To believe that people who repeatedly commit violent crimes should lose their freedom permanently?

[PoliteCyanViewer]

At what point do we admit that rehabilitation doesn’t work for everyone?

It's a question of money, not justice.

Yanbu tbh as I'd hate to be attacked by someone known as 'violent offender ollie'

But isn't that what they've done with those public protection orders - people deemed too violent for society are in prison indefinitely

This is an excellent question. At what point indeed.

The problem is we have a prime minister who prefers to release violent offenders back in to the public to make room for political dissidents in already overcrowded prisons.

IMO it is about protecting the public, rather than punishing someone.

Couldnt edit but to add, their being deemed too violent, is massively disputed and has made the news.

Political dissidents 🤔

I'm not sure you understand the words you're using

My very unpopular opinion is that IPPs weren’t such a bad thing.

Murderers should definitely not be rapping about their crimes.

I think rapists should be permenantly imprisoned, you can't reform rapists or paedophiles.

Released with a permanent ankle tag maybe?

Can we also take into account the amount of arrests and NFA a person has in their past before deciding to do the same thing again? I know someone arrested for sexual assault several times rape at least once NFA every single time these victims are not connected he has a specific MO that is very similar each and every time it always goes the same way report made arrest made out on bail harassment begins police not interested bail extended police have strong conversation with victims the victims get scared NFA "doesn't meet the criteria" "victim seems reluctant to proceed"

I genuinely do not think we have a working judicial system at this point

Perhaps a ball and chain.

I agree there's a distinction between violent, coercive and sexual crimes and for example shoplifting/graffiti. Personally I think we need to be more attentive to behaviours from school up with a proper log made of individual's behaviour in order to nip violent tendencies in the bud and get help before any crime is committed. It's well studied that children from overly authoritarian homes and those from abusive homes are likely to repeat and model behaviours, such as hitting, used at home. If someone is growing up with this as the norm and perhaps domestic violence, views that women are inferior etc combined with a lack of socialisation with women you can see how they would be a potential threat. We really need a more cohesive joined up system recording family attitudes, hospital visits, police complaints etc in one place for interventions.

On a connected note, I strongly suspect this would help schools no end. From my experience there are certain families in every school that are well known for having issues with little or no help given (I'm talking about proper interventions not food bank plastering over the cracks). These kids tend to be the disruptors in each year group and can be the difference between a whole group of peers being able to study and focus or turning to antisocial behaviours and addictions. We need to focus on prevention.

It is always shocking to see how the victim is shamed and background sexual history dug up even when the man has been accused before. Her mobile is taken to be analysed, not his!

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-48857520.amp

I always think of this story. This guy had over 200 convictions. He probably has done more crime but the amount he has been convicted for is maddening and yet he was released to and knocked down this woman.

I mean at what point does his right to rehabilitation and second chances trump that of a woman to walk safely down the street?

Spot on!

Go on then, I'll bite

Which political dissidents have been jailed?

in places like America life means life, you lose your freedom and stay there until you die. i honestly think that it should be that way as often life is such a small amount of years its a joke.
apart from people who go to places like Broadmoor lots of people come out and reoffend often going onto more serious crimes or more serious ways of committing their crimes.
there is an old theory that in prison people learn other crimes so come out with a worse attitude.

And in America jails are very unsafe places as a result.

If the penalty for crimes that are not murder is life, then you will find that the murder rate goes up. That has been true of everywhere that has tried this. Basically, if you are facing life in prison for the crime that you just committed, then you may as well dispose of at least one witness!

Firstly we need to have a robust rehabilitation service and support for ex offenders when they have left prison before we can decide that some people simply are too dangerous to live in the community

we are not even close to providing this service for offenders

Who is the arbiter of what words mean? We are living in a time of semantic breakdown and the definitions of words tend to, from my perspective, be seized upon and controlled by those in power. We thought we all knew what a woman was until 5 minutes ago when suddenly we were all forced to pretend it meant something entirely different.

When you say you believe those words don't mean what I'm saying they do, it's not because you struggle to understand what I'm saying. You understand perfectly well. You just disagree.

Imagine citing the American justice system as as something to aspire to ffs

It's an absolute shitshow

I don't condone Saudi's laws, but I do think a little amputation here or there may be a suitable punishment in some cases.
Actually - maybe we should deport them to Saudi on release. Let them learn the laws of the land the hard way.

Well, that's not going to happen some time soon. So in the meantime, what then? Just let them out?