic

And that private schools has had no impact on state school places. The rich have simply - paid more. Excellent news!

Pretty much everyone agrees that the socialist democracy of post war England was among the fairest of global systems, with a range of policies that enhanced social mobility and massively improved social issues like child poverty, health and housing inequality, education inequity etc. But yes, let us kowtow to the finance sector whose imperitives have rolled all that back, just because we think our own children deserve more than other children. Great idea.

It’s pretty clear the poster has no idea how she is coming across. On another thread her posts have been called “spiteful” by someone who spends their time defending the VAT policy.

Its clear with her bitter and illogical ramblings that she’s doing more to undermine the pro-VAT side than any of us could….! 😆

“Pretty much everyone agrees that the socialist democracy of post war England was among the fairest of global systems, with a range of policies that enhanced social mobility and massively improved social issues like child poverty, health and housing inequality, education inequity etc. But yes, let us kowtow to the finance sector whose imperitives have rolled all that back, just because we think our own children deserve more than other children. Great idea.”

We have huge amount of sovereign debt that we have to service. We cannot afford vanity projects with no clear beneficial outcome and potential huge costs.

Fact of the matter is that the majority of children of immigrants, regardless of wealth or class, outperform white British kids from poorer backgrounds, simply because certain cultures, like the Chinese or Indians, have very strong educational values and push their kids at home and teach them discipline and learning from an early age. You can put these kids into any school and they do well, typically, as a group.
Your problem is not with private schools, it is with a cultural lack of educational values. You can tax and abolish private schools all you like, but it won’t improve that. It will just drive people who value Education and hard work who are doing well out of the country (which is a terrible idea into a falling birth rate) and discourage foreign direct investment, and devalue the pound further.

You need to look at equally poor households from different ethnic and cultural backgrounds and figure out why some kids outperform others so much. What is the magic ingredient. How do you fix that. How do you teach certain parents to promote good educational values at home from an early age.

Really reaching now, it’s taxing education and closing schools not introducing the NHS.

Great post, @Araminta1003.

Rubbish. The government-imposed tax is 20% and school need to pass it on. Schools have to pay wages and many have to upkeep very old buildings. Those costs haven’t vanished. Also, why would class sizes increase? More children leave, fewer children join so class sizes fall. It is exactly what the Labour Party wanted. They didn’t want children to stay.

As an aside, why on earth do you think ANYONE wants to pay more money for their child’s education when they are already paying twice? They are not exactly ‘hanging on to every penny’ when they are doing this, are they?

Schools don't need to pass on the full increase, by doing nothing, the increase should be 15%,

That’s the VAT figure. What about the business rate changes, NIC and living wage changes? Are schools supposed to fund those increased costs from thin air? For our school, that’s roughly another 5% on fees alone (school have given us the figures). So, that’s around a 20% increase before any other inflationary pressures (pay rises, energy costs etc).

I don’t know a single school who has passed on the full 20% in VAT alone. The 20% figure includes the business rates/NIC etc for every school I’ve seen.

We haven’t had 20%. We had 12% in January and will have 2.8% come September.

@Katbum Exactly, estimated, not definite. Some estimates say that it is going to end up costing the country money due to clawback of VAT, reduction in overseas students, some children moving from private to state.

There are currently 11 million children in state schools in UK, so even if it does make the figure you suggest (highly unlikely), and even it if is ring fenced for state schools (also highly unlikely) that will equate to an extra £35 pounds per child per year. How exactly will an extra 90p per school week magically make the system fairer, I wonder how my daughters school will spend the princely sum of 5k from their 150 students across the school. A quarter of a teaching assistant maybe? To make up for the equivalent of 5 teaching assistants which has already been slashed from their budget since Labour came to power. If it wasn't so sad it would be funny!

I was a higher rate tax payer so you're mistaken, again, with that particular assertion.

But of course the v wealthy always have no money, they hang on to every penny.

Once again, you mistakenly accuse me of wanting to restrict education, no, just pay the taxes levied, without the constant stream of moaning.

Many schools staggered the VAT increase, even putting fees up last year.... my brothers school increased them 5% in September, with a 14% rise this year.

Aside, as London has diminished as a world financial centre, so does its wealth and attractiveness to millionaires.
Which is exactly what unbiased experts are saying:

The decline has been attributed to tax rises under the Conservative and Labour governments, failure to recover from the 2008 recession, economic uncertainty following Brexit and the fall in the value of the pound

Taxing education will restrict education choice, it already has and will continue to close schools. It will price children out.

Obviously if you support education tax, you support restricting education choice. That is the aim of the policy. Education tax is unacceptable and will be continually challenged (or whined about) until it is reversed under the next Government.

It’s pointless to just keep saying people can afford any tax rise. At what point can’t people afford it ? 30%, 50% , 120% or is there simply no limit to what independent school parents can afford?

Thank you for the information about your previous tax status and London.

I am looking at the exchange rates. People are selling the dollar but buying Swiss Franc and Euro. Not the Pound. It is down since start of April, really low. Why is that? Because we are seen as politically unstable. On par with Trump clearly.
Until this country ditches dumb populist policies and restores political stability and financial markets we are essentially screwed. London is the powerhouse for tax take. If they do not expand the tech sector further and revamp the financial services sector and the link between the two, we are screwed. And the education tax and non dom massively link into that.

Clearly, you'd love all that to be true.

Ummmm we have political stability, we didn't under the Tories.... £ doing very well against the $

When is it going to sink into your mind that the UK has no money, taxation is the only way forward, so we either tax the less well off or the better off....

& thats all down to the Tories who spent 14 years dong a very good job of wrecking the UK, thats why we are where we are, not Trump not VAT.. but the Tories.

@Absolutely45 - no, incorrect, I would like the U.K. to do well. People are selling the dollar off because of political instability. If you look at the deterioration tonight of the pound to euro or pound to Swiss franc in just a few days, you will see what I mean.
We are not seen as a safe haven currency and that it worrying.
And VAT on education and the non dom changes are hardcore socialist policies holding us back. Without them, we would be in a better position right now.

@Araminta1003 excellent posts

You can afford mounjaro - alot of overweight people living in poverty can't. Why don't you donate that money? Or why don't you send the money you spend to NEED mounjaro to starving people in the Phillipines, it's very unequal.

@Wranglestar but you're fine with the inequality that comes with some being able to buy into a great catchment but not others? Fine with private lessons for academics, music, dance, sports coaching, fine for private health, private ADHD assessment to jump the queue? You object to dog eat dog but you are attacking childrens' education. Ok.

@Wranglestar you want the private school system dismantled but you don’t care how ? I think you need to apply some critical thinking to that phrase and really look at that statement are you sure you are a professional you sound not so much

As soon as someone mentions closing schools or burning books for ‘equality’, you know it’s pointless discussing anything with them. Just remember which Government enabled these fruitcakes and make sure you vote so it’s the last time they have any power.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cj0zz357532o

Yet growth UP in Feb, an excellent 0.5%... despite predictions by many that we are gong into recession all because of actions by Labour...

Now a Swallow doesn't make a spring but its good news.... will it be acknowledged by Tory supporters..... doubtful.

We are, outside of the EU, weaker but £/$ doing very well, Sterling has never been seen as a "run too safe currency..." certainly not in my life time, even pre brexit, £/euro was close to parity.. and that lasted for years.

Anyway, its all a bit off tack, VAT on school fees is unfortunately, required, the 5 to 6 billion over 5 years, can go into state education.

Talking to my brother, whose children go to PS, his opinion is thats its just another cost, which he and everyone he knows at their school is very affordable.

Yes well aware thats not going to be the case for all.

@Absolutely45 there will be no money going into state the % that have left has resulted in net cost so more pressure on state and no sloshy cash for public schools

Have you spoken to their brother though?

What did Starmer talk about in terms of schools closing. No evidence or something. They are up though for closures.

@EasternStandard ahhh Starmer that shining beacon of integrity and morality said nobody ever
@FairMindedMaiden ?