Mother is barely speaking to me wwyd?

[Biscuitsnotcookies]

NC to start this thread.

Background: I grew up as a black sheep in a sometimes very violent but always psychologically damaging household. My father did not want children, and lashed out at me frequently and violently, and said he hated us regularly. I don’t have a single memory of him hugging or smiling at me, or feeling anything but anger towards me. He just openly counted down to the day he could throw me out. I was on my own at the age of 16.

To this day he is not interested in either my brother or me. My brother was the golden child, so my mother shielded him from much of the violence, she did not do the same for me. As a result I have scars both inside and out.

My parents are still together, although I believe it is a mutually coercive and manipulative relationship. Almost transactional, I was only ever happy anywhere away from home as a child and spent most of my life outside. I learnt to make the best of things and lie low.

Fast forward to now. I have a family of my own, and we live around 3 hours from my parents.

When I had children of my own I realised how awful my own childhood was, and I moved away to provide a calm and happy childhood for my dc.

My mother took it very, very badly and has felt deep resentment ever since, saying I took her ‘grandchildren away from her’. Despite accepting it was a better life for them. In all honesty I wanted to keep them away from my toxic family as far as possible. Although initially we visited every three weeks, and I called my mother every day.

We had to stop seeing my father when he started to abuse my own children by calling them names and degrading them.

My mother felt I should tolerate him, for her sake, but I can’t as I fear he will make my dc anorexic (I am a recovered, as far as possible, anorexic myself, thanks to him) and ruin their self esteem at best. He has a nasty temper, and can blow up at the smallest thing. My dc haven’t seen him in over five years.

Up to a year ago we just saw my mother alone, and tired to continue a relationship of sorts. Last year she became quite abusive towards me, calling me names, blaming me for the family’s problems and always trying to make me feel I am not good enough/not doing enough.
She is angry I won’t play happy families and allow my father near my dc. It comes out in a million PA ways. She never stops reminding me of what I have done.

For the sake of keeping some relationship with her, i have tried to keep things light mostly, but I told her she has hurt me with the things she has said, and the name calling. She then proceeded to cut me off for six months, and stopped talking to me.altogether.

She did this before for nearly a year, she has form for giving me extended periods of silent treatment. This hurts me, as I feel abandoned and hurt, even though I am adult now. It makes me feel terrible. It’s my punishment it feels like.

Just before Christmas she got back in touch, as if nothing had happened. Expected me to visit her, bring presents and play along.

I felt too afraid to really challenge her as she just cuts me off the minute I say I am upset/hurt. So we haven’t discussed any of this in any detail, I am expected to gloss over it, she is pretending like nothing has happened, chatting about the weather and sending me gushing messages that she misses me and loves me more than life itself. It all feels very hollow.

I just feel so confused. She says she has a ‘phone phobia’ but I know that isn’t true as she speaks to her sister every single day. She also calls my brother. She just never calls me. Ever. She just refuses to engage properly, and just sends texts only talking mainly about the weather or her undying love for me.

I don’t know how to manage this relationship anymore.

It feels empty and pointless, superficial in many respects, but somehow I feel I must continue to make some effort with her as she is my mother, and is getting older. I feel so sad we have no real relationship. It just feels so upsetting and empty that it has come to this.

Mother’s Day is coming, and I’m already having sleepless nights about what to do.

I have panic attacks at the thought of driving to see her now or bumping into my father again. I don’t know what I would even say to her now.

What would you do in my place?

'It would be the total loss of hope, and never seeing or hearing her voice again, which she seems content to run that risk, but for me it’s an enormous loss. I am not medicated, I see this with total clarity. It would be similar to a bereavement but she is still alive..'

You're absolutely spot on and this is beautifully written. I can feel the sadness and despair in your words, and I relate so deeply. You sound extremely self- aware and empathetic. It is so painful to let go of that last glimmer of hope that things might be different one day. I'm going through the same process with my sister, and it really hurts

You're aware of the guilt and the pain and the grief, and they are real for sure, but you're already making some space for the relief that would come with not having this woman in your life anymore. It's very easy for others to say 'cut her out and be happy' but you know it's not that simple, it's not like flicking a switch. If you do decide to stop contact with her, you will feel a whole mix of things, and that's entirely understandable. You're entirely right that it would be a process, like grieving a death. You can do it though, I have no doubt. You're already starting to choose yourself rather than her. I highly recommend seeing a therapist to help you along this journey, whichever path you take. And yes, the Stately Homes thread is a great place to hang out. Sending you a hug x

Please do go back to therapy but do not use the same therapist again.

I think that you sound absolutely lovely and you should be so proud of yourself for breaking the cycle, moving away and protecting your children. You’ve been a fantastic mother to them.

You have a husband, children and lovely friends. You will never be alone, they are your family. Never feel worried about what others may think, many of us out there have created our ‘family’ not from blood relations. People we have chosen, better people, kinder people. You’ve pretty much lived that way for your entire life, you’ve gotten nothing from your parents or sibling except negativity, blame, abuse and vile behaviour. They have never been loving or supportive and bring nothing to your life except misery. It’s about accepting that reality and realising you’ve got this far on your own, you’ve smashed it despite everything you’re up against and you can bloody well continue to do so.

I liked the idea you had for joining a community. Doesn’t necessarily have to be religious in nature, there will be all sorts of friendly, close groups around you - everything from walking clubs to book clubs. If it helps you feel more confident in your decision to cut your awful mother off then absolutely go for it.

Mother’s day is YOUR day now. If you feel you must then arrange for some flowers to be delivered and plan the day around your family and yourself and do not give it a second thought.

I would cut her off, never speak to any of them again and enjoy my life surrounded by the people I love, in peace. None of this is your fault, you have never done anything wrong. I hope one day you can do that for yourself and be free of these awful people.

I know I was just a small child, and like all little children I was innocent and did not cause their problems, on an intellectual level I know this.

They didn’t want to do any actual parenting or look after our needs, the point of my very existence was to keep my mother entertained, and happy - it literally was exactly that, and when I had normal human needs and emotions I became selfish, irritating and demanding. There was only room for dm’s needs.

And nothing at all has changed or moved on from this ever since. I idolised my mother too much (I was well trained) I thought she was a living angel, and I had to work very hard for her to notice me. In trying to capture her love/attention/ affection I kind of sold my own soul. Lost who I was as a person.

I recognise she expects the same now, but I have changed, woken up, and realised I am not here to serve her despite what she thinks, and I have been fighting for some oxygen ever since to focus on what is important to me.

It’s been such a long, arduous process because my natural inclination is to love, forgive, understand we are all flawed etc and I haven’t been able to feel any anger.

On some level I am very fearful of her, and becoming aware of my fear helps me realise I need to be protected. It activates my self preservation.

This is not a person I can ever trust. My whole axis shifts when I realise I am not safe around her.

She is the sweetest older lady, butter would not melt type, so carefully crafted to look so benign and sweet- but it’s a wolf in lambs clothing and you don’t have to scratch too far to see what’s really underneath. I know this stems from her own childhood I guess, but she has been an adult for several decades, she had so many choices to be a better and kinder person.

I can’t magic this into a ‘working’ relationship because she doesn’t want it, she wants drama, upset and misery.

I spent long enough there as a child, I do think now is the time to find a new flock of like minded birds, so I can finally leave this behind. To be confident my own wings are strong enough now to be on my own.

I must start to take care of my own self, and stop their access and trashing of my peace of mind. This is my responsibility, not theirs.

Aww you poor thing. They all sound horrid and your DM I suspect is probably jealous of you.

I think you need to let go, or as you say, the cycle will continue. You don’t need her and she brings you no joy or love so let her get on with it.

@Biscuitsnotcookies what fabulous insight you have.
This is a huge starting point.
I know to get here you have suffered greatly at the hands of the people who are meant to love you and nurture you, but these people are broken and useless to you.
As much as you feel you'd have 'no family ' if you cut your mother off, family doesn't have to be blood relatives.
I class many friends as family, wonderful people who know me far better than some family members.
We are there for each other, day or night if need be.
I hope you find peace with the decision you make, you deserve to be fully happy 🌼

Oh I'm really sorry you've been through this and are still being treated in this way x

Cut all contact. They are still trying to abuse you.

You have your husband and kids. They are the only family you need.

What an awful childhood you had, I really feel for you, especially with the abuse continuing now into adulthood.

they are abusers. Cut them off and live fear free.

I have read all of your posts and am struck by how well and eloquently you write about such a difficult topic.
You have a talent for it and if you started a blog or wrote a book I would read every word.

Anyway.. you know intellectually that you need to cut her off entirely but it must be so hard emotionally. I admire your strength and resilience and am sure you will come through this even stronger.
Good luck 🤞🏼 OP.

For the life of me I cannot see why you continue to try and maintain a relationship with a woman who treats you with such utter disregard and contempt.

You gain nothing from this relationship, absolutely nothing. Stop torturing yourselfand back away for good.

Your husband and children are your family, you have family. I know it’s the grooming you’ve received but they should be your priority not your mother and aunt.

You are loved, and you have family, both chosen and your own new family that your parent's do not get a free pass to belong to. Importantly, you have broken the cycle. That is huge. But it doesn't go down well with the originators of the abuse, because in their eyes, if you're not with them, you're against them. They have to be "wrong" or you do. It's a no brainer for them and extremely difficult for you.

Father's going to "father", Mother is going to "mother' and your job is to let them. And then decide if that is something you want for yourself and your family going forward. Do you want what they bring? You can choose. And if you can get to a place where you're ok with them thinking whatever they think of you, then you are free.

You are so capable of articulating what's going on here, but there's still that deep need to have the mother you want, and the mother we all deserve, but do not all get. It's here where you can find the peace you are looking for, and where the work around acceptance comes in, followed by the grieving for both you now, and you as a child. There is lots more work you can do with a therapist here and I wish you all the very best.

Absolutely agree with all of this. It's incredibly sad and I'm so sorry you've been landed with such a shit family of origin, OP. But toxic abusive family is not better than no family. You've done a brilliant job creating your own loving family, both in your household and with friends. In your shoes I too would be continuing therapy, drawing a line, and working on acceptance (which doesn't mean accepting you have to be treated like shit! Just that they won't change, so your only control is in your own choices around that).

I wish I could give you a big hug. You deserve better. X

@Biscuitsnotcookies sorry but you have joy with your young family and dh. you do notneed to see her or speak to her or even have contact with her. certainly not when she drags you down on each occasion. you need to sever ties with her once and for all.

I have felt such support and kindness on these pages, thank you for all of your posts. I’m going to keep referring back to it.

I notice I always get more wobbly around Mother’s Day, Christmas, Easter. I need to do more to prepare for them. Dh has just booked a weekend away, he is very supportive and knows certain days are hard, and MD is definitely one of them. This year I might try and celebrate the fact my dc have turned out to be really lovely people. That motherhood for me was mostly really enjoyable and rewarding, and we have a strong connection to our children that feels really deep rooted. Thank you, it feels easier when I think of all the things I do have (and not agonising over the things I don’t have)

What would you do in my place?

What I did do. I went no contact. I took away the power and just stopped.

It's peaceful and I don't regret it. I don't see my family, they know where I am but the freedom of not being the whipping boy is more than worth it.

It does sound as if it would do you go good mg through this with a professional though.

OP, i know someone like you in an almost identical situation.
She too moved hours away.
She has told people for years she was an only child and her parents had past.

She actually believes it because they are dead to her.
She blocked them 20 years ago and embraced the peace and has gained the acceptance that they will never change.

She found the dead narrative helpful as it meant no further conversation.

Consider blocking them and thinking of them as dead.
Remaining in contact is a mistake IMO.
Wishing you well.

@Biscuitsnotcookies my back story is similar to yours. I have no family apart from my children. My parents/abusers are dead as are my husband, sibling, aunts and uncles. There is no one left. I understand what you mean by feeling vulnerable, I've sorted out my will etc which I find helps.

Find a different therapist and live your life well. You and your children don't need these abusers in your lives. Block them, change your phone, email etc.

Oh love. You need to walk away from them. Making the decision and going through with it may cause you initial pain but your family is just causing you constant ongoing pain. You can be free of it. You absolutely can.

Focus on your real family, your husband, children and the friends who love you. That is your future. Get professional help and work on yourself. You sound like a wonderful person who has thrived despite them.

I went NC with both my parents 10 years ago and have not looked back.
You have family in your dh and kids. Your friends can be your chosen family
.your mother doesn't bring anything positive to your life. You are likely to thrive without her

You haven't BECOME kind etc with age - you were fine as you were when you were a tiny kid as well. You were never someone who deserved to have them all "thinking the worst" of you.

Do you ever give them your own narrative? As in:

"No, the fact that you married a cunt is the cause of your unhappiness and family dysfuction"

or

"You spent my childhood sitting back and doing fuck all while my father abused me, and now you want to do the same with my kids. Damn right I took them away from you, and that's why. Best decision I ever made - no regrets."

???

Maybe try it? Maybe stop following their story, and acting their script? Like how she decides when your silent-treatment punishment is over and you fall in with the pretence that nothing's happened?

Do that, and you won't have to decide whether you're cutting her off or not. She will probably do the cutting off, as you show you're not pretending she wasn't a shit parent any more, and you're not apologizing and you're not backing down. She'll drop you like a bad habit. Which will tell you how much she actually cares about you and your happiness. Your shitty DF and trying to convince herself that she's a decent person (without the hassle of actually being one) matter way more than you do or ever have or ever will. She's not going to change. Well, I mean, there's a tiny chance she might, I suppose. Give her a chance. Tell her once and for all that unless she treats you with respect and stops blaming you for her crappy choices in life, you don't think you've got anything to talk about. She can behave decently or she can accept she won't be seeing you or the gc. Ball in her court. And then don't budge - if she's being abusive, end the call, or leave her house, or sling her out of yours. Be consistent, reiterate what her choices are, let her choose. And if she doesn't choose you, enjoy being with your decent family and friends who love you, and drop the rope on these pricks.

It's possible to manage without family.

If they are toxic and draining it's better for your mental health to cut off.......

Family don't always get on and make each other happy, just because they share blood. Friends are the family we choose for ourselves.

Exactly life's to short to.live like this.
Nobody not even a family member is worth upsetting your mental health for.

I did try this, I was very brave and said she has hurt me terribly, that it pains me that she stood by and allowed me to be abused for my entire childhood. And she immediately switched into victim mode and started saying I was upsetting her, and she couldn’t take it. The transformation was instant, and she said she couldn’t cope.

Thats the issue here.

There is no room for honesty, she simply won’t allow it. The minute the truth is raised she closes it down by saying she can’t cope and she is too distressed. Obviously I am not the kind of person that would continue talking in these circumstances, so I stop and become silent and the frustration internalises.

I suspect she is a covert narcissist, she has the poor me victim mentality down to a fine art, and uses it to close people down. She can say what she wants, but no one else can, because she immediately accuses them of ‘abusing’ her, even if they are being very gentle and taking about their own feelings and emotions.

In this scenario, she is likely to react by stone walling, and then confirming I am awful because I am upsetting her so much, and then she will tell everyone else I am ‘picking on her’, and making her cry. Even though I will have only said a sentence or two about my own feelings, or experiences.

She can’t bear to hear it.

So it’s pointless.

This has happened repeatedly for years every time I try to tell her how I feel.

What did help me is seeing your words in black and white like that, yes my dc will not be seeing those two abusers ever again, and I don’t need to feel bad about that because any mother worth her salt would make the same choices as me.

I will not allow a new generation and cycle of abuse to start on my watch. It just isn’t going to happen.