‘Game the system’ disability benefits

[Tomatochocolate]

WTF
just read a bbc article about welfare reforms

Apparently ministers think that it’s an incentive to claim disability benefits as the incentive is no work commitments on UC. That claimants ‘game the system’

It’s a long process and really hard to get awarded dla or pip. It’s not just ticking a box that says ‘I’m too sick to work’.

AIBU to think this is just horrific

You are describing one year of paid work that didn’t magically lead to more work, followed by 2 years volunteering that didn’t magically translate to a paid position and concluding that paid work is impossible? Hate to break it to you, but even nt non disabled candidates sometimes have to apply to dozens of positions before achieving a job, and even then it sometimes doesn’t work out. What you describe sounds pretty normal in terms of failure regardless of any disability.

I did apply for a lot of jobs. But I am not posting my full life story for randoms on a forum.🙄

Absolutely not! I cannot imagine what my tax bill would be if £1,600 went back to every adult. It would also result in massive inflation with rents, etc. rising accordingly so that the 1,600 wouldn’t cover much.

I don't know how it would actually work. But ppl on here think the disabled can live in luxury for less. So lets see all live on the same you can all sleep in happy days.

Most people have to apply for lots of jobs, though - I think I applied for 50+ before landing an entry level position. I remember being turned down for roles that felt’ beneath’ my education/ ability and being frustrated and confused.

it can be extra difficult for people with nd / other disabilities to launch, but it is possible, and it is far better for everyone if independence is achieved.

Depends on what your disability is, and how severe it looks. My experience any way. They seem to focus on ppl with downs, and wheelchair users. They see them on tv a lot.

No problem at all. Thanks for sharing your perspective.

Talking of independence I live alone, I started my own independent bookshop, and ran it for 6yrs until I ran out of money. And the first recession hit the uk and rents got silly. So less of the life lessons!

We all have setbacks, though. It doesn’t mean you are incapable of supporting yourself.

I was a lot younger then though, and on pip. I have more heath issues now.

Guys watch the UBI videos on youtube.

Someone said there should be proper support to help people with mental health problems into work. There is. They visit you at home, and provide a lot of support. But you have to be under a psychiatrist to be eligible.

@dawngreen if you were a catering assistant, then kitchens are crying out for staff.

I was under the NHS and a psychiatrist for years. There was no support in regard to getting into work... the only people I know who had the sort of help you mentioned was people who were taking time out from a job they were already in.

My local Mind used to help with getting people into work (they helped my DP find a job), but they no longer offer this.

@XenoBitch I am not talking about in the past, but now. There are work support people as part of CMHTs in England. But your psychiatrist has to refer you. They help you either keep a job, get into work, or into volunteering.

Well, if they do that now, then that is really good, and I hope it helps a lot of people.
I am no longer under a psychiatrist, or under CMHT.

Well until 10 years ago or so that was the profile of a ‘disabled person’. And the answer was easy - install ramps and make sure jobs are accessible and have disabled toilets etc, or in the case of Downs find jobs which suit their level of understanding and ability. I’ve known several people with Downs who work.

With the advent of neurodiversity it’s been much harder as it’s basically a person saying most things make them anxious or give them some kind of aversion, so that’s very hard to work with. What could they suggest?

The jobs market, on paper, has never been more ND friendly - lots of part time hours, working from home, a lot of technology. We have good employment laws around disability. I feel a bit like if it’s impossible for you to work now for one reason or another, it’s hard to see what can be done to be more accommodating that is also realistic (because employers will always need the basics of their employee committing to their working hours, doing what is asked of them etc)

I don't know any one who is ND. And I never needed any adaptions or disabled toilets.

Absolutely there is a certain proportion of people with DS who could work - for example those who are already holding down regular volunteering positions, but the number of employers willing to take a punt with them, adapt recruitment processes, give them the support they need etc is vanishingly slim, and I imagine that many of those that do, do so under schemes like the Down's Syndrome Association's WorkFit or are businesses or charities particularly catering for employees with learning difficulties.

I really really hope for my daughter's sake we don't go further down the road of penalising those who can't work or find it incredibly difficult to find employment through no fault of their own.

@curliegirlie does your daughter have DS? I really don’t think there is a single person out there who would say disability benefits shouldn’t apply to a person with DS, or conditions like it. The pushback seems to be against medium level MH issues, ND where the person was able to live and work for years but suddenly got diagnosed with ADHD in their 40s and now ‘needs financial support’. The only reason this is all going under a microscope if because of the sharp acceleration in claims, nearly all due to MH related conditions, to the point the bill is set to double in 5 years. It’s not at all an invalid concern.

@Wildflowers99

The jobs market, on paper, has never been more ND friendly - lots of part time hours, working from home, a lot of technology. We have good employment laws around disability. I feel a bit like if it’s impossible for you to work now for one reason or another, it’s hard to see what can be done to be more accommodating that is also realistic (because employers will always need the basics of their employee committing to their working hours, doing what is asked of them etc)

Ok, so with a calmer head n, let's go back to my autistic son who you think should go to work. He has only spoken to members of the immediate family for years. He needs support daily to just exist. He cannot make a slice of toast, he needs support to toilet. Every single day. He cannot communicate with the outside world. He barely communicates with us verbally but he can sometimes do it. The vast majority is non verbal communication. How is he going to work?

I think your problem here is that you are ignorant about autism and seem to think the only reasons autism could be disabling is if learning difficulties also exist.

So just to revisit my old post - if you ask him to brush his teeth (for example) what exactly is stopping him? If not a learning difficulty or physical inability? I’m trying to understand it, I really am.

I wonder why me saying 'it's time to brush your teeth' has any relevance in terms of getting a job?

I never said he can't or doesn't brush his teeth either; it's much more complex than that.

However what I do see is that my suggestion you were being ableist yesterday was absolutely correct. You seem to think the absence of a learning disability/difficulty means an autistic person cannot be severely disabled by their condition. That is ableist regardless of where of not you are doing it intentionally or genuinely think autism alone cannot disable a person to the extreme.

I'm not here to go back and forth about some weird tooth brushing scenario, but if you genuinely are trying to understand there are a lot of really good and reliable resources out there which will be able to explain autism far better than I can.

@richardosmanstrousers Not knowing how autism affects someone doesn't make Wildflowers ableist, actually. It isn't helpful to keep accusing others in the thread of ableism. I suggest you stop using your son as an example if you can't discuss him without attacking other posters.

I haven't been accusing others I said I i to one person. As I said previously I can use any example I choose. I'm not sure why you are trying to control what I say here?

And yes it is ableist to suggest someone with autism could not possible be severely disabled and unable to work. To suggest they don't 'lean into their MH' - there is a huge misunderstanding and whether intentional or not that is ableism.

I'm not being dragged back into a back and forth here, if that poster genuinely wants to learn they can do so. I suspect they will continue to hold on correct views about autism though, that's the usual stance on here.