‘Game the system’ disability benefits

[Tomatochocolate]

WTF
just read a bbc article about welfare reforms

Apparently ministers think that it’s an incentive to claim disability benefits as the incentive is no work commitments on UC. That claimants ‘game the system’

It’s a long process and really hard to get awarded dla or pip. It’s not just ticking a box that says ‘I’m too sick to work’.

AIBU to think this is just horrific

I don't think they'll be able to justify cutting it for ND (or MH) as it's a huge spectrum - maybe they'll require more evidence on how it affects you but they won't cut it completely.

I can't speak for ADHD ( I don't actually know anyone with it ) but some people with autism cannot function or live independently so I'm not sure how they would be expected to work.

Yes but this is necessary because if you say one wrong thing they say you're not eligible. They send a report which picks on any positive things you've said and it says things like "She attended a mainstream school", "She can walk her dogs", "She can use a washing machine", "She can wipe her own arse" . Therefore she is capable of doing a full time job. There's no way someone will get PIP unless they maximise everything and don't say anything positive at all.

I've had my claim rejected twice and I'm autistic and I have GAD and depression. I've got no income at all at the moment.

Benefits bill is unsustainable. An overhaul is way overdue.

Nobody has told you that you're workshy scum though.

And your reaction is to an article about people gaming the system is "Well if they accuse me of that I'm going to tell them I'm sicker than I actually am!"

Which sort of proves the point.

How do you buy food etc?

@FoolishHips I don't agree that the process being awful justifies having groups online that teach people how to cheat. I think there should be a middle way where it is fairer to people who genuinely need it, but there is a crackdown on groups giving tips.

I think in the case of people with severe autism who can’t speak or dress themselves etc they’ll have to leave it intact. But those who are just anxious or have sensory issues, they’ll have to cut it as these are luxuries which have only been accommodated for about 10 years and are already uncontrollable.

It isn't ableist to observe something that is happening. Many of the people who notice this happening are themselves disabled.

It isn’t the people that claim PIP or DLA though, is it? It’s the ones that get awarded LCW or LCWRA. Both turn off work commitments and the latter gets a decent extra payment each month which is currently almost £500. It’s this that is being tackled because we can’t afford to fund a nation of people who can’t or won’t work when there could be alternative options for employment. It’s being awarded to people with mental health issues which could be overcome with the right support but generally people prefer free money and to be left alone.

But you can see why the public are dubious, given the massive rise in claims for conditions which are all self reporting and have no diagnostic test?

I honestly don't understand how people can game the system, though I only have experience of claiming DLA for my child.

I couldn't claim for the first 3 months just in case his situation improved despite the fact he was diagnosed with cancer and then I had to prove why cancer and the complications caused by cancer make his care needs higher than other children his age. I had to supply evidence from multiple healthcare providers including his oncologist, physio, OT and many more as well as fill out a long, complicated, utterly overwhelming form which is the last thing you want to do when you want to be with your child as he goes through chemotherapy.

You then have to wait for months. I was lucky and my child's claim was accepted after 18 weeks but other families are rejected and can be waiting for much, much longer.

@Wildflowers99 but sensory issues can be really complicated as well.

I don't necessarily agree with this but according to the physiotherapist my son can't walk because of sensory issues and there's not much we can do apart from hope he walks one day (I'm absolutely looking at other options and opinions) but sensory issues aren't just feeling a bit anxious because it's loud or whatever people think.

I agree to an extent though that people with ND and MH issues (depending what they are and how they affect people) can work with the right help and support.

So, have you filmed your ex-MIL doing all this activity outside the home and reported her to the DWP?

That doesn't sound like she is gaming the system though. There is obviously a problem if she can't help ease her symptoms because of fear the DWP will take her benefits from her but I don't think she is committing fraud. She does legitimately have a debilitating and fluctuating condition with no known cure. It's a sad situation but it sounds like a honest claimant with a genuine fear.

That's what I thought and I'm really confused - I guess we'll find out at the end of March but DLA is for children and those born after 1948 so not sure how much they're going to work

Not really. It took me nearly 4 years to get diagnosed through the local ME/CFS consultant. After lots and lots of tests and GP visits ruling out other things. It’s not the fault of people with conditions that cannot be cured or those that don’t have enough research into them so that there is a diagnostic test.

During this time I continued working and making myself worse. I didn’t claim PIP until 3 years after my official diagnosis (so nearly 7 after I actually became ill) because I had to give up work. I’d give anything to be well enough to be back at work and not be ill and bored with my mind and body just festering.

It's not zero it's 0.4% but that's for people they can prove have claimed and been succesful fraudulently. They haven't got the resource to check this properly unfortunately, so can only go on what evidence is submitted. That doesn't mean those 99.6% are not fraudulent.

I don’t actually understand why they aren’t linked then . The process for dla and pip is intense so surely they could use that as the proof of eligibility for other ‘sickness benefits’ as the claimant will have already been assessed? Much like if a child gets middle or high rate care for dla you can claim carers ?

I don’t actually understand why they aren’t linked then . The process for dla and pip is intense so surely they could use that as the proof of eligibility for other ‘sickness benefits’ as the claimant will have already been assessed?

It's already been explained that PIP is not an out of work benefit. People can and do claim PIP and also work. So how would that assessment also identify people who are not fit for work?

Something I am rarely seeing talked about with regards as to a huge increase in disability claims is this: when Nye Bevan set up the welfare system in the 1940s many medical conditions caused loss of life that wouldn't necessarily cause loss of life now. Many industrial jobs, unclean air etc meant early deaths for many who would nowadays be retired early or "on the sick" long term.

Those with significant MH and ND either went undiagnosed without help and ended up dead from suicide, substance abuse or in the criminal justice system, or were institutionalised long term up until the 1990s.

The trouble is there is no humane solution to stop people living longer, eugenics is unconscionable, quite rightly so. But our society is not geared to support people living into their 80s and 90s.

Pensioners can’t claim PIP.

But they can claim ALA which is essentially the same thing

@Wildflowers99 but they can claim attendance allowance (disability benefit) which costs 6.7 billion.

@Wildflowers99

Pensioners can’t claim PIP.

They can't make a new claim, but tif they are in PIP at retirement age they remain on it.

I'm disabled and I wouldn't be able to get PIP unless I massively over exaggerated my problem.

I also know of someone who is gaming the DLA system for their child, although I know that's much easier to do.