Time to call out shit parenting!

[RedHot2025]

Just watched an article on BBC breakfast about decay in children's teeth.

Professional talked about scheme where teachers teach children to brush teeth each day since many children don't brush their teeth or get shown how to.

The presentator Nagga said is it right for teachers to do this and have time to do this surely parents should. The professional did everything to not blame poor parenting.

I mean, why don't we just say things as they are anymore? The parents are not parenting if they cannot be bothered to teach children to brush teeth twice a day (or for that matter toilet train). Why is it now down to teachers?

Some parents appear to do sod all but just churn out children.

Note. This is not SEN children, just children in general in particular areas. Again same with teaching to use toilet, not sen related.

Crap parenting or an inability for families to access NHS dental care at an earlier age?

I'm from a country with free health care and dentistry. In school, from kindergarten up until the 3rd or 4th grade, we were taught about teeth brushing, hygiene, and the importance of physical activity. This was standard. We had dental checkups at school and nit nurses.

The teaching of how to brush your teeth from teachers, dentists and at home just worked to reinforce the importance, the method, and routine.

I don't see a problem with teachers teaching young children about this. Self care should be taught.

A lot of these issues come down to one simple fact and that's lack of education. Having money/wealth doesn't necessarily mean you've been taught these things. But, are more likely to have higher/better personal care outcomes.

Learning the importance of tooth brushing as part of PSHE is fine.

Expecting a teacher to perform a personal hygeniene activity to a child is not OK.

Once you start doing these things, parenting declines even more as people simply expect that the school will do it all.

Already there are universal free school meals for infants, talk of a breakfast club and now toothbrushing. Why don't we just make all schools boarding and then the parents can wash their hands of them entirely.

DS is autistic, and after years of cleaning his teeth being absolutely set in stone that it had to be done, during a time when he was very distressed he just stopped. Refused. Trying to do it for him would lead to a meltdown, and his meltdowns are violent. During that time of extreme distress due to issues in school I had to go to A&E three times, he kicked holes in his bedroom door, a hole in the wall in the hall, would try to harm himself and would regularly leave me and DH bruised and bleeding. I couldn't make him clean his teeth - or have a bath/shower or change his clothes.

He now manages to clean his teeth at night using a u shaped electric brush, dentist says his teeth are fine so far, though obviously the situation isn't ideal but that we're doing the best we can. Tbh getting him to the dentist is a bit of an ordeal as well, that requires careful planning. We need him to clean his teeth so he, fingers crossed, doesn't need dental treatment because he wouldn't agree to it and I don't know what would happen then.

But I remember in the late 80s we would have someone come in and show us how to brush our teeth.We got given a free toothbrush and told to brush our teeth, then handed a little purple pill that you had to chew on after which stained your teeth in areas you hadn’t brushed properly.
I also remember the dreaded nit nurse blimey weren’t our parents neglectful too.

The “doesn’t like water” argument makes me so irritated. Now, we love a fruit shoot when we’re out and about don’t get me wrong and it is a treat for days out; but not multiple a day throughout the day. It’s usually with a maccies or a couple at the table if we’re out for a family meal ect. And we do drink squashes at home occasionally, but both kids know that squash/juice is a treat and they at 5 & 2 years old will happily ask for and drink water.. because I haven’t conditioned them into thinking it’s the only thing they can drink. We did have a “please can I have juice I don’t want water” phase.. but as other say, water gets put in their bottle and they either drink it or they don’t, then any juice privilege is stripped until they understand that it’s a treat, not a survival necessity.

It's not as simple as you've made it out to be. Yes teeth brushing should be parental responsibility, but there are contributing factors as to why there are such issues with tooth decay in young children.

1. lack of dentist visits
   People aren't able to get dentist appointments. Some parents haven't seen a dentist in 10-15 years due to a combination of cost, and lack of NHS dentistry. I have seen places of wait lists of 2 years. If the parents aren't supported or instilled with good dental health it's a hard skill to pass on. Whilst dentistry is free for children, it's still hard to get places for kids at a NHS dentist.

2. dietary changes
   People consume far more sugar now (both actively and passively) leading to an increase in decay, cavities etc. however if you can't afford to get it treated or you don't know that fruit for example is highly corrosive for teeth, you might think your kids super healthy and not realise you've cause dental decay.

I'd like to see dental hygiene prioritised in nurseries and schools as a general well being practice. Dentists/dental assistants coming in and showing how to brush, what motions to use, how to floss (for senior school). Then guidance on how often to visit a dentist.

When I was younger that's what dental visits were for - they showed us how to brush, let us practice on a fake mouth, then we got a sticker and a toothbrush and toothpaste.

Same way people need to learn how to cook, or what a healthy diet is. Information needs to be taught and shared amongst groups. I'm not sure what school is for if it's not for passing on both practical education skills but social, emotional and physical wellbeing learning also.

There aren't enough Social Workers in the world to deal with this issue.

My DC had teeth brushing at nursery’s we sent in a toothbrush and toothpaste when they was in the pre-school class and they used to brush their teeth. We were brushing their teeth for them anyway (think our dentist recommended we do this until they were 7 or 8).

When I was at school we had a dentist visit us and show us how to brush. We also had a visit to the dentist. I don’t remember any more than that though.

My big question is, why do parents not know to get their kids brushing their teeth?

Teachers already do more parenting than they should- the Teacher's Union should definitely call this out.
Unengaged parents is not a new problem but with many children arriving at school not toilet trained is has reached new highs, allowing a public broadcaster to advocate parents not teaching their own children personal hygiene is unacceptable.

if It became a standard practice that teachers taught teeth brushing then even more parents would stop teaching their kids, the problem could become larger. And what happens at wknds and during holidays when they’re not at school to brush their teeth. I don’t think teachers should be compensating for bad or lazy parenting. We should be calling these parents out. But unfortunately we’re now in this culture where no one dares say anything and then they make excuses for them. There’s always been parents who have struggled and had mental health issues. Society now excuses poor parenting that’s the difference

I imagine some 'parents' will do less and less, if that's possible, just expecting others to fo everything. What do these feckless parents actually do at all with their time.

@RedHot2025 and @Laurmolonlabe - you are both completely right. The more the school does to support, the less some parents do.

The huge problem in schools is that children aren't taught how to regulate. When you take away the slightly tricky parts of parenting you also take away from parents the opportunity to show some self regulation and actually step up to the ask of being a parent.

Free breakfast clubs won't get kids to school on time. More children will turn up hungry as they know the school will have food.

The message parents need to be receiving is that are responsible for their children and their children's happiness and development.

It makes me so cross as I see all the time that the 'support' we provide is actually making children's lives worse.

Agree.. my granddaughter has been brushing her little teeth since they popped up..she is four now it's part of her routine in the morning and bedtime.

That's likely not the whole picture. I've known kids have teeth extractions for what would have been totally treatable dental issues that have deteriorated due to years long waiting lists for community dentist, dental hospital etc.

A friend's child had obvious problems with teeth from when they first came through and was taken to dentist, brushed them every day avoided sugar etc but it was over 2 years before they were actually seen at dental hospital by which time it was too late as teeth had totally broken down.

I'm not suggesting this kind of congenital dental problem is common, but I imagine quite a few of those extractions could have been saved earlier.

However, absolutely parents have to be brushing. It's extremely important! It's a shame the teachers are having to teach this but I'm glad someone is!

My friends kid had congenital malformation of tooth enamel (forget what it's called), which can be genetic or caused by antibiotics also, and sadly also was judged by parents at school.

Another one here who remembers being taught about dental hygiene at school in the 80s. I thinks it's ridiculous to just blame the parents. I don't think there are less disengaged parents these days, I think part of the dental crisis is because so much money has been cut from services that they don't have what we used to have. I feel very fortunate my children have had access to a dentist from birth, and they have grown up with having regular dental checks. That is a luxury which I am grateful for, which is ridiculous because it shouldn't be a luxury. My older two have never had issues but my third had a cavity which was caught early because the dentist saw it early on. I thought I was doing great with their teeth brushing but i obviously wasn't. There was no sign of decay I could see, and no pain reported. If left it may have been a extraction, as it was it was sorted easily and the tooth has been kept.

Problem is it becomes a cycle. I don’t think this is new though. I remember them coming into our school and having a session on proper tooth brushing. Red substance applied to teeth and we had to brush it off and it was applied again to see what we had missed? If I remember properly. This was in the 1980s.

But people who were poorly parented have kids who they in turn do not know how to parent and the cycle continues.

1 in 8 children have it apparently, so not something parents can help
www.kch.nhs.uk/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/pl-1074.1-molar-incisor-hypomineralisation-mih-in-children.pdf

DD2 was still supposed to be seen every 3 months to get floride varnish - back teeth enamel is weak - then covid hit and that didn't happen.

Even now 5 year later we're still on one a year visits though supposed to soon go back to 6 months. The 3 month dental nurse floride only clinic never got set back up. DD2 was luckily fine - though when she was seen was perscirbed higher floride tooth paste - but the need for that's now gone.

So it's not hard to see how if 1 in 8 kids have congenital malformation of tooth enamel - and due to covid and later lack of NHS dentist access the prevenative work my kids got has been as accessible that will be adding to wait lists as well.

I know someone who doesn't parent her children well at all. She lies about their health to get appointments, she has a 3 year old she says doesn't sleep and screams all night so she got melatonin prescribed. I was there one day, she fed him sweets and fruit shoot, then said it didn't matter about the sugar as she has medication to help him sleep. It breaks my heart for the poor little lad. She does nothing but sit on the sofa and her husband does everything, including working 12 hour shifts and everything in the house. She really doesn't deserve to have children and I don't know how her husband puts up with it.

Yes, that is the real story.
How do we always get suckered in to blaming the mum?

No one is suckered into blaming the mum. Everyone is aware that for a small number of children there will be issues nothing to do with brushing, however, let's not pretend that that's the majority. If children don't know how to brush and need teaching then that's on the parents. Too many excuse poor parenting. Excuses, excuses and the poor children suffer.

I agree about the obese children problem. It’s quite upsetting seeing obese primary school kids and I can’t fathom how parents can’t control how kids eat.
As someone who’s struggled with their weight (as an adult) it really gets to me. I’m not sure what the answer as we all know how hard parenting is.

1 in 8 is 12.5% of the children, so if you have 23% needing extractions that is over half that are having them due to organic issues forming enamel and dentine rather than poor oral health.

*edit to say it is 23% with decay, not necessarily even needing extractions.