Neurodivergent husband has brought me to my knees, am I unreasonable to leave him ?

[MyNextSteps]

This is my first Mumsnet post so I'm sorry but this will be a long rant. But I have really lost my way and would appreciate everyone's thoughts.

My husband and I are in our late 50s and have been married for 25 years and have 5 kids who are late teens/20s.

The marriage has always had something "not quite right", something missing which I couldn't explain. DH didn't have many girlfriends I thought he was just shy. Once married I always felt he was avoidant, pulling away, preoccupied, unavailable, never initiated sex. If I ever tried to raise it, even gently, he was irritable and defensive, saying my "constant criticism and oversensitivity" was the problem and then he'd try to run away or hang up the phone or get busy or fall asleep or get one of the kids to interrupt us to shut me down. He is also very interested in facts not feelings and tends to disconnect from conversations once he's satisfied himself of the facts.

Eventually I dragged DH to therapy wondering if he was a covert narcissist but this year he's been diagnosed with High Functioning Autism Level 1 (Aspergers) which explains everything. I feel I'm in a nightmare as our story started out as a fairytale with our beautiful kids but now I'm acceptingw nothing will change with DH.

We both had good careers but I stayed at home to raise the kids. He worked hard to provide for us all but had a long commute. We moved out to the coast and bought a rambling old house with land, did it up and we have a small holding with animals. DH seemed to avoid intimacy but I didn't question it as he was tired and working so hard and so was I. He never took me out in the evening or hired a babysitter or took me away for a few nights. We only ever went away with the kids but I was so in the tunnel of parenthood and we didn't have much money to spare so I didn't really stop to question it.

Gradually the kids grew up and then DH stopped work and I thought we would spend more time together but I gradually realized he wasn't interested. Once he stopped work and was around 24/7 and the kids were grown up, it dawned on me that he was just making excuses to avoid time with me and avoid intimacy.

We did years of marriage therapy but he could neither express his feelings at all (alexithymia) or understand mine. He just cannot hear me - all he can hear is that he's being criticized and then he becomes a professional victim. I have given him a million chances to sort himself out, so many times we have fought and he always comes back, says sorry but nothing changes. Our therapist said he wouldn't change and to leave him as he wasn't able or interested in meeting my needs.

Some of the worst family fights have been when I have been angry with DH and then he goes to the kids and portrays himself as a victim and me as the perpetrator. Then the kids (who are angry he's so weak) stand up for him. So I'm then fighting my own kids and he sits there with his head in his hands not speaking while it all kicks off between me and the kids.

So there have been times when the kids have seen me as the aggressive bad cop whilst he is good cop being their friend as he does everything for them, drives them around, gives them money and never sets rules or boundaries. Mum "wears the trousers" and keeps it all fair and accountable. Although the kids hate on me for being bad cop I notice when life gets tricky they all come running to me for guidance because I'm actually the only real parent.

Every time the whole family gets together which is now only about twice a year I work hard to cook food and make it nice but either my husband or one of the ND kids has a meltdown or shutdown which ruins the occasion and the family doesn't speak for months, I am beginning to dread get togethers.

Now his daily routine is to get up feeling anxious and then just drift around for the rest of the day, no plan, no goals, achieving not much, never gets together with friends, sometimes hangs with his family (many of them have the same issues as him) low functioning, wears same clothes for days. If I ask him to do something he'll do it eventually but then says I'm bossy and that he feels "controlled" and then makes sure the kids know it.

Some of our kids have various neurodiverse traits/issues and DH and I clashed seriously about how to raise them because as a ND himself his first instinct was to deny their problems and help them to mask whereas I as an NT wanted to get them diagnosed and get them help. DH also insisted that we don't mention anyone's diagnosis in the family (shame) so when several of the kids have huge meltdowns we are not allowed to address it with the other kids and I can see that they feel guilty and responsible when it's not their fault.

Things have come to a head in the last few months. DH was being assessed for suspected cancer. He wasn't able to process many feelings about that beyond being sure he didn't want the kids to know. I did all the worrying and supporting whilst he looked blank and numb all through Christmas. Finally this week he got the "all clear", he did express some relief but I was hugely emotional after the hospital.

The same night one of our kids rang up and shouted at me because she'd given a message to DH for me to do something but he hadn't passed it on to me so I hadn't done what she needed me to do. I was still emotional from the hospital so after she'd put the phone down I was angry with DH that he hadn't passed on the message. He denied this so we started to argue. DH then portrayed himself a a victim in front of one of our sons who got aggressive with me and goaded and shoved me (he's 6 ft) and started being verbally abusive and telling me I was crazy (he didn't know about the hospital or cancer scare at all so didn't know why I was so emotional). I said to DH "tell him to stop" but DH said "why should he stop abusing you when you abuse me ?" (professional victim).

In that moment after 25 years something snapped in me. I did something I've never done before. I calmly put together a small bag of clothes and walked out. I drove off and checked into a local B&B where I am sitting now with no idea about my next move.

DH has brought me to my knees. It's not what he does, it's what he DOESN'T do, he's just absent from our marriage. He doesn't want me to leave but he doesn't want to have a relationship with me either. He just wants a housekeeper/secretary/organizer/mother not a wife. I want to leave him but then I break up the family, we lose our lovely home and I get blamed for that by him and the kids, I lose my smallholding and animals and will have to give up my dream part time job that I have taken up in the last few years too, so essentially I lose my entire life as it is currently.

I rang DH from the B&B to discuss the issues. He said "all you do is criticize me, I'm a victim" and hung up. He didn't want to discuss the issues because he can't summarize or express his feelings. He says he can't change and I am persecuting him to do things he can't do. He then said by the way if I was moving out then he'd sell our home and small holding because he wasn't interested in it anyway he only bought it for me (first I heard about that, he was the one that insisted we buy it when I wanted to stay in the city !). I went back briefly to our home to collect clothes etc and he was just lying flat on the sofa staring into space, washing left in the machine overnight, last night's dinner still on the table untouched, curtains not drawn, animals not fed, plants not watered, post not opened etc.

AIBU to leave and break up the family and sell our family home and smallholding and rehome the animals ? Or am I overreacting and should I accept he can't change, stop asking him to and just suck it up for the sake of the family ? DH is not a bad person, we have a lot in common with our joint kids, life and animals. He worked hard to support us all, he's never been unfaithful or had addictions or been abusive (contrast I've been a drunk and screaming harridan more than once when pushed beyond human limits by rigid and goading ND family members). I am also nearly 60 and have let myself go with all the stress. Dating now fills me with horror, what are my chances anyway and my friends are having horror stories on Bumble.... I would also have to go back to full time work at 60 to support myself and the children would be hostile to a new partner as they feel responsible for their victim dad. But he is not my husband or lover and he's more friends with the kids than a father to them. He is a professional victim and he has no capacity for a marriage or partnership with me. I would be happy to live alone but I keep having the sad thought that I don't want to get to the end of my life without having experienced a true and loving partnership.

If I could find a way to stay with DH I would but I have tried to compromise a million times. I don't want to have an affair either but it seems that if I stay I would have to completely deny my own needs for love, support, intimacy, boundaries, joint parenting, joy etc and life is too short for that. Advice please.

This is abuse. He is a narcissist.

YANBU but I wonder if he is severely depressed (maybe he doesn't even know it) along with the Autism? I think you need to leave him but it genuinely seems to me that there is something more than just Autism going on here. I think he could do with antidepressants and counselling.

Op I can't write more now as I need to sleep. But just wanted to send a virtual 🫂. You sound incredibly strong. You deserve to be happy & not need to fight every day.

Unfortunately you cannot force your husband to share his diagnosis.

It is worth remembering Neurodiversity and personality disorder run along similar lines - it is possible to be neurodiverse and have a personality disorder.

Right now, you're in an un-winnable position. You leave, the kids and husband will blame you. You stay, you are at serious risk of physical and further emotional harm.

But, it does sound like things have reached a point where you can no longer stay. As hard as the change is going to be, there is no harm but only benefit to yourself by leaving. You will no longer be walking on eggshells, expecting Dh to give you something that he cannot, where becasue he is neurodivergent or because he is an arse. Nd and arsehole behaviours are not mutually exclusive.

Pp have already put forward excellent advice OP, so I'll not add to that. I suspected my exH has ADHD with a healthy dose of manipulative behaviour and was just a bully, really. When he began bullying my daughter I said enough and split up with him. He was exhausting to live with, and I had to constantly tread on eggshells. Not the same situation as you in any way, but just saying, when I reached my limit, I realised I had to do it for my mental health.

I wish you all the best.

And I would also recommend getting yourself some therapy to help you process the life you have lived. In the nicest possible way, and as. Neurodivergent adult myself, there is an element of acknowledging if you've been screeching at people like a harridan, as a coping/venting strategy, that also isn't helpful to any of you. And I say this nicely as someone who also gets enraged very easily and has to work hard not to let my frustrations at situations explode onto my partner and children.

He cannot change because he is both autistic and sounds like he has a personality disorder. He is a deeply unpleasant man. It is possible to be ND and deeply unpleasant at the same time.
Leave. Initiate a divorce as soon as you can. OP you have one life. I promise you won‘t regret getting some of it back for yourself.
Also send a copy of this post to your sons one day. They need to know your side.

If I were you, I'd spend a couple of days or a week at the B&B. Just chill for a day or two. Then without thinking about consequences, if it's even possible, how it would work etc maybe using some post-it notes, jot down:

• things you love to do
• things you want to do
• things that drag you down
• things that are important to you
• what would you like to do in lthe next five years
• what makes you happy

Don't put a lot of thought into it, just churn out a large volume of ideas and feelings.

If you have your thoughts on post-it notes it's easy to move them around and start to prioritise. Start to find the ones that resonate most with you and that would be a life you'd love to live.

Then, work out what you need to do to get there. Some things eg own a palace, are not possible but others definitely are.

At home I'd start living as if I was single. Move into a spare room and start doing your own thing. If you like your house and animals, I wouldn't give them up (unless they don't fit in with your envisioned future). I wouldn't rush to divorce but I would no longer be held back by a husband who radiates indifference. I would no longer be arsed with anything he had to do or say, he'd never get a rise out of me again. Start living the life you want to live.

Your experience is your experience, and is not universal. Suggesting it is universal is disablist and offensive.

Well done for asserting yourself and removing yourself from this toxic set-up even if it has to be short-lived for practical reasons.

Do you have other people to support you emotionally? Siblings? Friends?

@YourHappyJadeEagle has given a very useful list to get you started. The totality of your situation may seem overwhelming at first but with an ice-cold head and a steady step-by-step approach you can reinvent your life and have a much happier future.

this pp is correct

Your ND kids can also inherit personality traits of narcissism. Some of your kids might be NT?

Time to LEAVE. You have been his mother, not a wife,

Hmmm. If you are that unhappy and dislike your life so much then end your marriage, but your post has made me uneasy in several places.

You really do seem to like labelling people. I dislike your repeated description of him as "professional victim". Perhaps your husband really is ND but I don’t like the way some people on MN throw around labels like ND or "narcissistic" so easily. We all have differing personalities and I don’t think labels are always useful.

A therapist you were both seeing told you to leave him? Highly … unusual.

You talk a lot about his inability to show feelings, contrasting with your own relief at the outcome of his cancer scare, but then somehow blame him for being so upset and overwhelmed by you leaving that he didn’t do the washing up or open the post. People not being demonstrative or articulate about their feelings doesn’t mean they don’t have any.

But if you dislike him and your current life as much as you seem to, you should leave.

Absolutely leave. Why would you stay? Your kids are grown up, you still have life left, do you want to be miserable all your life? And yes, tell the kids. I can't believe you've enabled his secrecy all this time.

You say he hasn’t been abusive but he really has. He’s deliberately used your own children against you. He has repeatedly dragged the children into your conflicts which is a despicable tactic.

You need to leave him OP.

Why do you say you would have to give up your part time job?

@MyNextSteps Tell the children. I too like the poster I quoted could not reed all your post Too distressing. I lived like this for 6 years. Diagnosed ADHD&Autism H.
He plays the professional victim to my 2&4 year old especially to my 4yr old.

unlike you I make sure to explain to my d in language she can understand what exactly the reality is. Hard talk but I will not have my children become victims of his behaviour and manipulation.

we no longer live together.

You said they’re angry that’s he’s weak - from what you’ve written they seem to direct all their anger at you.

You said your husband wasn’t abusive - he clearly is, as are some of your children. From what you’ve said they don’t sound like they like you very much and neither does your husband. How long has it been this way?

You say you don’t want to break up your family - but you only get together twice a year and it seems like you are now an outsider and your husband has conditioned your kids to support him and view you as the enemy even tho you are the one doing all the hard work with supporting them all (which they will miss) and keeping the family together.

You need to point out some home truths to your kids for a start. It sounds like your husband has no difficulty slagging you off to them and highlighting all your faults, have you told them what the therapist said? Surely they weren’t bowled over by his treatment of you and were critical of his behaviour?

It’s an unenviable position to be in but you can’t stay living with this shit of a man. You’ll end up snapping and killing him. Or yourself. You should arrange for your animals to be looked after in your absence and have some time away from him. If your children don’t know about the cancer scare prepare yourself for him telling them and elevating himself to even higher victimhood, despite being cancer free.

You need to start nurturing support among your children and explain your position. They won’t want their parents to split up but you’ve got to highlight your own victimhood in all this and the impact it is having on your mental (and probably physical) health. You mentioned becoming a screaming harridan, he’s changed you into this person bc you are finding it impossible to cope with his behaviour. He has essentially turned your own kids against you and shown you no real affection for the entirety of your marriage.

Get therapy, get advice and try to rebuild the bonds with your children. It might be that you have to do this before walking out as they will instinctively rush to the side of the parent who has been ‘left’, but if you are feeling close to the edge then you need to remove yourself from the situation asap, if only for some respite.

Good luck 💐 I hope it works out for you x

Take all the time you need in the b&b to give yourself clarity, there's no point in going back to a miserable unhappy life with him. Be very kind to yourself.

It is your turn to have a life now. You aren't breaking up the family, your children are nearly all adults, they don't have the right to abuse you.
I think you should write a letter to the children, devoid of emotion, and explain why you are doing what you are doing. It is unfair for you to shoulder the blame for his behaviour.

He’s using his ND as an excuse for every little shitty behaviour.

You’ve done more than your fair share for this marriage and this family. I’m okay with giving people second chance, but he’s going way past that. Go enjoy the rest of your life without him weighing you down.

Leaving would be perfectly reasonable and entirely justified. You both deserve to be happy. However, your account of things pins all the blame on him including for things like not being outwardly emotional about the cancer scare. That is unreasonable. I wonder if you are grieving what could have been, particularly given the recent asd diagnosis which may have released emotions for you. It might be worth making a list of positive things he has done (I presume he didn't want to do therapy or get the diagnosis) and the negative things you have done. It won't be all his fault and he may genuinely feel that you are horrible towards him, a victim. But to be frank, it sounds like leaving is the right thing to do.

This is all wrong. It is entirely to do with his autism, in fact it is glaring how much so.

I don't know OP, my ex was autistic and completely unable to adjust to having to sometimes prioritise his spouse. He just couldn't do it and everything was an attack on him to which he'd respond defensively and often meltdown. He's still the same as my ex but sends his family to bat for him now. My mental health was destroyed and has never really recovered. The thing that stood out to me most is your son becoming aggressive and shoving you. Your husband is actually making you physically unsafe with his inability and rigidity and for that reason alone I think you have to leave him.

Why will you need to support the children they are adults arnt they? They have repeatedly chosen their father and his poor behaviour over you and your support stop being a doormat let them deal with consequences because it sounds like none of them ever have

My family was toxic growing up but as soon as I stepped into the world I realised that not all families are like that unless your children lived in a box they know this behaviour is wrong

This is all so toxic. He sounds impossible to live with, but all these years of arguing in front of the kids, to the point where the kids even get involved? This definitely hasn't helped matters.

Also, I have absolutely no idea quite how unreasonable each of you is, but your kids are now adults, by which point they've usually fully seen through the good cop/bad cop thing, and understand that the stricter parent is (often) the one who's been doing all the work. If your kids are still resentful towards you as adults, maybe your own behaviour has been more harmful than you've admitted to yourself.

I'd also suggest that if your kids behaviour is more challenging now as adults who don't live at home than it was as kids (who were living with 5 siblings close in age) then it's probably not the ND that's the issue, it's the whole toxic situation. That said, of course your son should never put his hands on you.

This isn't happy or healthy for anyone involved.

First of all I wouldn’t even think about dating. You need time to recover and find out who you are now, when you’re not in any family role. You would also be very vulnerable right now to chancers and users (not to mention abusers). Learn to enjoy your own space and company- I am confident that living alone will be bliss for you.

Second, would it be possible to live with him but not in the wife role- leave him but not leave? Just disengage completely. I don’t know how big your place is but could you share it, or have a small dwelling in the garden/on the land that you could live in so that you can still enjoy the small-holding and the part time job and so on? This might be pie in the sky of course. Would he accept you disengaging and let you be? If not, of course it isn’t an option. And you also need to be safe. You weren’t safe in that situation you walked out from.

Third, your children treat you really badly! I don’t know how I would start to address that. Your son thinks it is ok to start pushing you around!? That’s common assault, the police would come out for your son assaulting you. Just to make clear how serious that is! And your daughter screams at you. I’m so sad about this. I hope someone else can suggest a way forward with them.

Fourth, if you have to live elsewhere, start by seeing what would be available for you financially from the marriage. You are entitled to half of everything including old age provision, so see a solicitor and start there.

Good luck. YANBU.

Leave, but why jump straight to having to find a new partner? You can be happy on your own. Guess your choice to stay and be miserable, or make the most of your remaining years. My friend was diagnosed with terminal cancer 2wks ago and she’s a lot younger than you. We get one life, why life is being so miserable? I couldn’t live with someone like him.