‘Game the system’ disability benefits

[Tomatochocolate]

WTF
just read a bbc article about welfare reforms

Apparently ministers think that it’s an incentive to claim disability benefits as the incentive is no work commitments on UC. That claimants ‘game the system’

It’s a long process and really hard to get awarded dla or pip. It’s not just ticking a box that says ‘I’m too sick to work’.

AIBU to think this is just horrific

I work full time, get full PIP and the highest amount of Access to Work because the support I need inside and outside of work, for multiple disabilities is a lot.

But because all of my disabiliteis are non visible, there are people who would assume I'm 'gaming the system'. I have a blue badge and get challenged all the time.

The pp who mentioned lots of evidence being needed, this is true - I had hospital consultant letters, GP letters, results of medical tests, copies of my blue badge, copies of my disabled rail card, evidence from employer and lots of other evidence which would out me to describe. It is indeed a long complex process.

I think there are people who game the system, including someone in my own family, one counselling appointment, no other appointments attended, bam she's got all sorts of benefits for mental health. she laughs about it openly.

But people have different opinions on what counts as 'gaming the system'. There's people who don't think I should get PIP if I work.

You think 50 billion on PIP is fine because the military have ski trips?

I can't even face applying for PIP/DLA for either myself or DS2. I think it would just stress me out so much

Point it to me in my comment where I said that. Actually don't bother. I regretted engaging with you as soon as I posted. Here you are again throwing statements like " this is not the answer" and " 7 billion is not enough" without being prepared to elaborate whether is the answer and how much money you need.

If there’s even 1% wrongly claiming, then those people should be removed. I support a person on PIP, I know the process is onerous but fully aware that there are people on incapacity can’t work yet do work. I had one working at my home … I was ?? When he said he needed day off from project to go to job centre to confirm he can’t find work. He’s an experienced and skilled craftsman - lazy if you turn your back, but he is employed most of the time. He even works abroad he tells me he likes the work in Portugal as weather more agreeable!

@Wildflowers99 if we're just concentrating on pip, the bill is actually £18.9b and the military budget is £56.9b.

The whole disability benefit is £39.1b so I'm not sure where you're getting your figures from.

yes, a huge number were institutionalised, which if done now, would likely go out to private shareholder profit making tender and end up costing an absolute fortune that would pale the current benefit bill into insignificance.

Much like the children's homes bill is doing to local authorities.

And the huge hike in rentals is also currently doing to the benefits bill via housing allowance.

but if they were out of sight, out of mind, then maybe people would be happy that they were not scrounging. And given some of the comments on other threads, they would be pleased that they were not inconveniencing their own lives or children....

sorry for the snark, but its been a tough day

Reeves specifically said that our worklessness crisis was a stain on our country, just yesterday. That doesn't sound like just pip to me.

My child has an ADHD diagnosis and I was advised to claim DLA, it was denied which I actually agree with as he isn't really disabled and I can't see how he costs me more money than my other child. So I'm not sure people are getting an ADHD/ASD diagnosis in order to get DLA..

This sums up my exact experience. People who are genuinely and seriously ill are literally unable to apply for benefits at the crunch points. It took me eight months to apply after a massive relapse because I was literally too unwell to do so. I wasn't on any other benefits and had zero experience of the benefits system. I didn't have a clue.

The fakers live in their own subculture outside decent society and they celebrate their cons. They should be ashamed of how they affect genuinely disabled people but they have no shame. They don't have the decency to be ashamed. It is truly disabled people who pay for it.

PIP is to help with costs associated with illness/disability. Private counselling, gym membership, taxis, carers, physio etc.

It is NOT for living costs. They are covered by LCWRA on UC or ESA

The 2 are different but some people out there can, and do, play the system

I work with benefits, and I claim benefits so I see things from different points of view

@Upstartled It's not just pip but it sounds like the government is looking at things like ESA/WCA rather than pip etc but I was specifically asking wildflowers where she's getting her figures from because google tells me the things she's saying are inaccurate.

committees.parliament.uk/committee/175/economic-affairs-committee/news/204794/urgent-action-needed-to-tackle-the-spiralling-costs-of-the-health-benefit-trap/

Has anyone thought that those who are genuinely 'scrounging ' will just find a way to meet the new threshold for benefits. If they are lying now, then they will surely continue to lie.
Whereas the genuinely mentally unwell will find the process so difficult and stressful that they will give up. Which happens already.
This will harm genuinely ill people and hardly make a dent in the small numbers of people who are not genuine.
But everyone will feel good about it as they will believe it was for the best when the numbers on benefits are less. Give yourselves a pat on the back.

@Wildflowers99 Ah, I see where I've got confused you keep saying "PIP" alone - that figure includes all ESA/WCA which are the "out of work" benefits.

If you look at how Labour's funding has shifted since it was captured by blue Labour, ie Finance firms gave Labour £2m in two years before banker bonuses U-turn, I think you'll find the answer.

Yes and ironically the current benefits system punishes disabled people for trying to work and rewards the con artists who will lie through their teeth. My assessor could barely understand why I had robust mental health in spite of physical disability. I gain satisfaction and purpose from my work which is why I try to keep working. It also punishes working families as a whole because if your husband or wife works you won't get any individual help even if your disability has put a big dent in family finances.

As a retired OT, I decided to volunteer at our local CAB to help people with disability benefits claims. To my surprise, the CAB was twisting what the clients were saying and frankly providing false and misleading information on the benefits forms, with the aim of securing a successful benefits claim. I was completely shocked by this. There is a difference between emphasising facts which will support someone's claim and putting information on the benefits application which frankly bears no relation to what the client has said.
After observing a number of CAB interviews which seemed to follow this pattern, I decided not to volunteer there. I felt that gaming the benefits system was not something I wanted to actively participate in.

That won’t work as it’ll just result in what’s happened with winter fuel payments where disabled people just over the threshold are worse off than those under the threshold. Unfair.

£2m is peanuts, especially over 2 years. Not enough to change policy.

I don't. I don't think that it is even on their agenda too. They will likely concentrate on out of work benefits. I will be glad when we all know for sure, what they plan to do, as it will stop all the speculation.

The work capability process for UC is currently completely seperate to claiming PIP, but I think there was some proposal to make it that you could only get LCWRA of UC if you are in receipt of PIP ? If this goes ahead then there will be even more people trying to get PIP. It's bad enough at the moment.

This is an excellent post - too many jobs exclude people who are disabled and or carers because there is no flexibility.

If an annual ski trip is the price of someone being in the armed forces and being prepared to defend our country then they can rock on.

Skiing involves physical exercise, team work, taking instruction, mastering a skill. I’d much prefer to pay for that than to pay for some wingeing teenager to wallow in their bedroom self diagnosing on TikTok.

No it’s already been in the news.