Trans men are women according to Gender Critical Movement

[ThisPinkWyvern]

Under Trump's transgender policy, which echoes the ideology of the Gender Critical Movement, trans women are men and trans men are women. This view denies and rejects as worthless and baseless the lived experience of millions of men and women in the US who identify as trans. As a result of having their lived experience of themself ignored and denied by law, millions of trans men as well as trans women are now experiencing deep psychological trauma and living in abject fear and terror in the US. Many are trying to leave the country because they are so terrified.

The almost total silence of the Gender Critical Movement and it's supporters about the effect that it's ideology has had on those hundreds of thousand of women who self identify as men is deafening.It's whole argument about banning trans women from female public toilets and other ' women only spaces' is based on the argument that denying trans women the right to access these spaces is needed to protect the safety of women and girls. Given the fear, terror and trauma that hundreds of thousands of women( trans men) are now experiencing in the US, as a result of the government putting into practise Gender Critical Movement ideology, the sense of safety and well-being of hundreds of thousands of women has been devastated. This makes the infinitesimally small number of cases where women have been or ever would be assaulted by a trans woman in a women only space pale into insignificance by comparison.

In short, the Gender Critical Movement is directly responsible for harming the well being of hundreds of thousands of WOMEN according to it's own ideology.The damage done by implementing it's ideology makes a sickening mockery of it's claim that it's ideology protects the safety of women and girls.

When the number of men( trans women) in the US who are now living in fear and terror in the US is taken into account as well, the Gender Critical Movement and all those who support it are directly responsible for terrorising millions of people. It is impossible to claim that we are supporting women's rights and protecting the safety of women if we support the Gender Critical Movement.

Wholeheartedly support Trump on this. The sooner this absurdly delusional and dangerous trend is put in the bin the better. I can only hope an outbreak of common sense prevails here too, for the sake of our children. People have had enough of this shit and its overreaching, coercive demands. As a society we have far bigger problems to deal with and could do without all the oxygen in the room being taken up by the trans agenda.

Can't have it both ways. We're harming women you say...but you also say they're men. And we're harming them by calling them women. So we're not harming women.

It's a nonsensical catch 22 and you know it

Oh don't fall for this. Many trans people are backtracking in this way, trying to maintain access to female facilities for themselves now they see which way the wind is blowing.

Humans are not clownfish, they are not crocodiles and they most definitely cannot change sex. There are only two sexes of humans.

If you have found the article you have linked useful in explaining human sex, and believe that sex can change and that gender should be prioritised above sex when the sex of a person is important, perhaps you need to read more widely.

I really enjoyed OP's posts because it proves women were right:

THEY GOT NOTHING.

All they've got is "I have a feeling in my head that means a lot and a man is a woman if he lops his willy off."

"No Debate" is over and it is glorious

She’s been at it a good while from what I’ve seen. I don’t think this is a case of her back tracking in fairness. She’s always been very balanced.

Its you that doesn't know what you are are talking about. Evidence shows suicide rates INCREASE post (surgical) transition. Probably because they realise they never actually truly changed sex.

It's not balanced. It's selfish. It's all about him, what he wants, what he needs, and the pretending to be so careful about women's spaces .... It's pure bollocks.

It's unfortunate the whole debate has become so toxic and polarised. Agree that many TW are just trying to live their lives in peace

I think most of them know that they don't belong in women's changing rooms, toilets, refuges, sports etc. As always, a few spoil it for the many

Honestly, with Alexis Blake if I saw her in a woman’s toilet I wouldn’t have a problem at all. Toilets have cubicles. But that is my feelings and it might make someone else uncomfortable and therefore feel third spaces are important.

i actually feel I might feel uncomfortable with a biological female who is a trans man in a female toilet.

what I would have a problem with is a biological male in a female changing room. That would make me incredibly uncomfortable abd that’s where I feel the focus should be on.

Transmen ARE women.

This. This. THIS.

Transmen/boys rarely pass, well not the ones I have met. As a pp stated, they are typically short with small hands, feet and mullet haircut and a weird wispy beard around the chin. Ear stretchers and 'manly rings'. Dead easy to spot. I have seen pictures of transmen like Buck Angel but she has taken a shit load of testosterone to pass.

If a girl binds her breasts and cuts her hair short but does not 'pass' as a man, I think she would be putting her safety at risk if she habitually uses men's toilets in some situations, women's toilets are safer for women, that's why we have them.

This. And interestingly many of the 'new trans' don't chop off their precious peens, it's mostly young women chopping off their perfectly healthy breasts. Most are autistic. If they make it to 25 or so unchopped then many 'grow out of it'. Transwomen are mostly fully intact males with varying degrees of 'passing'. They literally never pass for me and it's bizarre that some people don't appear to notice or more likely perform the polite fiction of not noticing.

The first person you mention is a biological male.

Males should not ever be in female spaces, full stop. There is no applicable nuance.

@Rosie8880 We are humans, not animals. Humans cannot change sex. It is not actually possible.

Why is a male person with a factually dishonest ‘female’ passport more safe? Can you explain why?

“She calls herself a guest in a woman’s space- saying although she uses woman’s toilets, she does everything to to ensure no one is uncomfortable and that her ‘comfort’ should never overtake that of a biological woman in their space.”

This strikes me as a contradiction. This person can not do what they are telling you they are doing. There is nothing that they can do that will ensure that no one is uncomfortable except stay out of the female single sex space completely.

These ‘moderate’ male people with trans identities are only different to the one shouting abuse because they are not shouting their abuse. They are still abusive because of just what you said here:

“although she uses woman’s toilets”

These male people are the type who want all the other male people with transgender identities excluded but themselves still included. As a special privilege.

Because ? Why? What makes this person so different?

Have you thought about why you support this?

Rosie8880 ·"All of us have male and female chromosomes, X & Y."

No, we don't.

“Honestly, with Alexis Blake if I saw her in a woman’s toilet I wouldn’t have a problem at all. Toilets have cubicles. But that is my feelings and it might make someone else uncomfortable and therefore feel third spaces are important.”

There is no way that this male person should be in the female single sex spaces. You, personally, say you don’t have a problem with it and acknowledge that others may.

Yes! I would have a problem with it.

Female people DON'T just use the toilet to pee.

What do women do in toilets?

I spent many days, often 2-3 times a week, where I had a stroller or pram jammed in the door because I had no one but myself to do shopping. And I didn’t need the change table so didn’t use the accessible toilet if there was one.

That included at period time with flooding periods and hormonal diarrhoea.

Particulary after pregnancy. Often with a crying infant.

I have also had to take my wheelchair bound elderly mother to a normal cubicle when there was no accessible toilet available. Where I couldn’t leave her to sit without assistance to remove the wheelchair to lock the door .

I, too, have washed clothing out, and at times had to unbutton shirts to get them dry from baby vomit, or leaking breasts.

I have even had to do this at work when I was stuck in an event for hours and could not leave to express so ended up with significant leakage. More than once. Because breastfeeding women work too.
And got dressed in work toilets for various reasons.

And cried there and comforted others. And hid there from men who wouldn’t take no for an answer.
I have had friends lose their pregnancies in the female toilets and needed help from other women there.

I know I am not the only one because several times this past year I have come across half stripped women in the toilets while out dealing with similar issues.
The solution is also not demanding gender neutral toilets. It is not fully enclosed cubicles. A female taking up a cubicle to wash and dry clothes is putting an undue time demand on those waiting to use that cubicle.

There are many reasons that women do not want males in the toilet.

However, the female toilets have never been used just to ‘pee’.
And I don't want any male person in the female toilets, even the ones who someone else has declared ok to be there.

I have suspected for many years that it was always the right wing funding this insanity, safe in the knowledge that the left would take it to the n th degree and cause a backlash where people returned to 'traditional' roles and values. They have manipulated a lot of young autistic people with mental illness and turned them into raging cry bullies. These young people spend more time online than in 'real life' and so their voices were amplified more than in the past.

The LGB community were false teamed with TQI+ and they will be the ones who pay the price because unlike narcissists and fickle teens they can't just turn their sexuality off and desist / 'detrans'. They will be stung by the backlash.

Good for him, but that's dangerous. Just because he's a good man, having this mindset and acceptance means women and girls are vulnerable to male predictors.

The basic problem with letting the good ones in, is very simple. We don't know who the good ones are, that's why you need single sex provision.

A young male trans athlete may be nice and not use the girls changing rooms, but he's still on the podium winning all the girls categories.

That young university student, wants to bunk up with the girls, it's okay as he's a good guy, but Jack (now Jackie), wants in too, how do we and the establishment tell "Jackie", that he's not allowed access, even though his fellow male in a dress is allowed in.

Really? I have so far seen two surveys saying that suicide rates are higher for those who have transition through surgery than those who doesn't.

I acknowledge your points are valid - and it’s a good question, why do I feel differently about this person and not a trans activist like Lily Tino? And in truth I don’t know.

i believe in biological sex and I guess that would make me termed ‘gender critical’ but if someone who I probably wouldn’t even clock as male used a female toilet I personally wouldn’t mind.

however i do also believe the safety of biological woman does come first. See, I acknowledge I’m going in circles. I guess my point is that I have enjoyed her content as something that isn’t the trans activist content that floods the internet.

Thanks for your response. What often is shared when talking about gender is that it is intrinsically linked to biology, and that there are only two biological sexes present in nature, in humans - male & female. That to think otherwise, is unnatural. In nature, biological sex and gender - is not rigid. It can and does change. In humans we also have in biology, intersex - as well as male and female. We have people born with both male and female sex organs. Using this fact, We can see we have at least three genders, based on biology. It’s really challenging to unpick
gender constructs that we have created - it seems to be very upsetting for many and I can understand why. What I find interesting is the rationale based on biology is actually flawed. It isn’t factual. And then what is interesting is where does society go from there - that is the choice of society, something we have choices that connect to values and beliefs. - This is a useful article: www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/gender-identity/sex-gender-identity/whats-intersex