Mother is barely speaking to me wwyd?

[Biscuitsnotcookies]

NC to start this thread.

Background: I grew up as a black sheep in a sometimes very violent but always psychologically damaging household. My father did not want children, and lashed out at me frequently and violently, and said he hated us regularly. I don’t have a single memory of him hugging or smiling at me, or feeling anything but anger towards me. He just openly counted down to the day he could throw me out. I was on my own at the age of 16.

To this day he is not interested in either my brother or me. My brother was the golden child, so my mother shielded him from much of the violence, she did not do the same for me. As a result I have scars both inside and out.

My parents are still together, although I believe it is a mutually coercive and manipulative relationship. Almost transactional, I was only ever happy anywhere away from home as a child and spent most of my life outside. I learnt to make the best of things and lie low.

Fast forward to now. I have a family of my own, and we live around 3 hours from my parents.

When I had children of my own I realised how awful my own childhood was, and I moved away to provide a calm and happy childhood for my dc.

My mother took it very, very badly and has felt deep resentment ever since, saying I took her ‘grandchildren away from her’. Despite accepting it was a better life for them. In all honesty I wanted to keep them away from my toxic family as far as possible. Although initially we visited every three weeks, and I called my mother every day.

We had to stop seeing my father when he started to abuse my own children by calling them names and degrading them.

My mother felt I should tolerate him, for her sake, but I can’t as I fear he will make my dc anorexic (I am a recovered, as far as possible, anorexic myself, thanks to him) and ruin their self esteem at best. He has a nasty temper, and can blow up at the smallest thing. My dc haven’t seen him in over five years.

Up to a year ago we just saw my mother alone, and tired to continue a relationship of sorts. Last year she became quite abusive towards me, calling me names, blaming me for the family’s problems and always trying to make me feel I am not good enough/not doing enough.
She is angry I won’t play happy families and allow my father near my dc. It comes out in a million PA ways. She never stops reminding me of what I have done.

For the sake of keeping some relationship with her, i have tried to keep things light mostly, but I told her she has hurt me with the things she has said, and the name calling. She then proceeded to cut me off for six months, and stopped talking to me.altogether.

She did this before for nearly a year, she has form for giving me extended periods of silent treatment. This hurts me, as I feel abandoned and hurt, even though I am adult now. It makes me feel terrible. It’s my punishment it feels like.

Just before Christmas she got back in touch, as if nothing had happened. Expected me to visit her, bring presents and play along.

I felt too afraid to really challenge her as she just cuts me off the minute I say I am upset/hurt. So we haven’t discussed any of this in any detail, I am expected to gloss over it, she is pretending like nothing has happened, chatting about the weather and sending me gushing messages that she misses me and loves me more than life itself. It all feels very hollow.

I just feel so confused. She says she has a ‘phone phobia’ but I know that isn’t true as she speaks to her sister every single day. She also calls my brother. She just never calls me. Ever. She just refuses to engage properly, and just sends texts only talking mainly about the weather or her undying love for me.

I don’t know how to manage this relationship anymore.

It feels empty and pointless, superficial in many respects, but somehow I feel I must continue to make some effort with her as she is my mother, and is getting older. I feel so sad we have no real relationship. It just feels so upsetting and empty that it has come to this.

Mother’s Day is coming, and I’m already having sleepless nights about what to do.

I have panic attacks at the thought of driving to see her now or bumping into my father again. I don’t know what I would even say to her now.

What would you do in my place?

When I really consider the truth, the truth is total strangers have been kinder to me than either of my parents.
That even hospitals, schools and churches offered more support to me during my childhood than anything else, and the idea of ‘family’ being there for each other when it comes to my family is based on a false base assumption. They have never been there, or wanted to be.

I could build my own ‘family’ further by maybe joining a church, I am not overly religious but love the inclusiveness of a church. I could join other groups that give me a sense of belonging. I can maybe fill the vacuum with people that won’t harm me.

Even my mother’s texts make me miserable, because they are so gas lighty. She says like ‘I love you to the moon and back’, which clearly isn’t true as she can’t even bring herself to call me!

Please take a leaf from your children's book. She has been a terrible mother to you when you were a child and as an adult. She doesn't have a single redeeming feature that would make anyone want to be in her company. Please seek therapy and cut her off completely. She doesn't deserve any contact with you or your children.

Children don't need to spend time with older relatives and many children don't have contact with grandparents because they have died, because of distance or because they are not kind or supportive people. It is far more damaging for your children to be in the presence of a grandparent like your mum than to not spend any time with any older relatives.

I'm really glad your kids are teens OP, and that they can see what she is. Don't ever let her near them again, even if she 'punishes' you for it. You are their protection against suffering like you have.

In terms of your own relationship I agree with everything pp have said. But thought I would add this. If you and your DH split up, and he started abusing your children in the way your mother is abusing you, do you think they should still see him?
Obviously your answer to this will be 'no', so in that case why do you not deserve to live as free from harm as they do?

Therapy, and tell the therapist that you want them to help you come to peace with cutting your mother out completely.

Simple question: are you happier day to day when she is out of your life and giving you the cold shoulder?

In reality do you really have a family now ? The answer is probably no. So that means you're alone anyway but involved in this charade of a "family" , you get none of the benefits of a family , no love , no comfort , no support , instead all you're getting is hurt , guilt , rejection and shame. For me going no contact gave me peace back into my life , I now have a life where I'm not abused and manipulated , where I'm not tying myself in knots trying to appease these people. It hurts but it's also very freeing. You're healing won't come from them and while they are hurting you, you can't heal either.

The truth is it’s easier when she cuts me off, as I don’t have to feel
guilty.

When she is making an effort, effectively love bombing, I feel really pain as it dangles a carrot of what it could have been. Of course I know it’s an illusion, and she will be nice for a bit, before reverting back to blaming me for her miserable experience of life.

I recognise the cycle. I even recognise it is a cycle of abuse in domestic violence settings - and always wondered why the victims/survivors are sucked back in - and all I can describe it as is being absolutely starving, so hungry you can barely walk and someone you love deeply offers you a sumptuous feast and deep comfort and joy, and you long to just eat something, anything for just a short time, to feel the relief and comfort. Even when you know the price will be so high, and the fleeting joy will be so short lived and you will have another set of stitches soon.

The key is to see the feast as an illusion, a dangerous illusion that can and will cause such harm. But it’s hard. So hard because I long to be mothered, long to be loved and held. Long just to relax and feel safe. I do need to work on this.

‘Family’ to me is not defined by blood

some of my kids share my blood - some are adopted - all are equally my family s as nd I love them all to bits .

but my husband, my best friend, my church friends - my tennis club friends - the people who have laughed and cried and helped and shared and loved me throughout - they are my ‘family’ despite no blood tie.

the people who share your genes / blood do not always have your back - it isn’t right - it isn’t how it should be - but it is what it is.

but you can create a loving ‘family’ of your own through your current network.

don’t take on their shame - it is theirs to own from tears if emotional abuse.

i believe the best ‘revenge’ you can have on your toxic family is to live the best, happiest life you can - never let their toxicity and doubts drag you down - don’t get bitter because of them and their failings. You deserve more and truly I would focus on you and your husband / kids / friends- never let them drag you back into their warped lives.

you could argue with them, reason with them forever - they are never going to admit to what they have done.. but instead of wasted energy trying to make them repent - you can soar like a bird - you can laugh and live and completely confuse the hell out of them by having the happiness they they have always tried to take from you.

I think she actively and knowingly plays with my feelings like this, she knows just how to manipulate me back into line. Knows how much h would love to be close to her. She times it to perfection. Once I am back in the box, she then reverts back to being unkind. It then builds up and she cuts me off, and then we do it all over again.

Every single time.

Stepping outside of this cycle is not easy. It takes vigilance, courage and determination not to be sucked into it again.

And you CAN do it . Stay strong. Get a good therapist and look forward to having the best life you can.

I think there are two reasons why we keep in contact with family.
The first, and most important, is because we love them and they love us. We want them to be a part of our lives.
The second is because we genuinely owe them because they supported us and loved us and gave us a good start to life.

Yours did neither. You owe them nothing. They let you down. Time now to make your own family become your only focus, with friends around you too. Your children, with clarity, can see what your parents are. Try to see it through their eyes. Let go of your parents, they don’t deserve you. In time your new family may grow and your children get married and have their own children. This is your family now. You don’t need anyone else.

@Biscuitsnotcookies To answer your title I would enjoy the peace.
but more seriously & very gently you have done an incredible job to get where you are now, you are aware of how damaging the family/scapegoat dynamic is & have protected your DCs from it & built your own space. You do not owe your mother anything, she as you suspect writes her own narrative to suit her. You can’t change her, as you know, therefore you can’t only seek to change your responses or lack of them. I think a therapist could really help you to organise & process your guilt (which you shouldn’t have to in my opinion) I sounds like your previous attempt at counselling ended to soon.
I hope you can find peace with whatever you choose, but for me it would be ‘drop the rope’ & find your place with your own family & friends who do love you.

This. Please seek a really good therapist who specialises in working with toxic family systems.

Also recommend two books: Pete Walker - CPTSD, from surviving to thriving and Lindsay Gibson, Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Adults.

You need to distance yourself from these abusive people but you are too caught up in fear, obligation and guilt atm. Hence the need for therapy.

Cut them the hell off and don’t look back. Enjoy your life.

I like the idea of soaring like a bird, and leaving it behind. To shrug my shoulders and say this pain and misery isn’t mine. It’s theirs and I hand it back to them.

I could do this. I could try to remember I am just as important as my children, that if I can be so strong for them, then I can do the same for me.

It has taken me almost a life time to realise my mother is an abuser, I have been in total denial up to now.

Lindsay Gibson, Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Adults.

I got this book- and just to warn you, it's a hard hard read when situations you have always accepted leap off the page...

I know what you mean- my family always blamed me for the 'trouble' I caused. I can look back now and see that I was actually a lovely compliant anxious child, always trying to please 😕

Block her. Grieve for the mother you ought to have had and be thankful you have resilience to have broken the cycle and are a much better mother to your own DC. Celebrate mothers day with your own DC.
She can spend it with your DB. She doesnt deserve your time or respect.

OP, I cut ties with my Mother 20 years ago. Once day, I vowed that woman would never make me shed another tear. I probably see her once a year at the door while I pick my Dad up.

There was, for me, a period of grieving. I suppose it was grieving what I wanted, not was actually there. Now, I rarely think about her; for years, the narrative was that I was a terrible person, blamed for everything- and then suddenly, I wasn't there. I was very careful to speak about her in neutral terms but as kids get older, they catch on. I have nothing to do with her wider family and to be honest, it's a blessed relief. Nobody to make you feel small. I've spent my life being the Mother I should have had and we have a lovely tight knit little family.

And do you know what that means? I win. My kids are funny, happy and getting ready to go into the wide world; and they know this- wherever they are, whatever time, if they need me, I will come. I've given that gift for them and it gives them so much confidence. (They never really do end up needing me but the fact they know I will always come, makes them feel a little stronger) And now, honestly, I just don't care about what she says or thinks. I look at them and know that because she was such an unkind person, she has missed out on so much. I've lost nothing that was worth having.

On a wider note, you get used to people saying 'but she's your Mother......' This is because they've been lucky to have a different kind of Mother, so they can never really comprehend what it's like. Society really expects Mothers to behave in a certain way, and when they are terrible people, it's hard for them to understand. I usually just say something vague like 'for lots of sensible personal reasons, we don't have a relationship anymore.'

The love bombing isn't done with good intentions. Your mum does this to reel you back in so that she can then reject you again. She experiences pleasure from your pain. She sounds sadistic and the apple hasn't fallen far from the tree where your brother is concerned.

You have a lovely family with your DH and your amazing children. Your children see your mother for the awful person she is and it must really hurt them to see her hurting you. Please stop giving your mum the opportunities to do this.

Please get a therapist who specialises in these kinds of relationships. You should be immensely proud of breaking the cycle and therefore treating your kids like you should have been treated.

She'd never hear from me again.
And as for a funeral, she could be thrown in a quarry for all l'd care.

Aside from all of the other stuff, don't ruin your own mother's day. It's a special day for you too. Send a card if you must. But otherwise do something nice with your own children. Organise a day out or a nice meal and don't bother travelling. She has your sister and brother anyway.

Sorry I just read this. Sorry also you had a therapist that was so unhelpful. Being encouraged to accept a toxic situation is gaslighting you really. Your core instinct knows your mother is unhealthy for you, hence you trying to distance yourself. You need support to continue with this and to understand the dynamic that sucks you back in.

OP it's really great, reading through your posts and updates, that you're step by step coming to a realisation of what you need to do. Take the energy in this particular post and hold on to it. Re-read it. They're your words and your feelings and now it's time to act on them.

It's no surprise that you're coming to this realisation in this stage of the cycle of abuse, where your mother isn't speaking to you. But at present your relationship with her is all in her hands. She decides when it will be one of "love" or one of abuse. The reason going fully NC is so valuable is that it's the only real way you can take back control of it - it's the only way to stop her pulling the strings.

NC is both hard and easy. I've been there and I know the feelings of guilt and shame, even when you know they're illogical. But I think you'll find that your partner, your kids and your friends will be there for you in a way your birth family have never been. They love you; they know you're not unloveable and they won't judge you as such. To me, the concept of a "chosen family" has been so important in navigating my toxic family.

Those feelings are the hard bit. But detach yourself from them and look at it practically. What are the actions you need to take? Block. Then it's an absence of action: don't jump when they call, don't respond if they get through to you. Every time you find yourself thinking about them, remind yourself to think about your partner or kids or friends or something that makes you happy instead.

You will probably still feel very conflicted for a while afterwards. But it will be outweighed by how free and liberated you also feel. Good luck.

You have a lovely family with your DH and your amazing children. Your children see your mother for the awful person she is and it must really hurt them to see her hurting you. Please stop giving your mum the opportunities to do this.

Spot on!

I have a very similar experience to you OP. I'm sorry you've been through this.

Can I just start by saying, you did not deserve this, and you are not responsible for their behavior when you were just a child. I say this because you have held on to that responsibility as an adult in the form of the 'FOG' fear, obligation and guilt cycle.

You do not owe them anything. Your forgiveness, your respect or your time. You do owe yourself empathy and kindness and you are responsible for protecting your children from these utterly abusive people

I cut off all contact over 15 years ago from my abusive parent. I also took the view that the other parent whilst not abusive, did very little to stop the other therefore were complicit. My life has been blissful.

No more worrying about what tantrums they will have because she deems the level of present for mother's Day to not be enough, what insult will come next, what blame will be laid upon me, as a child for her abusive behavior. No more.

Of course, she has tried to guilt me over the years, sent her flying monkeys out to and hassled so many of my friends, family and even work colleagues try and turn me round but I have stayed strong.

You can do this, and I can only say how fucking blissful it is to not have to have that huge black shadow hanging over me of that abusive narcissist. They never change. All you can do is change your behavior to stop engaging them. This next stage is about you OP. Not them. Good luck OP.