I never thought I'd see the US aligning with Russia

[VolcanoJapan]

The US appear under Trump to be aligning with Putin and Russia more and more.

What was until recently referred to as our greatest allie is moving close to Russia in many ways, carving up Ukraine for Russia, trade deals with Russia.

It's bizarre.

Aibu to think it's bizarre or was this always coming when trump was elected?

It's all great distraction from whatever he is up to under the hood of the US government I suspect

Insult the Europeans who aren't a threat to him, whip up his idiot fan base about whatever conspiracy he wants (that Ukraine arms Mexican drug gangs for example) and have everyone ignore whatever he is really up to at home.

Read this over and over

Maga is never going to happen. Your country will implode on itself.

It really doesn't have the might it thinks it does. Your debt and backward and insular approach will weaken you, only the rich will get richer. From trade to the world stage, you are shrinking, you're not even the best with tech any more. You've been in decline for years you just dont understand that. Your tax dollar will just decline

You voted for it. Enjoy

It's also not even about the proportions. If you look at the EU as a whole (so contribution of EU institutions + contributions from individual nations) it exceeds the US contribution by quite a bit.

And all that money listed as military aid? Countries need to replace the material and tech they sent overseas. Who produces missiles, fighter planes, etc? Mostly the US/US companies. The provision of military aid is a cost, but also comes with quite some economic benefit for the US.

Why on earth do you think Putin won't do a thing to harm the USA? Have you forgotten the Cold War? You can be sure he hasn't. Do you think you're....friends? That's funny.

I know that we are going to be caught in the crossfire but I am pleased that Trump is not sucking up to the EU like Obama and Biden did.

Biden actively hated us as did the EU bc of Brexit.

The EU are getting their just desserts. I hope that the EU enjoy being treated just how they treated us, with disdain.

It's worrying buy it's what Americans want. A lot of people agree with him and his ramblings and that's what scares me more.

Is gaslighting of epic proportions. I can't watch the news. So much de evolution of our species

A million casualties - how long must this fruitless war go on.

You would have to change the Constitution, which is hella difficult, for a good reason. To request a change, either 3/4 of Congress must agree or 3/4 of the state governments must agree to propose it.

Once it has been proposed, ratification by 3/4 of the states is necessary through ratification conventions, which each state must agree first to take up and then to vote on. IOW, even if 3/4 of the states agree on the change, all 50 states must first agree to hold ratification conventions. So any state can, in effect, stop it. Also, all proposed changes are on a time clock, so all of this has to happen in a timely manner or the proposal is tabled.

By design, it is difficult bordering on impossible to change the Constitution. The US is a deeply divided country and there is exactly 0% chance that a change to presidential term limits ever gets off the ground.

Yes, it's awful.

Perhaps Putin could withdraw his troops from Ukraine, so that they stop dying and stop killing people.

Oh, and he could clear up the vast tracts of Ukraine which he has landmined, so that agricultural land which feeds the world is safe to plant again.

A million casualties where? The casualties from the Ukraine war are 14,200 to 14,400, according to the UN.

@100A:
Vance's speech in Munich was astonishing, but not in a good way. More like someone talking about primary school maths and expecting to pass A-Levels with this knowledge.
It was completely off-topic, and with thinking that these comparatively miniscule examples would enrage Europeans like they maybe do for Fox News listeners. Absolutely no strategic vision and no understanding of history, as if things happen in a vacuum and not in the context of the past 100 years. His upset about right-wing parties not being admitted also showed clearly that he hasn't got a clue about German history at all.

Impeachment does not remove a president. Impeachment is the same as an indictment and is done by the House of Representatives. Removal must be done by the Senate. The Senate has never removed a president.

He fails the is a dictator test while Russia is engaged in occupation of Ukraine.
So the correct term would be acting like a dictator

How did Abraham Lincoln hold the election in Confederacy states during the US civil war?

Right some other questions:

What does the Ukraine's constution or legislation say about post invasion election cycles?

Where is the current front line?

Have the Ukraine regained stable control of all Sovereign lands?

Has Ukraine a system on allowing war displaced citizens to replace ID?

How would Ukraine organise its election district to account for the displaced citizens who have fled from combat zones?

Has Ukraine a system on allowing war displaced citizens outside the country to vote?

There are some utterly disgraceful Americans on this thread. Would that Senator McCarthy was still around, which is something I never thought I’d write.

That's contrary to what I understand about impeachment:

If found guilty, the official is removed from office. They may never be able to hold elected office again.

Why does this whole exchange feel like two AI bots arguing with each other? 🙈

Terrifying!

Absolute idiots that voted for him.

How f**ing dare Vance come to Munich - stand there in front of Ukrainian generals who have lost god only knows how many of their soldiers, not to mention family and friends - to announce that the real threat to Europe is not Russia at all. No you silly generals, never mind your losses and the invasion you are actually fighting right now. Nooo. What's actually important in Europe is the 'threat from within.'

Yes did you know, generals and European leaders, that once upon a time,M in England, a man was moved for 'praying' outside an abortion clinic. Surely this major incident is more important than such trivial matters as an ongoing invasion.

And did you know, in Scotland, people are not allowed to pray in their own homes, Yes, this is most definitely true, for sure. And people have been told to spy on their good Christian neighbours. This is also true, definitely. This is the 'war from within.'

Yes conference, these incidents-that-never-happened are the 'threat from within' - the threat to democracy no less.

Said - with no irony - by the man whose party refused to accept the result of the last US election and whose outgoing presidents incited his supporters to storm the capital. How very democratic - Europe watch and learn.

And then what does he do? Trots off to meet the leader of the German far right party. Not even disguising who he hopes wins the election this week.

I neither know nor care about any of that. I'm an American taxpayer and Zelensky doesn't pass my sniff test, which is why I have lobbied my Congressional representatives not to fund Ukraine any further. As a retired American military officer I will tell you that Ukraine can't win. It never could. The only thing keeping Ukraine in the game is American $$. European money, which is in the form of loan guarantees (i.e., Ukraine will have to pay the loans back. Don't believe me? Look it up.) and is not actual money. At least the US sent actual money.

Nor will you put boots on the ground. Starmer proposed it and the mners started screeching about not their kid so it isn't going to happen. And it shouldn't. No one should have to go to war. But if the UK doesn't put boots on the ground the rest of Europe won't either.

I'll put on my military cover (hat) and be blunt: Ukraine is fucked, but Ukraine was always fucked. They border a hostile power and despite the known, ongoing clear and present danger they weren't ready when Putin struck. And that is their own damn fault. They should have been less corrupt and more focused and they weren't. I am not unsympathetic to the plight of the Ukrainians ( and the Russian conscripts. They don't want to be there either.) but the truth of it is that Ukraine cannot win. They won't win. It will not happen. They need to get real, sue for peace, and get the best deal they can. Because the war was always eventually going to end up this way.

What attracted you to mumsnet?

@LifeExperience there were a few that were keen, I don't think any EIU leader will do it without US doing the same. They've said this much anyway.

Sadly we are more at risk than the US rn

According to Kyiv Independent figure 800,000 + to January 7th
According to Kyiv (AFP) & France 24 Ukrainian dead estimated at 70,000

Is a 'sniff test' the usual way that the US military is run? Deciding on who's good and who's bad by the cut o' their jib? Explains a lot.

Direct from the Constitution Article II Section 4: The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, AND CONVICTION OF, Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors.

See the bold? Two things have to happen. Impeachment and conviction, also called removal. Three presidents have been impeached, but all served their full terms because the Senate did not convict. In the cases of Clinton and Trump, the Senate refused to hold trials. In the case of Johnson, they held a trial and acquitted him.

I see Farage is declining all interviews at the moment - probably because he was so far up Trump's arse he was touching his tonsils and he can see the wind is not blowing that way in the UK, either in political or public sentiment