Crying over children’s behaviour at work

[Themanuscript]

I’ll preface this by saying there are some wonderful parents out there who parent beautifully with and without limited means and raise lovely, well mannered children and I’ve encountered many over my 13 years experience of nurseries/nannying and schools.

But after the past 5 years, I think I’m finally going to walk away from the childcare industry. I’ve just walked in to the house after being tearful the whole way home and broke down after another day of sheer abuse from the children I nanny. No matter how well I teach and model behaviour, parents are not backing it up. Modern work/life balance is so bad that parents are giving into their children out of guilt and creating children that are unpleasant to be around. There should be no such thing as an unpleasant child! I should not be being hit for not giving them more sweets after they’ve had treats all night because they’ve screamed at me for not originally giving in and their parents have come out of the home office and given in to keep them quiet, undermining me in the process. I should not be having water thrown at me for telling them not to hit eachother in the bath. I should not be looked in the eye while telling a child an instruction or not to hurt another child for them to smirk and not listen and just walk away. These are primary aged children and I’m being shouted at constantly because they aren’t being taught ‘no’ at all.

I’ve worked with disadvantaged children who have come from foster care, poverty and abusive households and none of those children ever treated me as bad as the middle class KS1/2 children in beautiful homes who never go without.

Today an 8 year old child was asked what they wanted for dinner, I made said dinner which they decided they didn’t want and because I would not make an entirely different meal they threw it on the floor and later jumped on me full body weight while we’re sat on the couch. Meanwhile I’ve come home to an empty fridge and bank account and they have no idea how fortunate they are.

this isn’t an isolated thing. Like I said previously, this is 80% of the children in past 5 years. I spend all week trying To instil good behaviour, they don’t see me for 2 days over the weekend and it’s back on to square one on Monday

AIBU to walk away from working with children at all? I expect age appropriate challenging behaviour but I am sick of being abused all evening long every single day.

I'm a Nanny and I totally understand. I turn down any job involving school aged children.

OP, you don't know what gentle parenting is. It's not the same as permissive parenting.

Those children sound like extremely hard work.

There should be no such thing as an unpleasant child!
This is silly though, kids are individuals, they lead different lives. Some less idea than others. I agree no child should be ill, neurodivergent, traumatised, bullied or struggling, but that's so far from the world we live in that your statement is just a judgemental generalisation.

t’s the result of the work guilty coinciding with the ‘gentle parenting’ fad. But thanks for your input.

If you already know everything, why post?

Thanks, though, for the generous acknowledgment that good parents do exist 😂

I blame the fact that many families can only survive if both parents work full time.

The OP has stated these are middle class families with beautiful big houses. That's why they have to work full time. The parents are prioritising having a big house and nice things over spending time with their children. They would 'survive' very easily in a smaller/not so beautiful house with less 'nice stuff'

@Rainingalldayonmyhead another one who doesn't know what gentle parenting actually means.

I'm so sick of 'both parents work full time' as an excuse for shit parenting.

My grandparents both worked full time, in shit jobs. Kids looked after by a range of neighbours then, later, older siblings.

Dh and I worked full time through the early years. And I'll admit, the kids I teach often took precedence. But we managed to potty train and bring up well mannered, well behaved kids. No magic wand- we were just consistent all the way; not afraid to say no and didn't want to be friends with our kids.

No I do. Just because I don’t agree doesn’t mean I don’t understand. Having an opinion doesn’t make someone wrong not does it mean they don’t completely understand what gentle parenting is. It’s a lazy argument because you don’t like the perceived criticism of my opinion.

Another gentle parent who doesn’t actually know the consequences of it.

My old friend was a childminder. Most of the children that she encountered in this sort of occupation were rich spoilt brats, whose parents gave in to their every demand and when the parents went off to work (or holiday, or to play golf) theyd pay a nanny to look after the child. You couldnt discipline them otherwise the parents would go ballistic over their little darlings not being treated like the sun shines out their arses.

Childminded kids are not reflective of most kids, you do get a lot more privileged little sproglets for the reason above.

I refute and resent the implication that women working is the cause of this phenomenon. What utter tripe.

It is work guilt. But the difference is that some parents, like mine growing up, had no way to make up for it other than with the time they had, attention and love.

Some Parents who are in a better financial position make up for it with spoiling their child rather than the quality time they’re desperate for and use gifts and toys to subdue their outbursts.

It’ll ruffle some feathers on here with me saying this but all of the behaviour I have received like this has been from children who come from middle class homes. It was never the children in school with plain cheese sandwiches and their siblings old school shoes.

Why the arsy response?

Because you say it like I couldn’t possibly know what I’m talking about. I have years of experience, cared and educated hundreds of children across nurseries, schools and in their own homes. I have been on countless behavioural courses, SEN training, have qualifications in child development, early years education and I have a broader knowledge what is usual in children than a parent who generally only sees what goes on in their own home.

Can you work part time while also running two businesses:

Write short stories based on terrible parenting.

Set up as a counsellor for parents of brats who want to have nicer children.

What you put up with is more than you should have to bear. Can you instruct the parents and point out what is happening?
Nearing the end of your placement, it might be easier for you to tellthemsome truths, even show them this page.

I think it's easy as parents (especially full time working or after relationship breakdowns) to fall into the guilt trap. God knows I buy my kids too much stuff to 'treat' them, when what they really want is me on the floor playing. I know, I'm just very tired. But I have boundaries, consequences, and 'no' is said daily. Some of the things a few of the other year 1s are doing to their mums, and in public...

There's one boy in my son's class. Frequent hitter since reception. Mum works part time around him and has majority care. She's a lovely human being and one of the nicest mums I've met at the school. But - when he kicks or pushes or punches another boy in the park after school, in front of us all, she says in a quiet meek voice, "now now, people don't like being kicked." His response is a boat load of swearing at her. At the grand age of 6. I feel like he's probably copying his dad (yes ive judged him after seeing him once), but she has zero boundaries!

My son would never dare to speak to us like that (and doesn't know fuck or cunt yet, unlike his classmate - he checks occasionally on finger action meanings and new words with us).

MOST of the kids at school seem normal and nice, not perfect though, so 80% seems huge. But I know many are different at home, so you never know.

How much did they use to see their parents before? In the 50s/60s I guess you are referring to? Dad working hard outside the house, mum slaving away inside the house, the kids playing out all day, not to be seen or heard.
Parents didn't use to coddle or play with you much at all and the childhood wasn't child centric.
Before that, not only did your mum work if you weren't too well off but you went to work with her or even went to work by yourself, depending on what magical time it is you are talking about.
Always one with a dig at working mothers. Mothers never parented more.

Gently parenting has absolutely nothing to do with permissive parenting which is what you describe.

I come from the generation who would have got a good smacking if we did something wrong. (Didn’t deter me or my peers from being little nightmares)

Before I had kids I didn’t understand why parents weren’t more authoritarian. I also thought it was nonsense to say that people without kids just don’t understand what they are on about. I was wrong. People without kids can be good teachers, nannies, role models etc and a select few are exceptional but most people without kids have no idea.

At the same time some parents don’t deserve kids and are abusive neglectful etc

I think a new generation looked into the faces of their newborn babies and decided they didn’t want to parent though fear. This can only be a good thing. That is not the same as not putting in boundaries or consequences. Gentle parenting involves actually engaging with your children.

Yes the family you are working for sound awful and are doing their children no favours and it is no excuse but the age group you refer to have been absolutely f*ed over developmentally by Covid. The impact on them has sort of been swept away and forgotten but there is are several years worth of children lacking in social skill. I remember seeing children in playgrounds in the year after opening up and children looked at other adults and kids with suspicion and didn’t want to engage outside familiar bubbles.’ It would take a National effort to look into the impact on these kids and help them adjust.

I think if you work with children you need patience and understanding - there’s plenty of teachers and nursery workers with the same kind of ‘guilty giving in’ parents. You just need to learn to deal with it and be consistent with your boundaries. Maybe you are not cut out to work with children?

In my eyes its the same.

I think to be a parent, your kids have to fear you. Not to be trembling in their boots at the mere sight of them, but theyve got to have that level of respect where they know not to cross you. But that seems to be a thing of the past these days, with lots of parents treating their kids as friends. I certainly dont see my kids as my friends and vice versa, but at least they respect me and are disciplined (for the most part, not angels of course but better behaved than most kids at their schools )

The most atrociously behaved kids are the ones with stay at home mothers or those working very few hours. In fact thinking about the bullies and bully gang leaders at school, their mothers don't work or work little. Too lazy to work or entitled enough to live off someone else translates into lazy indulgent permissive parenting. Of course not always but pretty much almost always.
The do have a common denominator - working fathers.

Give over. There’s a difference between working with a classroom of children , a minority of whom
might have families like this, and only working with a family like this. Relentless, no let up, constantly being undermined and abused, with no decent kids helping you think “ok, this is worth it”.

Maybe some people aren’t cut out to be parents and offload their parenting to someone else.

Walk away from the industry if you want to. Or you could just be more picky about who you work for.

Gentle parenting isn't a thing. It's a social media fad, with no science behind it. It does teach almost no consequences, and has you validating everything the child does, and their feelings above else, and its as bad as permissive parenting. not only are you raising an entitled brat but also an extremely ego centric narcissist with zero resillience. So it's not just as bad but in some ways worse than permissive parenting

I'm with you. I worked in an extremely affluent nursery and overall (obviously we had some lovely families, so not all were like this) the majority of the families with Nannies and/or money were a nightmare. Their children were rude, aggressive, demanding and entitled. Their parents seemed lovely, but the lack of parenting was astounding. In the flip side, the few lower income families, who lived in bad areas were raising beautifully behaved children with lovely manners. It's one of the reasons I stepped away from the industry last year. Behaviour had been declining for several years and I reached breaking point. I'm devastated because early years is such a passion and labour of love.

In my honest opinion, the majority of gentle parents aren't gentle parenting, they're just plain permissive. The trend for gentle parenting is going to create huge problems in the future.

Most house holds were much nicer and more child centric than how you describe. In my experience the worker parent expressed gratitude, played with the kids, helped with dinner and baths, coached sports teams, drove the whole family shopping and to church and sport on the weekend, the SAHP did not slave (to the kid) but involved their child, played music, greeted kids home, took kids shopping, NEVER spoiled them with lollies but did teach them to care for their own bedrooms and pets. There was little money for anything extra, kids didn't ever expect treats. SAHP was proud and made a career of cooking etc. No competition or pressure to look like Social Media dictates today. Kind and good enough, was good enough. As a parent in the 2000s, many households were again, not as severe as you describe, but very child focussed and positive. Once again, good enough was good enough - no one wanted to spoil their kids with goods or attention. Well mannered, respectful kids were what mattered most. (Maybe society rightly puts a little more focus on the mental well being of the child now rather than creating a model polite citizen.)

Parents today have it more stressful than all, I think. Cost of living and having more expenses that they have to afford like multiple phones! updated carseats, extra property taxes, and travel expenses due to having to live further away from work.

I came to say this. My kids go to nursery full time, as we both work full time. They don’t behave like this and I would be mortified if they treated their nursery staff like this. We are pretty strict about behaviour and expectations (within age appropriate boundaries). Kids want boundaries and to know where they stand.

Hi. So I supported a child through the entirety of his being removed from parents for neglect until his adoption. 3 year process. Meetings with social workers, new parents, behavioural plans the works.

Another child I worked with suffered from attachment disorder due to sexual abuse as a toddler. 1-2-1 for 2 years. Navigated those meetings.

A 3rd example, I highlighted one of my key children for showing signs of autism. Reported it to higher ups who got the process rolling on getting the parents on board to be referred for the ASD pathways. I was invited to meetings with the OT, senco etc, was in charge of all his files for milestones and EYFS targets during this time and his routine.

But yeah you’re probably right. If I don’t find it acceptable for an 8 year old neurotypical child to bodyslam an adult, I’m probably not cut out for it.

That chimes with my experience as a secondary school teacher: the most demanding children were those from middle-class homes.

I recall one 13 yr old having a tantrum because I wouldn't give her the poster I'd just put up on my classroom wall. (It was for the Luhrmann 'Romeo + Juliet'.)

"But I WANT it!"

"I want it too. That's why I bought it for my classroom."

Yanbu, I've worked in nurseries for 13 years and I see a difference too.

Daily staff are getting spat at, bit and slapped off children because they are being told no, to be kind to their friends, to stop climbing on the tables. The parents don't care and admit to giving their child screen time because they can't be bothered with the behaviour at home and to have an "easy" life.

I too am thinking of getting out of childcare all together. The cons out weight the pros at this point.