Moving to the US – Am I Bonkers?

[keithmoo]

DH has just been offered a job in the US, and it’s a really good opportunity – more money, career progression, and all that jazz. It would mean uprooting the DC (6 and 3) and moving to a completely new country, which is giving me the absolute fear. We’d likely be going to a mid-sized city in the Midwest (think Ohio/Indiana sort of area), which I know very little about apart from what I’ve seen in films – which I assume isn’t entirely accurate!

Has anyone done this? What’s the reality of life in the US as a Brit? I’m worried about things like healthcare (I’ve heard horror stories), schooling (seems like it varies wildly), and just generally settling in. Also, I’m a bit concerned about making friends – I’ve heard Americans can be friendly but in a surface-level way, and I don’t want to be stuck in some weird expat bubble.

Would love any advice from those who’ve made the move. What were the biggest culture shocks? Any regrets? What do I need to know that no one tells you?

Also, please reassure me that I won’t have to live off terrible coffee and weird chocolate for the foreseeable…

I agree injunctions and super injunctions can be an issue in the UK.

But the publications you quote just prove my point. Many of these like the New Yorker are publications you have to seek out, like The Guardian or Private Eye in the UK. In the UK you get decent quality news just from TV news and from radio news. You do not have to seek it out. You just have the TV on to watch Strictly Come Dancing and you leave the TV on at the end and get decent news.
The news in the US on TV and the radio is totally dire. A total insult to intelligence.

Back to the question, OP, I wouldn't even go in holiday to the U.S. at the moment let alone live there.

On not 'in'.

People keep on saying you get brilliant medical care in the US if you have very good insurance. You can pay for private medical insurance in the UK as well.
Comparing like with like is comparing medicare with NHS. And the NHS wins.

Ah, yes, moving the goalposts. Is that how they taught you debate in the best school system in the universe?

You said:
Poor access to objective news and information.

To which, I said:
With the magical invention of the interwebs, outside of totalitarian states, which the US hasn't quite become just yet, the same news and information is available equally to all.
Quite amusing to think that the UK, spiritual home of the Rupert rags is a more balanced media environment.

To which you replied:
But also home of the BBC, The Guardian, Channel 4 news, The Economist, The New Statesman, The Rest is Politics, Politics Joe...don't judge us by your choices.

To which I replied:
But the US is home to the New Yorker, The Atlantic, The New York Times, The Washington Post, The Philadelphia Inquirer, ProBublica, The Bulwark, NPR, PBS, Deadline White House and Rachel Maddow, to name a few.
My point was that all of these options are easily available, on both sides of the ocean, to anyone interested. One is no longer limited to paper copies of things, only available in their country of residence. In fact, the UK, at this point in time, has an arguably less free press, considering the wealth of injunctions and super injunctions, not to mention that it's become quite popular for individuals to attempt to find standing in the UK to suppress information using SLAPP lawsuits.
I think it might be a 'you' issue that you've made assumptions about my choices, about which you know, literally, nothing.

See, those were responses to the assertions you made. Had I realised we were debating news sources per capita, my replies would have gone in a completely different direction. Oh, right. We weren't.

It's interesting that you've judged me to be an America first person based on one thing, the fact that, yes, I do think a good US education is better than a UK education. Which I stand by.

I despise the Trump administration and literally everything they're doing. Were it up to me, I'd confiscate every gun in civilian hands in the country. I am not and have never been an America is best advocate. I have lived in both places, however, and I do, unfortunately, after many years in this country see quite a lot of dying Empire syndrome creeping in, which is actually quite reminiscent of what I see in lots of part of America, @Goldenbear.

Any food for thought?

@JoyousGreyOrca True. It's just that a good healthcare package is probably standard with her husband's job, whereas most people in the UK use the NHS rather than going private.

If you do have a good package, American healthcare can be amazing. You want to see a consultant, you contact them directly and you get an appointment. My children have never seen a GP, for example, they have a pediatrician. For minor ailments, they might see a nurse at the pediatrician's practice. We're not super-rich, that's normal here.

@keithmoo Speaking as a British born, not white poc, moved to Canada as a teenager, lived in US as an expat trailing spouse before getting divorced and moving back to Canada, my sister lives in the US, my son goes back to the US (south conservative state) for summers with his Canadian father - I personally would not move to the US if you have a comfortable life in the UK.

there are many things you don’t think about before you move. For me, the worst ended up being family law, which varies greatly from state to state. If, heaven forbid, it all goes wrong, you may get stuck there forever and not be able to move back to the UK with the kids.

i think being informed, even of all the negative stuff, is super important before you go. I thought I knew the downsides but naively never thought my marriage would break down (he decided to get a work girlfriend and go on work trips aka secret vacations with her while I was at home with baby DS, then made it extremely difficult and expensive to leave).

having no job also makes it that much more dangerous for you. I was lucky in that I had full access to finances and got my rightful share of marital assets - and even with that I didn’t catch him spending money on his girlfriend. I heard too many stories of other expat wives who got cut off from finances as in given only enough cash to buy groceries, only enough petrol in the car to get to the store and back, etc. I have personal friends who are/have been in a similar situation - it’s just not good. If you do go, you MUST have a backup plan to get out, even if you have to stay in the US.

healthcare - again not great. Even with “good” insurance with an oil company, I had day surgery that was $1500 out of pocket. So just imagine if you’re unlucky enough to get cancer or some other serious illness. Childbirth is a whole other thing - some of my American friends had to save for years to afford the out of pocket even with insurance. Add to that women’s care - there are more concerns there now than ever if you are a woman of childbearing age.

if you are a person of colour - I would look at the demographics where you are looking at moving. It is not great being part of the 1% or less especially in a conservative area.

guns - luckily I left before we got to the stage of having to ask American friends if they had guns in the house, but school shootings .. ugh.

if you want to discuss more, feel free to DM me. I have lots I could say!

I don't actually watch tv news, so I can't speak to that, and truthfully, I largely stopped listening to Radio 4 after their completely appalling dereliction of duty around Brexit. In the US, I believe the nightly network news is relatively decent, 60 Minutes is generally ok, CNN and MSNBC have some decent coverage, as do NPR and PBS.

My point is that people who want decent news coverage can find it in either country. The PP's assertion that someone shouldn't move there because it's unavailable was incorrect, particularly in a global world. It's not even difficult to tune into the BBC in the US.

And an awful lot of people here read the Sun and the Daily Mail and increasingly seem to be gravitating to X and GB News.

As a kid I had this rose tinted view of the US and always imagined I'd move there. I haven't and I wouldn't especially now I have a child who has a close relationship with his extended family but I'm very curious about these threads.

I have lived in a few different countries and if people ask me about the cultural differences my instinct would be to explain it with examples of situations I was in. However on here and Reddit, it's absolutely full of people saying things like "it's a completely different culture, nothing like the UK" and "it's an awful place to live" with no detail or examples at all.

I know very little of the US but have worked with US expats when I lived abroad.

"Divided by a common language"

I do get that we have a different sense of humour but other than that I'm not sure what it is that's so culturally different. I found my US colleagues easy to chat to and I think having the same native language is a massive help in making a connection. Also because we import so much US entertainment we had a lot of the same references and memories of childhood.

I did notice a couple of my US colleagues were so patriotic that it was unlike anything I'd seen. They did really genuinely believe that the USA was the best country in the world but would never speak about things they liked about the US. They just stated it as a fact as it they were stating the sky blue. Other than that I found them pleasant, positive and good communicators.

I've heard that Americans a lot more confident and less self deprecating which I did notice but I don't see as a bad thing. I know it's not what we're used to but I don't think it's good that we are so negative about ourselves and often have a crabs in the bucket mentality. There's a real feeling of anti-intellectualism anti-ambition in the UK in my opinion.

I think the American confidence is much more likely to result in success and while it's too late for me to ever really take that on, it's not something I would be opposed to my son having.

Likewise, I feel a lot of Americans seem quite good at communicating and sharing their feelings and asserting their boundaries. So many people here, especially in the very working class town I've grown up take the "stiff upper lip" thing to the extreme. I have immediate family members who I know very little about as all our interactions are basically small talk and banter. Speaking sincerely and earnestly about feelings would often be ridiculed or just subtly discouraged.

On the other hand, there's this stereotype that Americans are sort of cheesy and you know, all routinely in therapy, but again I don't see this as a bad thing. Its instinctively uncomfortable for me to be around more emotionally open people but I think it's a healthier way to be.

The education - I keep hearing it's worse but in what way? This I have no idea or experience of and all I see is American movies which I know are not going to be based on reality.

What is it about he curriculum that's so much worse? From what I've gathered it seems there's a lot more emphasis on sports and other extra curricular activities. Is it really like movies where everyone's either a theatre kid or on the football team or on the debate team? It sounds like there's a lot more opportunities open to them and culturally it's expected that they'll engage in these which again seems good? In school only the kids exceptional at music or art or music seemed to do anything outside of school and the vast majority of us did nothing. Is Is the actual content they're learning worse somehow?

Work culture - one of the big things that would put me off. Seemingly less rights and less work life balance. Very little annual leave and the expectation you don't take it all is a big thing as I like to work to live.

The health care - the only criticism I really see is the cost but this is negated by very good insurance packages right? Presumably OP wouldn't go without this being very solid? Or theres the criticism that a lot of the preventative stuff is excessive and unnecessary? I get that but also the NHS is very much about statistics and what works best for cheapest. Mental health is a great example. I hope a few sessions of CBT works because if it doesn't we will imply it's your fault and you didn't try hard enough. CBT is not often appropriate for complex issues such as trauma but it can be a big challenge to get a diagnosis let along actual help.

The NHS is particularly bad for chronic health issues that tend to take many years to get diagnosed or less common "zebra" illnesses. There's a lot of dismissing of peoples worries or only doing the most basic tests. That's if you can even get a GP appointment.

My maternity care was so awful that it was genuinely traumatic. There's this pervasive "tough love" attitude which I think is odd and I feel a lot of people assume immediately that someone is being dramatic or making it up if a basic round of blood tests returns no clues. Having to fight to be taken seriously for my newborns cows milk allergy was particularly eye opening and really made me lose a lot of trust in the system.

I appreciate that free health care exists especially for emergencies but the NHS is not in a good state.

The US seems like a place where it's very bad to be poor but if you're well off it's a good life. The political situation at the moment would put me off as well as the erosion of reproductive rights. I totally get why guns and trump and all that stuff would put people off. I'm just more interested in hearing more about the cultural reasons people often refer to. My impressions are based off very little experience but those who make these comments often do not tend to elaborate.

I very much agree with most of what you said.

The one big difference is your first paragraph about guns. When we lived in the US I didn't find that an issue. The rest of your post though - yes I totally agree with you.

Guessing you have been living in the UK for quite a few years. US health insurers cannot exclude pre existing health conditions since the Affordable Care Act came into effect in 2014. It is likely that the OP will get an excellent family health care package (fairly standard for an executive in a multinational company and we normally have the perk of a healthcare advocate thrown in who will negotiate any care issues for you). Where the US healthcare system fails badly is for the families who earn too much to qualify for the state subsidized programs but too little to get the gold plated benefits of the more senior employees. For them co pays & deductibles can run into multiple ‘ 000 if things go wrong and they do chase you for payment (I was horrified when I was in hospital over here once, drugged up on pain killers, & one of the admin staff did actually visit me to ask how I intended to settle my co pay. I gave her a credit card & she took the payment right at my bedside 😱.j so believe me I know it’s not a fair system. Ironically one of the things that is making me hesitant to move back to the UK is the fact that I have MS so I cannot get private health insurance to cover me in the UK. From what I’ve read in the UK papers I think I might find the NHS a bit of a culture shock…

If it was up to me, we'd have far more restrictions on gun ownership, but realistically it isn't going to happen here however many incidents there are. However, I do think that people used to the UK situation overestimate the risks in the US. Maine is an open carry state and also has a big hunting culture so a lot of people here hunt with guns, but I've lived here 22 years and literally never seen a gun except the ones the police carry and I've never been in fear of them. It's not that we haven't had the occasional shooting - although those also happen in the UK albeit at a far lower level because of sensible gun laws - but knife crime is at a pretty low level here, and so much depends on exactly where you choose to live. Our homicide rate per 100,000 here is 2.2 and in the UK it's 5.2 per 100,000, so I'm not that worried.

I’ve lived here on the East coast of the US for 16 years. It’s really too big a place to assume anyone person’s experience or anything you’ve heard anecdotally about the country is going to be the same for you.

It’s very State and even county dependent. It’s like living in a country on one side of Europe and expecting it to be the same as one on the other side.

It’s also why a lot of the crazy stuff Trump is trying to do won’t affect everyone equally so it’s still possible to view a move over here positively as long as you plan your location carefully.

If your husband gets good health insurance through his job you can have a five star experience with healthcare. So that’s one consideration. It just takes getting used to checking the insurance before big things but the care is amazing for those who are covered well.

Similar with schools - if you find a good school district then the educational standards are also very high - you have to learn to live with the American spellings unfortunately.

These threads make me a little sad, as the OP has asked a valid question and, along with some helpful replies, the thread is full of US-haters frothing at the mouths and shouting about guns, healthcare and Trump (although I'll give you that one) despite the fact they've only been to Florida once or their husband left America 20 years ago. So I'll try to give you advice from my positive experience..

Huge caveat in that we moved to a very wealthy part of New England from the UK six years ago. Although I've visited the mid west multiple times and really like it , I do not know what living there is like.

Guns - I've never seen one. Nobody I know owns one. Nobody talks about them. My kids have ALICE drills once a year, but they also had them at their private country prep school in the UK.

Healthcare in my experience is way superior to what we had on the NHS. You pay for it - it will come out of your husband's paycheck but it will be subsidised by his company - and depending on your package there will be co-pays but these need not be extortionate and they are capped per year. It's just not true that it costs the same as a mortgage. Our previous conditions were NOT excluded. You get appointments on the day you need them, plus yearly medicals, pap tests etc. Lots of preventative tests are included.

Food and housing are very expensive. Gone are the days where you can get a McMansion for peanuts (at least in my part of the world). Wages are considerably higher. Eating out is insanely expensive.

Public schools - again, I can only talk about my part of the world but they are excellent. I am aghast at the comments about how bad education is - I have a wide network of people who have moved here to across the north east and nobody has had a negative experience with schooling. Small classes - no more than 15 per class, exceptional learning support, and exceptional support for the brightest kids too. My kids were doing well in well-known, academic private schools in the UK and I thought it would be easy-peasy academically for them here, having always heard the US is 'behind.' This is categorically not true. The school system is less specialised in the last 2 years of high school (high-school diploma/APs vs A-levels) but the schools demand a very high level of academic commitment. My kids work way harder here than their contemporaries in the UK.

Friendships - same as UK I find. Easy to make friends through school (PTA), town activities (each town runs their own soccer/lacross/volleyball leagues outside of school. We don't go to church. Some of my friends do. It's not a big deal either way. Just like the UK.

Supermarkets - I am soooo bored of hearing how terrible they are. Cheese / bread is delicious if you avoid the processed stuff. The fresh produce aisle is huge.

You can buy proper English chocolate here, I don't drink coffee so can't help you with that. The tea is awful but you can buy Yorkshire Gold.

I think quality of life is much better here - much more to do eg beaches, skiing, national parks. We love it here.

But make sure your package is good. Just shipping your stuff over can cost well over 10k. I would also check that you can get a visa to work, and think hard about what will happen if you want to move back and your husband doesn't.

Goodness, do they teach you how to accurately reference your work when attending these superlative U.S. universities- I think you'll find Bouledeneige, posted the comment: 'poor access to objective news and information'. I was in utter disbelief (falling over laughing) that someone would proclaim U.S. news outlets to be the best and most free in the whole entire world😬. Equally, you are making stuff up to suit your argument as personally I have not spoken about the superior UK uni system, I have challenged another, America is the greatest poster, who wrote of her children being 'light years ahead' in their maths work than her friend's British children, It sounds ridiculous and it is ridiculous to suggest the UK education system is light years behind the U.S. Your experience of the UK education system is via a highly selective private school, which is frankly no experience at all, given most of the population aged 4-18 do not attend private school! Everybody knows that in the British private school system, Rote learning is the order of the day, leave your imagination at the door!

I don't know what circles you move in at these private schools but I literally don't know anybody that reads the Sun or the Daily Mail and they certainly don't watch GB news!

The news in the US on TV and the radio is totally dire. A total insult to intelligence.

If you watch Fox and only cable news shows, possibly. I watch PBS News and listen to NPR news and I think it's pretty balanced.

Regarding education - it's much broader here between 16 and 18 than in the UK I think. I dropped all maths at school at 16 and so did my DC, but the one who came here immediately after his GCSEs had to do some after that. He had to go into high school as a sophomore and do three years here because some of his UK subjects (RE and Home Economics) didn't count towards graduation, and he didn't do well in his GCSEs anyway, so he had credits to make up. He also got the chance to do some non-academic work - one of his subjects in his senior year was plumbing, which he did a course on at a nearby centre. The top two years if you're not in AP classes are less academic than they are in the UK but much broader, and of course the degrees are four years, which makes up for it, and you don't declare a major until after your first year. I think the system is far more flexible and user-friendly for a wide variety of abilities than the system I grew up with and my older two went through. My DS is dyspraxic and he got far more help and attention with that here than at either primary or secondary in the UK. His youngest, my DGS, who is 6, has many of his father's issues and is getting a huge amount of support at his elementary school in NJ.

@nixon1976 There are plenty of people like me who are not as you put it, US hate frothers. I have posted various advice about the area OP is considering, pros and cons.
Medical care if you have the best insurance and can afford co pays, etc is very good. So is private medical care in the UK. The advice everyone has given is check your medical insurance carefully.
I have also advised her to consider the impact of changes Trump is making to the affordable care act and whether that will affect her insurance.
No country is all good or all bad. And if you have a lot of money, wherever you live you can get good medical care and education.

I kind of doubt that Ohio of all places is some sort of outlier

But you have to pay for the NHS ontop of private in the UK

In US you pay for medicare whether you use it or not.

Consider work life balance especially holidays and poor employment laws, of Yemen meetings are useless because teams are too afraid to be honest in case they are let go, but lots of kind people and very helpful people in USA too. If you go too a very religious area be prepared to join in or be alienated

PP made a good point about vacation time - DU needs to push for the best vacation package he can - lots of companies will offer a more generous package then the standard two weeks a lot of people start on.

However - be aware that even with a lot of vacation time allowed the work culture means many people don’t dare take it all.

If you are used to long holidays it might come as a shock - very few people here would ever go away longer than a week.

On the other hand you’ll have access to a lot of amazing short vacation options with a huge variety of climates and activity options.

There have been KKK flyers distributed in Ohio, there are 50 extremist white hate groups, Springfield City is currently suing a Neo Nazi group after months of harassment, some months ago there was a Neo Nazi march.
There are other states where racism is a big issue as well, and others where it is not.
I would happily visit Ohio. I would not raise children there.

I actively researched this. I could double my salary but the cost of living is very high (Bay area, SF) where the good careers are. Plus taxes on everything.
Remember health insurance is expensive and only ever works if you never get sick otherwise get prepared to drain your bank account.
Finally, 1/3 of the hols and a work till you drop culture.
All in all Blighty worked outbest for quality of life and work /life balance

I’m sure lots of people would say what a great opportunity and I’m being short sighted , but I wouldn’t move a six year old and mid west?! Trump?’ X