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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think she was a bit rude/not empathetic?

152 replies

UndertheCedartree · 14/01/2025 19:49

I can't quite put my finger on it so said rude/not empathetic but could be something else.

I had a first appointment with a therapist today. Been in this position many times and know the first appointment is just an introduction/talk about practicalities/see if we can work together - it doesn't always work out which I find hard as well as I struggle with new people.

So I asked my support worker (PA) to come with me to this appointment. She has supported clients with therapy many times before so it was no problem.

Therapist comes into waiting room and calls me by the wrong first name...I corrected her and introduced her to my support worker. She then addressed the support worker and told her 'stay here, I'll take her in'. It made me feel uncomfortable that she didn't speak to me and made me feel like an object with 'I'll take her in'. So I said 'I would like SW to come in with me.' Therapist ummed and ahhed over it. I told her I was within my rights to have my SW with me. Eventually she let us leave the waiting room and go into a private room. There she called me by the same incorrect name and when I corrected her just told me she sees a lot of people.

She then proceeds to talk to my SW about why she shouldn't be there. That therapy isn't a 3 way thing. Questions the dynamic between us etc. My SW explains her role to the therapist and that I'd asked her for support in this sutation and that it was a situation she was very familiar with. I make some comments but the therapist ignores me in favour of talking to my SW!

I try to explain to the therapist why I have asked for support for this session and explain going forwards I will mainly seek support from her after our sessions and possibly for her to support me to go to the session and be with me for 5 minutes at the beginning until I start to feel comfortable with the therapist. I may therefore ask her to wait for me in reception for a couple of sessions. My SW asked if we could agree that if I wanted her with me for 5 minutes at the beginning of the next session that, that was ok (to try to prevent such an awkward start next time.) She wouldn't agree to this.

She spoke in so much jargon. She didn't have to think about something she had to 'have a thought.' She was constantly 'curious' about things. I was 'holding on' to the idea of therapy = I wanted therapy. Just so much it was hard to understand her. I explained to her how I felt and she just kept asking again and again and I had to repeat myself 3 times. She then left a massive pause and asked if I felt sad...which was not what I had said at all! She didn't understand my use of 'in the community' (I.e not in hospital) when that is a completey normal turn of phrase!

She was then 'curious' as to how I could cope with therapy if my SW was in the waiting room. I just replied the same as anyone. And then I asked what would happen if at the end of the timescale she had given me we hadn't finished the work necessary and her reply was we would have to 'have a thought' about it.

It felt like she was highly anxious. She obviously had a problem with me having my SW with me, but if she hadn't been with me I would have walked out because tbh the therapist was really pissing me off!

This is part rant and part - do you think that this sounded a bit 'off'?I want to go into the next session knowing how to make this work better and how to deal with these kind of difficult situations.

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 14/01/2025 21:21

DollydaydreamTheThird · 14/01/2025 21:04

screaming abdabz is right, It really isn't a three way thing. Therapy is a relationship between two people and for therapy to be successful there has to be a good relationship. I think it would be awkward as hell to have a support worker in there as well. Definitely not the norm. I think you need to be upfront with the next therapist and ask if they are happy to do therapy in this way. I would be inclined to say that not many would agree to this. How can you get to the deepest parts of your soul with someone in the room who you see every day I presume? Things come up in therapy that you have never told another living person. I would seriously consider this OP. Why do you need your SW there??

Show quote history

It very much is the norm, actually. Never come across it being an issue as the therapists on this thread have said too.

Beside the point at the first meeting there is no relationship. It is admin basically. If a therapist cannot even cope with that it does throw doubt on their ability to cope with providing beneficial therapy, imho.

I certainly am not getting to the deepest parts of my soul in the first 6-9 months let alone the initial meeting!!

No, I see mu SW/PA once or twice a week.

I'm very aware what happens in therapy. And I think I've explained as have many others also explained how a support worker is very useful when going into a very difficult situation and exactly what they are there for!!

OP posts:
AusMumhere · 14/01/2025 21:23

ApocalypseMiaow · 14/01/2025 20:54

The ableism on this thread is appalling. How dare these people think it's okay to impose their exclusionary attitude on you. I am a therapist and my job is to make my clients comfortable, feel safe and be able to trust me so I can help them. I totally agree that this therapist doesn't like the accountability. Stand your ground or speak to Pals. Make a complaint if you have to. You are absolutely not the problem here, I'm so sorry this person made you feel like that.

100% agree

Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 14/01/2025 21:23

Grapesandcheseseplease · 14/01/2025 21:08

I’ve had NHS therapy and you are within your rights to ask for a different therapist, I did when I felt it wasn’t a good fit and I wouldn’t be able to be honest and open with the person. Speak to the manager, the one I dealt with was very understanding.
The name thing is rude, mistakes happen but “I see so many people” is just dismissive. I hope you get to see someone who makes you feel heard and understood. The right therapist can be life changing.

Edited

Thank you 😊

OP posts:
ThinWomansBrain · 14/01/2025 21:23

surely it would have been courteous to have let the therapist know is advance that you planned to attend with a support worker?
She would then be able to assess the situation, decide whether she felt comfortable with it and either decline the booking or be prepared for it.

maybe try doing that with your next therapist.

gettingolderbutcooler · 14/01/2025 21:23

I guess if you've been through this 'many times' as you say, then perhaps you will always be finding a reason not to take to your therapist.

AusMumhere · 14/01/2025 21:25

gettingolderbutcooler · 14/01/2025 21:23

I guess if you've been through this 'many times' as you say, then perhaps you will always be finding a reason not to take to your therapist.

Harsh

Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 14/01/2025 21:26

DollydaydreamTheThird · 14/01/2025 21:17

'Third party relationships can be challenging for therapy, and the
complexity alongside safeguarding, autonomy, ‘vulnerable adult’ status
(and for some, the Mental Capacity Act 2005) means it is advisable to seek
additional specialist supervisory and legal support.'
From the BACP policy on working with disability not chat GPT.
She needs to ask upfront if the therapist is happy to do it this way.

Show quote history

Well, the introductory meeting would have been the time to have that discussion, wouldn't it? If she felt she was unable to cope with the situation she could have said rather than just treating me like an object to argue over!

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 14/01/2025 21:28

WidgetDigit2022 · 14/01/2025 21:19

This is discrimination. Would you say the same to someone with learning disabilities? Do you think therapy should only be accessed by people with no support needs!?

Lots of people with additional needs, whether that’s health, learning or mental health need support workers. That shouldn’t mean they can’t use a therapist!

Show quote history

I did say this to the therapist. No response as she was too busy wanting to grill the SW.

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 14/01/2025 21:32

Telepathickitty · 14/01/2025 21:19

I would be tempted to speak to the service manager to see if there's a better fit for you. Approach it calmly and kindly and as you have here

I had a course of about 10 sessions with a psychologist I really didn't gel with and I got very little out of it due to her abrasive nature and instance on banging on about something that really wasn't an issue - I'd explained that I've boycotted Tesco due to poor service and she dedicated 3 whole sessions to setting goals about why I can't go to Tesco. She wouldn't believe that I can, that I'm choosing not to and I'm within my rights to spend my money where the service is better. I couldn't have been any clearer but she invented a whole phobia about it in her mind and set me homework to go and buy a banana at Tesco. In the end I lied to get her off my back. At the end of the sessions she hovered over me whilst I completed the anxiety and depression scales and tried to persuade me to give better scores.

When I asked my psychiatrist to refer me for more psychology she said she couldn't because I'd already had a course. In retrospect the relationship with the psychologist was pretty rocky from the start, I never felt comfy with her and she seemed to misunderstand my issues despite me explaining as clearly as I could. I really wish I'd asked to change because I'd waited years and now I've lost that chance.

In the end I opted for private counselling which is cheaper than private psychology. It doesn't do what the psychology sessions should have, but I've got a really trusting relationship with my counsellor and have made a lot of progress as a result. Way more than I did with the psychologist.

It might also be worth speaking to the service manager about your needs and wish to have your SW with you for the first session and 5 minutes settling time in the next few until you're comfy. That isn't a bonkers request and he/she can hopefully pair you with a therapist who understands your needs.

Thank you for your response.

I'm sorry to hear of the difficult relationship and how it meant you 'missed your chance.' But great you have an understanding counsellor now.

The situation has just gone round and round in my head, making me feel bad and guilty. And I really appreciate people letting me know it is ok to speak up!

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 14/01/2025 21:35

ThinWomansBrain · 14/01/2025 21:23

surely it would have been courteous to have let the therapist know is advance that you planned to attend with a support worker?
She would then be able to assess the situation, decide whether she felt comfortable with it and either decline the booking or be prepared for it.

maybe try doing that with your next therapist.

In all honesty it's such a normal thing (if you work with mental health, surely you know many of these people have support needs?!) that I had no idea I had to ask permission. It's certainly never been like that before.

Surely if that is the case she could have just explained that in a calm professional manner in private?

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 14/01/2025 21:40

gettingolderbutcooler · 14/01/2025 21:23

I guess if you've been through this 'many times' as you say, then perhaps you will always be finding a reason not to take to your therapist.

I think you've misunderstood. I've never not 'taken' to one before although some have been better than others.

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 14/01/2025 21:40

AusMumhere · 14/01/2025 21:25

Harsh

Show quote history

Harsh and untrue! 😂

OP posts:
BookLovingNorthLondoner · 14/01/2025 22:09

I’m a therapist and have never had someone bring a third party into an intro session. I don’t know anyone else who has experienced this but from the replies on this thread saying that it is quite common, this could be because I work privately and/or because of my client base. I admit I might be surprised if someone did so without any notice. So much of my training focused on the importance of the therapeutic relationship - one-to-one and providing a space where someone can talk without judgement or fear of consequences. However, it is my job to explain this and work with the client to meet their needs as best as possible. It’s a balancing act between enabling them to attend and delivering a good standard of service as the conditions for one might hinder the other.

It sounds like the therapist could have come from a similar background but was unable to think on her feet and adapt to the situation. Having spoken to some nhs therapists their caseload can be huge, giving little time for reflection between clients or a chance to reground after particularly heavy sessions. They’re human and sometime the conditions they work under don’t account for this. This doesn’t excuse her rudeness of using the incorrect name and not speaking directly to you but maybe goes some way towards explaining it.

I really hope you find someone that you feel comfortable with. It’s so, so important. Don’t be afraid to ask for someone else and explain why you’re doing so. The therapist should welcome the chance for reflection and growth. (I’m now reflecting on my possible over-use of being curious!)

Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 14/01/2025 22:24

BookLovingNorthLondoner · 14/01/2025 22:09

I’m a therapist and have never had someone bring a third party into an intro session. I don’t know anyone else who has experienced this but from the replies on this thread saying that it is quite common, this could be because I work privately and/or because of my client base. I admit I might be surprised if someone did so without any notice. So much of my training focused on the importance of the therapeutic relationship - one-to-one and providing a space where someone can talk without judgement or fear of consequences. However, it is my job to explain this and work with the client to meet their needs as best as possible. It’s a balancing act between enabling them to attend and delivering a good standard of service as the conditions for one might hinder the other.

It sounds like the therapist could have come from a similar background but was unable to think on her feet and adapt to the situation. Having spoken to some nhs therapists their caseload can be huge, giving little time for reflection between clients or a chance to reground after particularly heavy sessions. They’re human and sometime the conditions they work under don’t account for this. This doesn’t excuse her rudeness of using the incorrect name and not speaking directly to you but maybe goes some way towards explaining it.

I really hope you find someone that you feel comfortable with. It’s so, so important. Don’t be afraid to ask for someone else and explain why you’re doing so. The therapist should welcome the chance for reflection and growth. (I’m now reflecting on my possible over-use of being curious!)

Thank you for your reply. It is maybe the difference between private and NHS.

I understand where you are coming from. And indeed I have worked in the NHS and hope to go back so am used to a high workload but in the case of getting a name wrong I would genuinely apologise rather than make an excuse. However, I do understand she is only human so want to give her another chance. I am feeling pretty panicky about it, though.

OP posts:
Coolasfeck · 14/01/2025 22:29

The therapist is winding me up and I’ve never met her! Massive pauses, ‘having thoughts’ and ‘curious’ every five minutes would do my head in. I wouldn’t be able to go back.

Sounds like she’s only just qualified and is playing the role of ‘serious therapist’.

Did she go ‘hmmm’ a lot, tilt her head to the side and do a lot of nodding to show she’s ‘listening’? I bet she did! Arggh so annoying!

byteme1011 · 14/01/2025 22:30

I'm also wondering if the therapist didn't want your SW in the room as she could advocate for you - I really don't like that she couldn't even remember your name, how on earth was she planning to build rapport with you?

Jobsharenightmare · 14/01/2025 22:31

It isn't about private versus NHS. It is about context. It's not uncommon in rehab services, CAMHS, family therapy services, brain injury services, older adult services etc to work with or alongside carers, SW and PAs as part of the process. I'm talking about clinical psychologists though who are doctoral level trained professionals.

CorduroySituation · 14/01/2025 22:38

FOJN · 14/01/2025 20:00

You do not need other people to validate your experience with the therapist. You felt it was awkward and she was not listening to you. On that basis you should find another therapist.

Agree.

You're not happy and don't gel with the therapist on first meeting - NEXT! It won't get better so don't waste your time, move on.

Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 14/01/2025 22:40

Coolasfeck · 14/01/2025 22:29

The therapist is winding me up and I’ve never met her! Massive pauses, ‘having thoughts’ and ‘curious’ every five minutes would do my head in. I wouldn’t be able to go back.

Sounds like she’s only just qualified and is playing the role of ‘serious therapist’.

Did she go ‘hmmm’ a lot, tilt her head to the side and do a lot of nodding to show she’s ‘listening’? I bet she did! Arggh so annoying!

Oh I'm glad it's not just me! It was just so insincere. It was like she was just repeating phrases from her course book.

But honestly all these things she had to 'have a thought' about. It was like she had to make an appointment with herself before she would allow herself to 'have a thought'! 😂

OP posts:
CorduroySituation · 14/01/2025 22:41

Ah, have now read on to see it's NHS and not changeable.

I think you need to say how you felt in that first session and see how she responds.

Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 14/01/2025 22:43

byteme1011 · 14/01/2025 22:30

I'm also wondering if the therapist didn't want your SW in the room as she could advocate for you - I really don't like that she couldn't even remember your name, how on earth was she planning to build rapport with you?

If she had genuinely apologised I would have let it go. But it seemed everything was an inconvenience - trying to remember my name, that I had support needs, that she had to get an extra chair! Oh dear, I think she was as pissed off with me as I was with her!

OP posts:
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IDontHateRainbows · 15/01/2025 06:29

Greywarden · 14/01/2025 20:05

I'm a therapist in the NHS.

What you describe sounds pretty bad. It sounds like this therapist dehumanised you by talking as though you were not there; did not listen to you well; did not explain herself to you well.

(I do, however, sometimes tell my clients that I'm curious to know XYZ... your post has made me think I need to teach myself to drop this phrase!)

I suppose it is possible that this therapist was just a bit thrown by your SW being there. I've certainly known people come for therapy and try to insist on family members or other professionals being with them even when this is not going to be a good idea for their therapy longer-term... although when this happens I still usually accept it for the first session or so as the client needs the chance to feel comfortable. I've also known family members not want my client to be free to speak to me privately and try to make sessions all about their agenda. It is possible your new therapist was worried about one of these things happening and that this was why they acted strangely.

It is also possible, as you say yourself, that she was anxious. Maybe she will turn out to have a lot to offer.

It was not a promising start though and I think you are completely right to have concerns. If you were my client, I'd love you to have the confidence to tell me in our next session that I made you feel uncomfortable last time and what you'd prefer me to do differently next time. However, I don't get the impression that your therapist has built the trust with you that would help you to feel comfortable enough to say something like that. I also appreciate that the power dynamic when you need support can make it very hard to speak out like that (I have also been a mental health patient and remember well not feeling comfortable and confident enough to be honest with one of my own therapists).

Edited

Why should you drop the phrase 'I'm curious to know' on the basis thar OP doesn't like it? I think it's a perfectly fine way to speak.