Trans men are women according to Gender Critical Movement

[ThisPinkWyvern]

Under Trump's transgender policy, which echoes the ideology of the Gender Critical Movement, trans women are men and trans men are women. This view denies and rejects as worthless and baseless the lived experience of millions of men and women in the US who identify as trans. As a result of having their lived experience of themself ignored and denied by law, millions of trans men as well as trans women are now experiencing deep psychological trauma and living in abject fear and terror in the US. Many are trying to leave the country because they are so terrified.

The almost total silence of the Gender Critical Movement and it's supporters about the effect that it's ideology has had on those hundreds of thousand of women who self identify as men is deafening.It's whole argument about banning trans women from female public toilets and other ' women only spaces' is based on the argument that denying trans women the right to access these spaces is needed to protect the safety of women and girls. Given the fear, terror and trauma that hundreds of thousands of women( trans men) are now experiencing in the US, as a result of the government putting into practise Gender Critical Movement ideology, the sense of safety and well-being of hundreds of thousands of women has been devastated. This makes the infinitesimally small number of cases where women have been or ever would be assaulted by a trans woman in a women only space pale into insignificance by comparison.

In short, the Gender Critical Movement is directly responsible for harming the well being of hundreds of thousands of WOMEN according to it's own ideology.The damage done by implementing it's ideology makes a sickening mockery of it's claim that it's ideology protects the safety of women and girls.

When the number of men( trans women) in the US who are now living in fear and terror in the US is taken into account as well, the Gender Critical Movement and all those who support it are directly responsible for terrorising millions of people. It is impossible to claim that we are supporting women's rights and protecting the safety of women if we support the Gender Critical Movement.

Thank god you used a reputable source 🤣

Well, well, well. 95% YABU is quite the ratio, isn't it?

A man without a penis is a man. A man without a penis and most assuredly has not changed sex.

I don't think Daisymae is saying that they think that as Alexis Blake is much more rational that the usual trans crowd he should be accepted into female spaces. I personally don't think that any man regardless of how he presents or what lady certificate he has should be allowed into any female only space. That includes AB. I am however prepared to listen to what AB has to say as he does put forward arguments, that although you may disagree with, you can engage with.

I saw a man who identified as not a man on Piers Morgan the other day and apart from making no sense at all he just shouted over everyone else and at one point said disabled athletes should compete alongside able bodied athletes. That to me is the difference.

I do wonder why these people absolutely need people to affirm their delusion otherwise they’re being traumatised, assaulted and are unsafe - when else do adults so much demand other people agree with them on the threat of being called nasty names? Do you know what it sounds like? It sounds like…what men do

XX XY end of.

Even 6 days ago!

But now, if the OP complains to MNHQ that they didn't ask for the thread to be moved, the OP might get it moved back.

There is still so many MN posters who will demand that the AIBU board be curated to suit their personal preferences and their own lack of impulse control. What is remarkable though, spanna and borntobequiet is just how many posters are posting fact based replies to the OP and some other poster's contributions. It is wonderful to see that so many posters now feel they have the confidence to reply to the OP and reply without worrying about being deleted, being accused of being transphobic relentlessly and falsely.

The past 5-6 years has seen this change.

I agree that if we have time, we should listen to all voices. I am all for it because it helps us to build our depth of understanding.

I am happy to read about what specifically Blake says that has not been said before. The question is, is there anything that Blake is saying that has not been said before?

In 100 years time, scientists can look at a human bone and establish the sex of that person. Being make or female biologically is far deeper than penis or vagina. Gender is about feelings but sex is not. Denying biological science is like being a flat earther. That doesn’t mean a biological woman can’t say they feel happier living as a male and vice versa, but those feelings don’t alter the cells in the body so the science remains.

’Transitioning’ is a journey with no destination. You will never arrive at the place you think you will, I.e. the opposite sex. You are what you are. You may be chopped meat by the time you’ve finished but you’ll still be a male. It’s sad and damaging that people believe otherwise.

Blah blah blah. Humans can't change sex. You can pretend if you like. But you can't make other people pretend.

I am sad so many young women and children who have had their heads so thoroughly fucked with by society that they think this bullshit is an escape. It isn't. But I can see why they might try.

If I said what I actually thought about the men involved I would probably be banned/arrested. Be sure though that I am revolted.

This crap needs to end.

I couldn't find a video link to this except from Twitter. But this snippet from Naomi Cunningham and Maggie Chapman is excellent at highlighting the fact that there is no agreed definition for who is transgender. And that raises the question, why not? And why have laws and policies been created or adapted when there is no workable definition outside philosophical belief that someone has a transgender identity.

https://x.com/FrankLeeBrian/status/1892299386287280189

What?!?

Alexis Blake IS a biological male - as much as any other male is! Just because someone is good at makeup, styling and cosmetic surgery, it doesn’t make them the opposite sex!

How are people going to feel bad about not affirming them without the hyperbole? Unfortunately, it worked on a lot of people who would rather go along with the dangerous ideology than appear to look bad. Luckily, the world is waking up to the nonsense and pushing back.

Well, I'm not trans so I agree with you there, I think they stink too lol - not everyone's me though, why is it so hard to understand that trans men might want to use the men's?!

Alexis Blake is just another AGP male trying to present himself as reasonable while still infringing on women’s spaces. There’s a growing list of them. If he was a “good” man he wouldn’t put himself in those spaces. If he was a “good” man he’d insist on correct sex pronouns.

He claims to see misogyny in trans identifying males who threaten women who might protect women’s spaces, while failing to see his own misogyny. He thinks because he’s nice and polite and women might be nice and polite back to him, he must be doing the right thing, without any consideration of how his presence might be making women really feel. He is “standing up for what he believes in” which is to be allowed to encroach on women’s spaces as long as men are nice about it. He’s no different to the aggressive TRAs he complains about, he’s just better at marketing his misogyny and sexism under the guise of reasonableness.

There was always going to be an expiry date on how long the rest of the world would enter into trans immersive roleplay without protest.

Exactly. You can't make any exceptions, whether it's only the nice ones, or the good at passing ones, or the ones who've had surgery, or any other group. If you let even one male into a women's single sex space, it's no longer a single sex space. Plenty of men who know they're men are lovely too, why aren't we letting them in?

The transwomen doing the 'I'm nice and reasonable and respectful' thing are still male. They're just better than the shouty ones at hiding the fact that all they really care about is getting what they want. If they respected women, they wouldn't be trying to get into our spaces.

5 or 6 years ago this thread would have been deleted or moved to FWR

So true.

I'm going to try to break down some of this nonsense.

It is having one's lived experience denied that is responsible for the psychological trauma.

It's not a genuine "lived experience" of being the opposite sex. Trans people need their "lady props" and "man props", otherwise no one would know they were supposed to be the opposite sex. That isn't a real or authentic "lived experience".

The only "lived experience" any of us can have is based on our biological reality.

No one is fooled by a wispy little lady beard on a woman pretending to be a man, or a dress and wig on a man pretending to be a woman. Some people will go along with the pretence to be "kind" or polite, but no one really believes that these people have changed sex.

A real woman is still a real woman without "lady props" like lipstick and a wig. A real man is still obviously a real man without a beard.

Everytime the wrong pronoun is used, everytime a gender designation appears on an identity document that conflicts with an individuals innate experience of themself

This is about their denial of reality about themselves. The "wrong" pronoun is the right pronoun. It's their delusion that is causing the conflict.

It's unfortunate that it causes them distress, but it's not the responsibility of other people to indulge the delusion that someone is the opposite sex because they put on their lady or man props and say they are.

If the biological sex of an individual cannot be changed then the results of using the same test to determine the sex of the individual at birth would remain unchanged no matter at what point the criteria was applied during an individual's life.

This is the kind of nonsense that feeds into the claim a lot of trans activists make that you can't tell a person's sex without looking in their pants.

At birth, whether a person has a penis or not is a (almost, excepting very rare abnormalities) foolproof indication of whether the child is male or female. However, it is not the only outward indication and as the child grows older it very soon becomes obvious whether it's a girl or boy, without any need for nappy or pant inspection.

Obviously things can happen that lead to a boy or man losing his penis. For example he might have an accident, treatment for cancer, or he might voluntarily have it removed, because he thinks he's a woman. The reason for the loss of his penis is entirely irrelevant. He is still a man and will be for the rest of his life.

Likewise, a woman who has a mastectomy, hysterectomy or oophrectomy, for any reason remains a woman.

A woman might have an appendage between her legs formed from tissue from her arm or leg to look like a penis, but she is still a woman.

I notice that the vote is 95% YABU.

I need to hear some strong arguments from the 5% who agreed with the OP's gender identity statements. Why should the rest of the population fall into line with some people's immersive role-play? What are the biological explanations for a bloke becoming a woman when his penis is removed?

And BTW OP saying "man without penis = girl" is just so fucking insulting

Well then there is a huge issue with mental health in the US

It needs addressing

I need to hear some strong arguments from the 5% who agreed with the OP's gender identity statements.

Well, you’ll be lucky (but you know that).

Yes. Adding to a growing list of them.

I think worth stating again, and every time DSDs are forced teamed with gender identity:

Transpeople used to be routinely tested for hormonal and chromosomal abnormalities as there was assumed to be a link between the two.

That no longer happens since the results of that long period of testing showed that DSDs are not more common in transpeople as "truthy" as it feels that they must be.

DSDs tell us absolutely nothing about why some biologically bang average people feel that they are a different sex.

What a load of shite, honestly. You seriously think that a penis or vagina is the only indicator of biological sex. Yes, it’s the factor used to identify a baby’s sex at birth, because, you know, that’s the way it works.
And if only the individual has access to their “I” then why are you speaking for every transperson?
You’re sounding more unhinged with every post. And go ahead, tell me how that’s discriminating against hinges, or something.