Page 9 | I never thought I'd see the US aligning with Russia

VolcanoJapan · 2025-02-19T10:27:26+00:00

The US appear under Trump to be aligning with Putin and Russia more and more. What was until recently referred to as our greatest allie is moving close to Russia in many ways, carving up Ukraine for Russia, trade deals with Russia. It's bizarre. Aibu to think it's bizarre or was this always coming when trump was elected?

ForestAtTheSea · 19/02/2025 19:40

Crikeyalmighty · 19/02/2025 19:33

@sleepwouldbenice I was rather amused myself at it! The audacity of someone saying Zelensky doesn't pass the sniff test but presumably a felon who paid off sex workers, is busy declaring he's looking at taking certain country's assets himself , declared false accounts and urged his own supporters to cause havoc because he didn't like an election result does pass the sniff test-

That was in Vance's Munich speech, too. We shouldn't worry about a little bit of disinformation and let elections run their course. Just like the Jan 6 attackers did; that was practically a democratic peace march.

Same with his remarks on the Munich and Austrian attacks. These attacks were bad, no doubt, but the hypocrisy of his benevolent advice on the background of Americans shooting at each other regularly and the Police regularly shooting dead unarmed citizens because they got the wrong end of the stick.

SandlersToe · 19/02/2025 19:41

Dream Matte Mousse being chummy with Putin is a surprise? Really?! Come on.

SandlersToe · 19/02/2025 19:42

Everyone was warned where this was all heading years ago. Americans don't have an iota of a brain cell between them - literally supporting their own demise.

LikeWhoUsesTypewritersAnyway · 19/02/2025 19:42

VolcanoJapan · 19/02/2025 10:37

It's awful. Two mad men in charge of very powerful nations.

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100% with you @VolcanoJapan DH and I have been talking about this very thing this week, but we have Elon Musk added into the mix too. All 3 together (Trump, Putin, and Musk) are very powerful, and it's terrifying because they are all a bit dense and clueless. I am genuinely worried for the future.

And I don't know why the FUCK Trump has suddenly sided with Russia. Absolute plank head!

As a few posters have said, he is re-writing history. Ukraine did NOT start the war. Russia did! Fortunately, many people know he is a whack job and know he is full of shit.

.

NamechangeRugby · 19/02/2025 19:44

TheNuthatch · 19/02/2025 19:29

Wasn't that quote by Karl Marx?

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You are quite correct! Marx. Google fail on my part.

Apparently Winston Churchill did say
“It is a good thing for an uneducated man to read books of quotations,”!

The similar quote I was actually trying to find was 'those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it'
That wasn't by Churchill either apparently.

sleepwouldbenice · 19/02/2025 19:45

LifeExperience · 19/02/2025 19:11

Nice to denigrate a military that has come running to Europe's aid for a hundred years. Remind me again why I should keep shelling out tax money for your security?

To answer your question, the US military serves at the pleasure of the president, who sets the standards. Serving as an officer requires dedication, education, extensive training, good judgment and the ability to build and maintain a complex and highly skilled but very human team of people in an intense, unpredictable environment.

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You really have swallowed every lie you've been fed haven't you.
Won't be any tax dollars left soon don't worry
The only allies you have left are Russia and Israel. Those lovely leaders can't believe their luck

sleepwouldbenice · 19/02/2025 19:48

Porcuporpoise · 19/02/2025 19:35

Well not exactly run to our aid tbf @LifeExperience. Come to it certainly, eventually, reluctantly- which is fair enough. But it's not only been a one way street.

As an aside, I don't think anyone who had to actually fight the American military would be quick to denigrate it.

They won't come for integrity. Just oil or minerals
America is so great...

Crikeyalmighty · 19/02/2025 19:49

@SandlersToe there are plenty of Americans with lots of brain cells- sadly I think less of them than those who believe any old bullshit/simplistic solutions - and it's pretty close here in the UK too - although the bonus in the UKs favour is that I think far fewer would rush to support Putin

Crikeyalmighty · 19/02/2025 19:53

@sleepwouldbenice yep interestingly everywhere he's after has certain 'assets' that would be useful. Thing is you just know the idiots who support will be going 'you go Trump' because they are all brain dead

Porcuporpoise · 19/02/2025 19:54

Most countries fight out of self-interest @sleepwouldbenice . We're not supporting Ukraine because we love Ukrainians, or because "its the right thing to do" regardless whether we do or it is. We're supporting them because we want them to fight the Russians in Ukraine so we don't have to fight them in Latvia or Lithuania or Estonia or Scandinavia.

100A · 19/02/2025 19:56

Well go on then Trump, go and play games 'bigly' with your mate Vlad. It's gonna be beautiful, you're gonna do a job, a beautiful job. Let's see when you send Vance to the next Moscow conference. Better be careful his speech there stays in line. He might find himself, I don't know, suddenly dead on a park bench from a mysterious nerve agent. Perhaps in a Siberian jail, never to return. Yes he'll find out about the real meaning of free speech soon enough.

Mielikki · 19/02/2025 19:57

YABU. He’s doing exactly what most people expected him to do: enact Project 2025, destroy the institutions that have kept the West (mostly) safe since the end of WWII, and align himself with dictators.

InWalksBarberalla · 19/02/2025 20:04

sleepwouldbenice · 19/02/2025 18:00

Read this over and over

Maga is never going to happen. Your country will implode on itself.

It really doesn't have the might it thinks it does. Your debt and backward and insular approach will weaken you, only the rich will get richer. From trade to the world stage, you are shrinking, you're not even the best with tech any more. You've been in decline for years you just dont understand that. Your tax dollar will just decline

You voted for it. Enjoy

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To be fair most of this applies to the UK as well.

Namechangey23 · 19/02/2025 20:23

IMustDoMoreExercise · 19/02/2025 18:02

I know that we are going to be caught in the crossfire but I am pleased that Trump is not sucking up to the EU like Obama and Biden did.

Biden actively hated us as did the EU bc of Brexit.

The EU are getting their just desserts. I hope that the EU enjoy being treated just how they treated us, with disdain.

United we stand. Divided we fall.

Poorkids · 19/02/2025 20:30

If

Namechangey23 · 19/02/2025 20:47

LifeExperience · 19/02/2025 17:40

Why does it matter what his reasoning is? He's the Commander in Chief and all military power is vested in him. He decides. Congress can stop a president from going to war, but it can't stop a president from ending a war, and without massive European funding and European boots on the ground the war is over. The US has sent billions in money and materiel, much of which Zelensky either can't or won't account for. Billions are missing, yet we Americans are baddies because we won't just send billions more, however much Ukraine asks. Well this American taxpayer says fuck that to hell and back. We're done shelling out to European assholes who always want more, more, more.

Putin is not a threat to the US. Read that over and over until you understand it. He's not a threat to us at all. Putin isn't going to do a damn thing to harm us. He's a threat to you, so act like adults and deal with YOUR threat.

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Putin IS a very very real threat to the US, he has as many if not more nuclear weapons than the US and if he teams up with China, possible UAE and North Korea he will certainly have more and be the new global superpower. China, UAE, North Korea and Russia all hate USA and see it as the epitome of 'the west'.

Why do you think Trump is terrified of him? So terrified he is using his exact wording and doing exactly what he wants.. Putin wants to land grab Ukraine. Trump is letting him! He's pretending it's about not funding the war. Truth is it's because Trump has made a deal with Putin to get him in power a second time in return for handing over Ukraine. You'd have to be blind not to see this! There is evidence from the previous election too which was swept under the carpet but it's there if you look.

Trump is MAKING RUSSIA GREAT AGAIN

Stick your fingers in your ears and go la la la but this is what's happening..

sleepwouldbenice · 19/02/2025 20:51

InWalksBarberalla · 19/02/2025 20:04

To be fair most of this applies to the UK as well.

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Agreed. Depressing though that is!

sleepwouldbenice · 19/02/2025 20:53

Porcuporpoise · 19/02/2025 19:54

Most countries fight out of self-interest @sleepwouldbenice . We're not supporting Ukraine because we love Ukrainians, or because "its the right thing to do" regardless whether we do or it is. We're supporting them because we want them to fight the Russians in Ukraine so we don't have to fight them in Latvia or Lithuania or Estonia or Scandinavia.

Edited

Yes but there are lines

Porcuporpoise · 19/02/2025 20:59

In what way have the EU treated us with disdain @IMustDoMoreExercise? Was it when we left the club but still wanted to use the facilities?

Clearinguptheclutter · 19/02/2025 21:07

LifeExperience · 19/02/2025 18:07

You would have to change the Constitution, which is hella difficult, for a good reason. To request a change, either 3/4 of Congress must agree or 3/4 of the state governments must agree to propose it.

Once it has been proposed, ratification by 3/4 of the states is necessary through ratification conventions, which each state must agree first to take up and then to vote on. IOW, even if 3/4 of the states agree on the change, all 50 states must first agree to hold ratification conventions. So any state can, in effect, stop it. Also, all proposed changes are on a time clock, so all of this has to happen in a timely manner or the proposal is tabled.

By design, it is difficult bordering on impossible to change the Constitution. The US is a deeply divided country and there is exactly 0% chance that a change to presidential term limits ever gets off the ground.

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Thanks for putting me straight on that I knew it was tricky but admittedly didn’t know all the facts! Hopefully this is very unlikely then

ForestAtTheSea · 19/02/2025 21:30

Namechangey23 · 19/02/2025 20:47

Putin IS a very very real threat to the US, he has as many if not more nuclear weapons than the US and if he teams up with China, possible UAE and North Korea he will certainly have more and be the new global superpower. China, UAE, North Korea and Russia all hate USA and see it as the epitome of 'the west'.

Why do you think Trump is terrified of him? So terrified he is using his exact wording and doing exactly what he wants.. Putin wants to land grab Ukraine. Trump is letting him! He's pretending it's about not funding the war. Truth is it's because Trump has made a deal with Putin to get him in power a second time in return for handing over Ukraine. You'd have to be blind not to see this! There is evidence from the previous election too which was swept under the carpet but it's there if you look.

Trump is MAKING RUSSIA GREAT AGAIN

Stick your fingers in your ears and go la la la but this is what's happening..

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Trump can also learn from Putin's example of "good democracy".
Those shouting "dictator" at Ukraine for not holding elections in war times with insecure borders, half the population abroad and the other on the battlefield and fled to different areas than their hometowns could compare this situation with Putin's reign.
He was first elected in 2000 (!) and after two terms could not be re-elected. He switched roles with his prime minister for a while, who kept his seat warm and acted in his interest, and then return again in 2012, though many thought already at this time that the presidency wasn't quite squeaky clean. In essence, Putin has been president for 25 years and there were many doubts about the democratic nature of these elections.
Who is the dictator here?

ForestAtTheSea · 19/02/2025 21:37

DancefloorAcrobatics · 19/02/2025 11:44

It will be interesting to see how far this is going to divide Europe.

At the moment it looks like a united front, but the cracks are showing.
The results of the German election and subsequent policies will be a good starting point for observations of what is to come.

Europe has been relatively stable over the last 80 years, I believe this is going to change. Trump & Putin will play a big part in this.

If the next days are going to be as crazy as the past few days, the German elections might not pan out as Musk & Co. intended, because even the person most living under a rock sees how their voting of far right could pan out for them - very badly. They are giving a preview of their worst self and it will motivate people to reconsider whether a protest vote is worth the self-destruction.

100A · 19/02/2025 23:19

Yes I agree @ForestAtTheSea . By modelling how quickly Far Right governments can go from very bad to deranged farce, very quickly, it may well finish off any public support for those with Far Right aspirations in Europe.

ForestAtTheSea · 19/02/2025 23:29

@100A
Yes, especially the mass firing of so many agencies, that would cause a raise in jobseekers, not what the average person wants.
And some far-right potential voters don't want to pay for Ukraine and want to get back cheap energy from Russia, but they wouldn't want to have Russia lurking at the border, either. I think that plenty of people will reconsider.

About what European leaders are doing in the face of total lies, Politico has some reports:
https://www.politico.eu/article/west-crisis-coalition-donald-trump-volodymyr-zelenskyy-emmanuel-macron-ukraine-war/

AlternativeView · 19/02/2025 23:36

*if we ever came to war which it won't no body would ever come close to us "

Trumps closing line.

If I was putin I would take that as a veiled threat